Anand wants to know how you feel about Apple...

[nowayout99]

You know, I see this mentioned a lot, followed by anecdotal evidence. Has there ever been any kind of article or long-term study done to show the longevity of Mac hardware over PC? I mean, Macs and PCs use a lot of the same hardware and I/O.

 

[Barnaby W. Füi]

Originally posted by: DWW

Originally posted by: DaveSimmons

Originally posted by: BingBongWongFooey
I would like to have a mac for music-related stuff; Linux is pretty worthless for creating music.

My brother is an amateur electronic musician (influenced by old-school people like Tangerine Dream) and he switched last year from Mac to PC for his sequencing, recording and software synths. I know zero about it, but apparently GigaStudio for the PC is sweet.

He's also a graphic artist and web designer, and this year he's switched from a G4 mac to a P4 3.2 GHz system for work. He found OSX different enough from OS9 (in annoying ways) that he preferred Windows XP and a P4 for his end-of-year upgrade instead of a G5 system and OSX.

Damn
And to think web design for me consisted of my Tandy 486 SX 25 MHz back in 1994 (3200 / 25 = 128 times more CPU power not including performance enhancements, new instructions, faster bus etc). Kids these days

Web design doesn't take much horsepower.

 

[OverVolt]

Too expensive, my PC does everything i want it to do so why would i wanna pay more for a machine that less of a value (to me atleast)? I never have any problems with spyware/viruses/hackers. My Router does the firewall scene, norton scans overnight, and i run ad-aware once a month, whats the big deal?

 

[Go3iverson]

My old school had a great occurance. They got blaster that was brought in on a Frosh laptop which spread through the campus very fast. The dorm where it started, every PC that was on the network during that time managed to get Blasted, besides for the 19 Macs in that building. A cool 900+ instances of Blaster and SoBig within a week...not too bad.

 

[arod]

Originally posted by: Go3iverson
My old school had a great occurance. They got blaster that was brought in on a Frosh laptop which spread through the campus very fast. The dorm where it started, every PC that was on the network during that time managed to get Blasted, besides for the 19 Macs in that building. A cool 900+ instances of Blaster and SoBig within a week...not too bad.

Why write viruses for that small of a percentage? when more people have macs there will be viruses for them as well, dont think for a second that they are immune from viruses, its that they control such a small percentage nobody cares about them.

 

[Go3iverson]

I didn't say they were immune, did I?

That's fine, let people think the Mac community and Open Source community is insignificant. Afterall, neither one did anything to benefit computing as a whole, right? :/

 

[arod]

Originally posted by: Go3iverson
I didn't say they were immune, did I?

That's fine, let people think the Mac community and Open Source community is insignificant. Afterall, neither one did anything to benefit computing as a whole, right? :/

You post had that apple Im better than you feel to it, which is fine I dont get hit by viruses and nobody at your school would have either if they did their updates, the fix was posted a month before the outbreak began and that many people still didnt have their computers patched. Im not saying macs are bad, quite the contraty (osx is very nice) but the day will come when people start to care about writing mac viruses and will do alot more damage to things than blaster ever did, due to the fact that (IMO) people think theyre safe on a mac.

 

[Cerb]

The low-end hardware is a rip.
The high-end G5 machines aren't bad at all...but I don't see too many games out there for them.
They suck for doing bad benchmarking for their servers (no other set of benchmarks has the 2GHz Opterons losing to 2.8GHz Xeons in anything but compressed fileserving...coming even, sure, but they must have crippled those e325 boxes).

 

[Cerb]

Originally posted by: Go3iverson
Its funny when people call Apple computing for dummies. According to winsupersite, Windows is on the level of the masses and OS X is for the technical elite. :-/

...even Linux isn't for the elite anymore, so...sorry for those guys. Are they the same ones that claimed their G4 macs could keep up with PCs?

 

[Cerb]

Originally posted by: Naustica

Originally posted by: Duvie
[

The software does great things and I am not harping on the OS X the fact is it s far less complicated then saying making a DVD of home movies on a PC in my opinion...I can just see my mom using Pinnacle studio 8...pure disaster...yet this ditz down the street makes them effortlessly and can't even tell me specs on her system or what she is actually doing in the software...Just amazing.....

This is probably the greatest compliment you can give Apple. Their stuff works and you don't have to fiddle around and be expert tech geek to use your computer and be productive. Average Joe doesn't have the time or the desire to tinker with their computer to make it work. The fact that your ditzy neighbor down the street can effortlessly create with her Mac without knowing any technical details proves Apple got it right. It has been goal of PC makers and the entire hardware and software industry to someday create computers good enough and so easy to use that anyone can use it. By your account Apple has achieve this "Holy Grail" of computing.[/quote]
However, it is because of this that we geek types will never like them. Most of us can't think like that...if you don't know what's going on, how the hell can you use it? The other thing is that without that understanding, you cannot go beyond the most basic uses of any software or hardware.
Edit: Oh, and the single-button mouse...why!? That sort of thing is why VCRs are so hard. If they added 3 buttons (up, down, enter) on VCR remotes, they'd be SO easy to program...kinda like five on most other mice (left, right, wheelup, wheeldown, wheelbutton), and soon to be seven or more with tiltwheels.

