Anand's 1907,2007 reviews

[xtknight]

LCD backlights do have to warm up but I think it happens rather fast (5 minutes maybe?) I'm really not sure though. BeHardware had an article on this.

 

[VinDSL]

Originally posted by: xtknight
LCD backlights do have to warm up but I think it happens rather fast (5 minutes maybe?) I'm really not sure though. BeHardware had an article on this.

Yes, I think you're right!

I 'woke up' my computer at approx. 8:00 PM -- and the monitor was a little dark. Now it's 8:11 PM, and everything looks fine. This 'warm up' period is definitely taking place, and I'd be willing to bet that the length of time it takes (to stabilize) is dependent upon the room temperature -- if these backlights act like other fluorescent light sources.

I thinks it's my eyes that can't take the brightness after an hour or so...

Aha! Just Google'd the topic:

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&safe=off&q=CCFL+%22warm+up%22&btnG=Search

I'm gonna go do some reading, but judging by the snippets on the first page, there IS a warm up period, and it's normal behaviour -- not a defect. So, it looks like I'm not loosing my marbles after all!

Thanks for the reply!

*EDIT*

After doing a little 'research' I found a 'white paper' on LCD displays in notebooks, however I think the principles are probably the same:

http://www.spwg.org/spwg_spec_version3.0_2-18-2004-2.pdf

Purpose:
SPWG (Standard Panel Working Group) was formed to establish a set of standard LCD panels with dimensions and interface characteristics that allow both notebook and LCD supplier industries to manage the volatile LCD supply and demand in an easier fashion. This effort enables panels from multiple LCD suppliers to be used in most notebooks (or other products utilizing these standard panels) that are designed around these Standard Panels without changing either the notebook/product or the LCD panel module tooling...

LCD manufacturers that have endorsed the SPWG standard include: AU Optronics, BOE/Hydis, Chi Mei, CPT, HannStar, Hitachi, IDTech, InnoLux, LG.Philips LCD, Mitsubishi, Quanta Display, Samsung, Sharp, Toppoly, Tottori Sanyo, and TMDisplay...

6.1 General Measurement Requirements...

6.1.3 CCFL (Cold Cathode Fluorescent Lamp) warm-up time.
The CCFL requires time to achieve its set brightness after turn on. To insure accurate optical measurements the CCFL should be turned on and be allowed to warm-up for a minimum of 20 minutes.

Bingo!

 

[JediJorgie]

Vin, have you played any games with the 1907? At $236 after coupons I would love to get one of these if games looked alright.

 

[VinDSL]

Originally posted by: JediJorgie
Vin, have you played any games with the 1907? At $236 after coupons I would love to get one of these if games looked alright.

No, sorry! I'm not a gamer. Web dev (web development) is my passion...

However, I have a couple of hardcore gamers in the house. I think they play WOW and Ultima Online mostly (mostly 24/7 LoL). I know they went over to the WOW web site a couple of times -- while I was making my initial adjustments -- and said the screenshots "looked awesome" on the 1907FP, but they didn't actually play on it.

 

[blckgrffn]

Vin, your posts are awesome. Thanks for coming to the forum!

Nat

 

[VinDSL]

My pleasure! Thank YOU!

 

[JediJorgie]

Originally posted by: VinDSL

Originally posted by: JediJorgie
Vin, have you played any games with the 1907? At $236 after coupons I would love to get one of these if games looked alright.

No, sorry! I'm not a gamer. Web dev (web development) is my passion...

However, I have a couple of hardcore gamers in the house. I think they play WOW and Ultima Online mostly (mostly 24/7 LoL). I know they went over to the WOW web site a couple of times -- while I was making my initial adjustments -- and said the screenshots "looked awesome" on the 1907FP, but they didn't actually play on it.

Well if screenshots look good, I guess that means colors in games look good. And with its reported 8 ms response, maybe it would be good for games. Thanks Vin.

 

[JediJorgie]

Another question, does the 1907 have a TN panel or a VA variety?

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: JediJorgie
Another question, does the 1907 have a TN panel or a VA variety?

TN.

 

[VinDSL]

Yes, B-TN III...

Nobody but the Chinese knows what this means, but it's supposed to be an improvement over TN and TN II panels, e.g. state-of-the-art TN!

 

[VinDSL]

Thought I should pop back in here... I haven't adjusted my 1907FP for the last couple of days, so I guess I have it!

Monitor: DVI connection, and native res. Brightness set at 13% -- everything else set to default.

ATI CCC 6.4: Gamma set at 0.90 -- everything else set to default.

W2K: 1280 x 1024 @ 60Hz (32-bit) -- no color profile.

Panel looks a little dark for the first 5-10 minutes of operation, but all is good after 'warm up'...

Pretty simple, huh? I can't figure out why it took a week of messing around, but that's the way it goes!

 

[rainypickles]

Originally posted by: VinDSL
Woo hoo! NO dithering patterns now either!!!

http://www.home.no/t-o-k/Colour_Gradients/

if the panel did dither or it was visible, would it be obvious? like how you can see dithering on some GIFs? i went to look at those gradients, but i didnt notice any dithering on my laptop. i wouldnt think that laptops have better screens than the 1907?

 

[VinDSL]

Sorry! Perhaps a poor choice of words...

I'm used to CRTs, and with CRTs I've always run in 16-bit mode -- it's supposed to be a little faster, although I was never convinced of this. However, running in 16-bit mode never caused any problems with the CRT monitors I've used, so, that's what I initially used with the 1907FP.

In 16-bit mode, many of those gradients produce severe dithering artifacts and banding on this monitor! Black Magenta is probably the worst...

Having said that, with the current settings, no 'banding' is present!

Here's another one for you...

http://www.cs.toronto.edu/~zhzhang/Temp/Green_Gradient.jpg

OMG, this looks absolutely horrible in 16-bit mode on the 1907FP!!! Now, no problem...

Heh! Does that make more sense?

 

[sassol]

I just got the 1907fp a couple of weeks ago (too cheap to resist) but was loath to replace my nec 22" crt with it because I found the lcd to be "off" in some ways compared to the crt. Maybe too bright, maybe colours too washed out. In any event, it just didn't look as good, especially when playing oblivion. I finally decided to put the crt in storage and stick with the lcd for awhile to give it a fair try. I turned the brightness way down to 35 and found that to be about right. There was still something wrong with the colours though, and the blue and red presets didn't do it for me, so what I did was turn down all colours to 90 and now the monitor looks great. Turning the colours down acted like I had a contrast button in dvi.

 

[VinDSL]

Originally posted by: sassol
I turned the brightness way down... There was still something wrong with the colours though... so what I did was turn down all colours to 90...

Yes, I suspect 'we' have discovered the same phenomena, but corrected for it in different ways.

We both turned the brightness 'way down'... That's a given!

Ppl universally complain about the brightness of Dell monitors. The 1907FP is no exception! The 'problem' is, once you turn the brightness 'way down', color & contrast goes down the toilet, so you have to correct for that too. My first inclination was to adjust the contrast setting, but all that did was make the situation worse -- MUCH worse! Contrast is now set to default...

I turned down the Gamma in CCC from 1.00 -> .90

You turned down all the 'colours' from 100 -> 90

LoL! Same corrections, but different methods...

Originally posted by: sassol
...and now the monitor looks great...

These 1907FPs look great once they're adjusted correctly, e.g. if one has the patience to play around with them for a day or more. Moreover, IMHO, they are hypersensitive to ANY change made in the settings.

For instance, I can see a distinct difference between a brightness setting on '12' and '13' -- really! And, there is a HUGE difference in color quality between '90' and '100', as you've observed -- not only in color, but contrast!

Hopefully, this thread will help ppl setup some initial thresholds...

 

[VinDSL]

1907FPs are going for $219 right now... and this place claims Sammy panels are 8-bit...

Many users are reporting that they are receiving their 1907FPs with high quality 5ms 8 bit Samsung panels.

http://slickdeals.net/#p7386

Having said that, common sense indicates you aren't going to get a 'true' 8-bit panel at this price point...

 

[clarkse]

Got my 1907 last week, side by side with my (pva tech?) 1900 and really love the portrait mode. However, in portrait mode, the viewing angle is horrible. I may have to send it back.

Anyone got a nice 1905 out there and want this 1907?

Steve

 

[mutt11]

I bought 3 of these 1907's and all of them have Samsung 8 bit panels: ltm190ex. It appears to be a true 8 bit panel as Samsing's spec sheet states. I've run a few color spectrum test patterns and all the colors blend together seamlessly without dithering. I've been fiddling with them for the last few days and I have to say I am impressed (although I can't speak for the 6bit panels some have been getting).