 

[Cerb]

Originally posted by: rainypickles
some humor http://www.flogged.net/media/video/whymacssuck.wmv

i like the comparison of old macs with win98. however, i STILL think win98 ran better than the old mac OSes. i seriously pulled hairs out with macs.

Every now and then I have to work on a 9x box.
I can almost believe that Win98 wasn't really that bad...until I use one again. Sorry, but if Win98 ran better than OS9, I can't see how anybody used the things.
(also note, I didn't buy marketting BS about '98 being better for games and multimedia, either, and could pit my NT4 box against any comparable '98 box and laugh when my scores where the same and my PC hadn't rebooted in the last month...except in summer, because Voodoo2 cards w/o heatsinks couldn't game in GA summers)

 

[Cerb]

Originally posted by: arod

Originally posted by: Go3iverson
My old school had a great occurance. They got blaster that was brought in on a Frosh laptop which spread through the campus very fast. The dorm where it started, every PC that was on the network during that time managed to get Blasted, besides for the 19 Macs in that building. A cool 900+ instances of Blaster and SoBig within a week...not too bad.

Why write viruses for that small of a percentage? when more people have macs there will be viruses for them as well, dont think for a second that they are immune from viruses, its that they control such a small percentage nobody cares about them.

Why run w/o a Firewall? I didn't patch my PC for Blaster until a couple of weeks ago .

 

[Cerb]

Originally posted by: Go3iverson
I didn't say they were immune, did I?

That's fine, let people think the Mac community and Open Source community is insignificant. Afterall, neither one did anything to benefit computing as a whole, right? :/

Not if you ask SCO or M$. Now, IBM, Sun and Novell have very different opinions...

 

[BFG10K]

Variety is the spice of life.

Getting ripped off and lied to doesn't spice up anyone's life.

why is it junk?

That's beyond the scope of this thread.

my roommate has a powerbook and a dual G4, both work just fine...

A PC works just fine too...at one third the cost, double the speed and ten times the amount of hardware and software.

 

[Overkast]

Originally posted by: arod

Originally posted by: Go3iverson
I didn't say they were immune, did I?

That's fine, let people think the Mac community and Open Source community is insignificant. Afterall, neither one did anything to benefit computing as a whole, right? :/

You post had that apple Im better than you feel to it, which is fine I dont get hit by viruses and nobody at your school would have either if they did their updates, the fix was posted a month before the outbreak began and that many people still didnt have their computers patched. Im not saying macs are bad, quite the contraty (osx is very nice) but the day will come when people start to care about writing mac viruses and will do alot more damage to things than blaster ever did, due to the fact that (IMO) people think theyre safe on a mac.

I hear ya Arod. And even tho I'm an avid Mac user (actually, I'm an avid PC user as well), I must say that day will come indeed. I'm also one of the few Mac users that NEVER use that "we don't get viruses" crap as an excuse because I know fate will take it's toll one day... and those people will end up eating their words.

I usually like to stay as neutral as possible in these discussions... but I just can't stand it when PC users stomp all over Macs like they're riding their high horses around. I work in the Art Department of a Civil Engineering company... there's only 2 Macs in the entire company of 100+ employees. So you can just imagine the flak I get from the MIS department when one of our machines isn't working perfectly. You should hear the Mac-trashing that comes out of their mouths.

So as it turns out, my MIS Department ultimately ends up living in their close-minded little PC world and I have to be my own Goddamn tech-support. And guess what? I do a damn good job at it too. I just can't stand these PC users who sling mud when they're really the stupid ones out there.

 

[Overkast]

Originally posted by: addragyn
"My neighbor down the street does things my more computer savvy wife can't do and yet when you talk to here she doesn't know squat about what she is doing or what happened to get to the finished point....Just a few clicks she says and it is done. Five minutes more talking to her and I am convinced turning on the power is the most complexed thing she understands...."

This is a bad thing how?? I'm glad we can all drive cars w/o having a lift in the garage. You think everybody would be talking on cell phones if they had to understand how they operated? Specialization is the future and the future is now. The computer as you apparently know and love it is on the way out.

By the way...addragyn... I couldn't agree more. Well said.

 

[addragyn]

The problem with what you are seeing, is that Apple determines what you get not the user. The custimization is gone..

What!? You can theme, edit plists, install bunches of software. None of this is controlled or limited by Apple. It's not a frickin' PS2. You can even download the source for the OS. Or run Linux. Or etc. There may be a limitation here but it's not the machine. Honestly it sounds like you just don't know the system. If you venture out your window a little *nix never hurt anybody. Especially if you're into computers. The latest tweak to make the rounds is adjusting maxvnodes.