Running the LCD right next to my Trinitron 21inch in 'Clone mode', the LCD is noticeably crisper and brighter than my trusty Trinitron (and the CRT is properly calibrated). There is a very slight motion blur when playing games, but it's not the deal-killer I expected. After about an hour you can't even notice it anymore. I've played BF2, SS2, CoD2, Oblivion, NFSMW, BFME2, FEAR, Doom3, etc and they've all looked great. One big suprise for me was how black the blacks are. I'm used to lesser LCDs displaying black as a dark grey, this is the first I've seen that comes pretty darn close to black.

The biggest con:
Slight backlight bleeding around the lower edges. However, it isn't bad and you forget it's there. Kinda like the lines on a Trinitron tube.

Like others, I had to lower my brightness a lot. Brightness is set to 30%, all colors to 90% and contrast (in the nvidia color correction tab) to 97%. These settings produce colors that appear identical to my Trinitron.

As for the view angle I haven't noticed any problems. I just sit in front of it and the display looks fine.

This monitor has a fully adjustable stand (height, tilt) and can also swivel left and right. It is also capable of portrait mode and came with all the cables (usb, dvi, vga). I'd say this is an excellent deal! I'm a gamer and I don't miss my CRT one bit.

 

[VinDSL]

This *might* be old news, but Dell 1907FPs are being shipped in different flavors.

Everyone knows about the Sammy and AUO panels, but LG/Philips has been added to the mix...

Here's the way it stands right now:

Samsung LTM190EX
http://www.samsung.com/Products/TFTLCD/...ors_n_Industrial/LTM190EX/LTM190EX.htm

AUO M190EN04
http://www.auo.com/auoDEV/products.php?...tor&func=info&product_id=62&items_id=1

LG/Philips LM190E03
http://img214.imageshack.us/img214/4996/lglm190e03pic6ey.jpg

I've put them together in a single graphic, in case the links above go stale...
http://www.lenon.com/images/1907FP_Panels.png

Everybody seems to prefer the Sammy panel, but AUO 'reviews' have been favorable as well (specifications aside). However, several LG owners have reported severe backlight bleeding problems...

 

[nitro237]

I just got my 1907 today. How do I tell who made it?

 

[xtknight]

The LTM190EX is a TN and it uses the 9-bit interpolation dithering method to achieve 16.7m. No 8-bit there. Also most AUO TN panels seem to provide more vibrant colors than Samsung ones.

 

[VinDSL]

Originally posted by: nitro237
I just got my 1907 today. How do I tell who made it?

You have to go into a 'secret menu' mode. To do this...

1) Turn off the monitor.

2) Press and hold down both the 'Menu button' and '+ sign button' with the monitor off.

3) While pressing and holding these buttons -- Turn on the monitor.

4) Release the buttons and go to your OSD menu, just like you normally would.

5) You will now see some extra text at the top of the menu. This is usually hidden.

[*]Screenshot: http://www.lenon.com/images/secret1.png

6) Go down to the 'Factory Reset' choice at the bottom of the menu and select it.

7) At the bottom of the "Reset to Factory Settings' menu, you will see a choice called 'Factory'. This is normally hidden too.

[*]Screenshot: http://www.lenon.com/images/secret2.png

8) Select 'Factory' and a popup will appear with all the info about your panel.

[*]Screenshot: http://www.lenon.com/images/secret3.png

*EDIT* Added screenshots. A picture is worth 1000 words, yes?

 

[nitro237]

Thanks VinDSL, I have the Samsung.

 

[mutt11]

So that explains the slight banding I've noticed when viewing sone 2 color gradients that go from dark to white. I was wondering why I was seeing this from a panel spec'd for 16.7 million colors.

Oh well, i've observered other 6bit panels do far worse and most gradients show no evidence of banding at all. This samsung panel seems a good compromise for color quality vs response time. During normal use banding/dithering is not noticeable (for me). Then again, I'm no graphics artist =) Oh yeah, you can use this gradient maker to generate various color gradients. Just make sure you select the max size of 600x500 so you can actually see any banding/dithering. Also make sure you select the png format. jpgs always dither.

http://tools.dynamicdrive.com/gradient/

I'd be curious what artifacts others observe using the other panels.

Thnx for the info xtknight.

 

[srk052004]

Hi all. I am getting confused regarding the 1907, as the specs provided from the three manufacturers do not match what the Dell site actually reports, and I seriously doubt that anyone from dell will be able to clarify during the computer build process. This means that I can have no idea what I will be shipped.

Is there another 19 inch (or even 17 inch) that would be a top choice for all-around office work, statistical graphics, that sort of thing, and that would be about the same prices as the 1907?

I am sorry to ask rudimentary questions.

Thanks in advance for any help you can provide.