I have a Mac w/ OSX on my desk at work. The ONLY time I turn to it is if I have to find a location of a file. Because other than that, it's slower, louder, and takes longer to get the same things done as the PC.

So you have a crappy Mac and a better PC. Somebody somwhere has a crappy PC. And I like hot dogs form the cart on K St. 1 is not a large enough set to make any sort of conclusion.

***

Why write viruses for that small of a percentage? when more people have macs there will be viruses for them as well, dont think for a second that they are immune from viruses, its that they control such a small percentage nobody cares about them.

You're right the day may come, but it hasn't. On other platforms viruses and worms are a very real problem now with very real costs.
Computer virus attacks cost global businesses an estimated US$55 billion in damages in 2003. Companies lost roughly US$20 billion to US$30 billion in 2002 from the virus attacks, up from about US$13 billion in 2001, according to various industry estimates. webadvantage.net
There are signifigant differences in how your OS(Windows I presume) is architected versus OS X. With all the pimple face nerds living in their parents basement who hate Apple surely one could've cracked this nut. It's also nice that the Outlook, IE, and DirectX problems simply aren't an issue on OS X. Have you heard of WinNuke or Back Orifice or more recently Blaster, SoBig or Begal. This list goes on and in the words of Zep, "the song remains the same". Having worked with the stuff I can tell you it gets old quick.

Not that you aren't right about being a smaller target. But hey it's the same result. This drove the Army to move their site from NT to MacOS in '99, per direction of the CIO of the Army. Here's a history of www.army.mil. The domain was moved over to OS X in May of '03.

Read: The Short Life & Hard Times of a Linux Virus

***

Getting ripped off and lied to doesn't spice up anyone's life.

That's debatable.

You haven't even begun to prove how Apple/Sun/IBM/Dell/MS, or anyone, does this.

That's beyond the scope of this thread.

IOW you're talking shit.

A PC works just fine too...at one third the cost, double the speed and ten times the amount of hardware and software.

It must be frustrating knowing what's best for everybody but not actually being able to make them do it.

 

[NesuD]

Not in the least bit interested in Apple. Have yet to see a compelling benefit or feature that justifies the shortcomings.

 

[SSibalNom]

im thinking of getting one next week, im thinking a lowend ibook would be nice for just typing and web at school

 

[ElFenix]

if the exam software we have to use for school ran on macs i would have bought a 12" powerbook

 

[Tom]

If I could get an Apple comparable to a Dell 2400 for $400 I'd get one.

 

[addragyn]

Originally posted by: ElFenix
if the exam software we have to use for school ran on macs i would have bought a 12" powerbook

The best of both worlds is having your fast PC and Apple laptop.

Microsoft's RDC (Remote Desktop Client) allows a remote GUI connection to your 2k or XP box from a Mac. It's fast & free.

RDC Review

 

[NFactor]

If i had enough money for a Mac I would buy a vapo-chilled Athlon FX. Now THAT would show it the meaning of speed.

 

[Dug]

Quote

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The problem with what you are seeing, is that Apple determines what you get not the user. The custimization is gone..
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What!? You can theme, edit plists, install bunches of software. None of this is controlled or limited by Apple. It's not a frickin' PS2. You can even download the source for the OS. Or run Linux. Or etc. There may be a limitation here but it's not the machine. Honestly it sounds like you just don't know the system. If you venture out your window a little *nix never hurt anybody. Especially if you're into computers. The latest tweak to make the rounds is adjusting maxvnodes.

Nothing you mentioned is what I am talking about.
You have a limited selection of hardware that will work with Mac's.
You have a limited software selection.
You have a limited add on/ tweak software.

For instance-
You can't just download the dvd authoring software of your choice, run incredible imaging software like ffdshow, run custom resolutions for any display out there including projectors, run a full on custimizable media center, burn any file out there, add a high end sound card, etc. That's just a small list in one category. Just look at how much you can download from zdnet. Half of this isn't a limitation of the computer, but the fact that people aren't writing a lot for the Mac, hardware vendors aren't stretching their legs to add a lot of extra functionality in their drivers. They want to keep things simple. If I want to venture out of my window and run any version of linux, I can on my PC. If I want to change my case, I can. If I want to add a nice raptor raid array, I can. Throw my stuff into a sff pc, I can. Buy a $45 cpu that can o/c to 3Ghz speeds, I can. The only thing I like about OSX is Exposé, which I'm sure if I looked hard enough I could find the equivelant for the PC. And don't even get me started with the ohh I gotta buy 10 and then ohh I gotta buy 10.2 oh wait, Apple wants me to pay for 10.3......mmmm... I can't wait till I have to pay for 10.4.

 

[PliotronX]

Only if I could build one.