I know I’m right, all we need to do is look at what actually happened after republicans jacked up the tax rates of the affluent people in the suburbs we are talking about.
No you’re right, a republican moving from New York to Florida because of SALT taxes would obviously changed their vote to Democrats. Most of whom are advocating for 70% tax rates which would dwarf the SALT tax increase by orders of magnitude.
And what do you think is going to happen when the Democrats jack up the tax rates of the suburban affluent? The midterm suburban shift to blue was not an embrace of liberal policies, it was educated people rejecting Trump. Affluent suburbia is also ground zero of NIMBYism and resistance to anything that jeopardizes its school systems, vacation lifestyles and luxury SUVs.I know I’m right, all we need to do is look at what actually happened after republicans jacked up the tax rates of the affluent people in the suburbs we are talking about.
And what do you think is going to happen when the Democrats jack up the tax rates of the suburban affluent? The midterm suburban shift to blue was not an embrace of liberal policies, it was educated people rejecting Trump. Affluent suburbia is also ground zero of NIMBYism and resistance to anything that jeopardizes its school systems, vacation lifestyles and luxury SUVs.
And what do you think is going to happen when the Democrats jack up the tax rates of the suburban affluent? The midterm suburban shift to blue was not an embrace of liberal policies, it was educated people rejecting Trump. Affluent suburbia is also ground zero of NIMBYism and resistance to anything that jeopardizes its school systems, vacation lifestyles and luxury SUVs.
99% of suburban affluents don’t make $10M. So what’s going to happen to their taxes again?
It’s amazing how ingrained the idea is that Democrats will raise middle class people’s taxes despite that not having happened in more than a quarter century. (And that was followed by an years of peace and prosperity)
At least in the past Republicans were smart enough to finance their tax cuts entirely through debt so they weren’t increasing taxes on regular people, at least not directly. This time they got greedy though - the scale of money they wanted to give rich people was so huge they couldn’t finance it by debt alone so they had to tax the middle class to get it. Seems to have been a big mistake.
Again, let's go back to the main point here. People with incomes over $100,000 receive more than 88% of SALT deduction benefits. It's cute that you want to consider yourself "middle class" but you're not. "Middle class" people don't make the kind of money where basically 20% of their pre-tax income goes to paying state and local taxes. You are upper class folks whose tax preferences were being subsidized by actual middle class taxpayers in other states and now your subsidy has ended and you're pissed about it. That's what's happening here. Everything else is a distraction. If you want to imagine this will drive some mass exodus to Democrats then feel free to believe whatever you want but hopefully Democrats are principled enough not to restore unlimited SALT deductions as it's morally and fiscally indefensible in every aspect.
We have already been over this.
First, I have no desire to play the ‘who is the middle class’ game.
Second, I subsidize those taxpayers, not the other way around. Remember when we went over this? In order to make this logic work you were reduced to using a definition of subsidy so insane that literally everyone in the US subsidized every other person, making the term meaningless.
Third, I’m not imagining anything, I’m looking at the demonstrated shift in voting behavior by the people affected by this. You’re the one imagining that the effect of Republicans raising taxes on people to the extent that they must leave their homes will make them reward Republicans by voting for more of it.
Funny how according to conservatives Democrats increasing people’s taxes will make them vote for Republicans and Republicans raising people’s taxes will make them vote for... Republicans. Nice motivated reasoning there.
Here's to hoping urban professionals like you continue to "subsidize every other person" to an even greater extent than capping SALT does since that's where the money is in the U.S. to pay for things. As you typically remind us, if you can afford to live somewhere where a teardown house costs over $1MM, you pay $40k for childcare, and you buy a $100 cronut then you can afford higher federal taxes and should pay them.
So now $10M is the upper bound for middle class? LOL. The affluent suburbs are filled with the $200k+ crowd. They are not middle class.99% of suburban affluents don’t make $10M. So what’s going to happen to their taxes again?
I am fine with eliminating the SALT deduction AND eliminating tax cuts for the rich AND easing the tax burden on the working and middle class. I would also make military pay tax free.It’s amazing how ingrained the idea is that Democrats will raise middle class people’s taxes despite that not having happened in more than a quarter century. (And that was followed by an years of peace and prosperity)
At least in the past Republicans were smart enough to finance their tax cuts entirely through debt so they weren’t increasing taxes on regular people, at least not directly. This time they got greedy though - the scale of money they wanted to give rich people was so huge they couldn’t finance it by debt alone so they had to tax the middle class to get it. Seems to have been a big mistake.
Haha, now here’s that spite based policy we all know and love!
I’m fine with paying higher taxes, but you’re going to pay them too. As I said before, I’m just not fine with paying more in taxes so the super rich can get a tax break.
I’m glad you’re on board with the idea that affluent people can afford to pay proportionately more though, that means we can REALLY go to town on the rich!
I don't really care that "affluent people can afford to pay proportionately more though" since that is a given and flat taxes are not a realistic proposal at this point. I do disagree with "REALLY going to town on the rich" as an ends to itself merely to attempt to hurt the rich or "bring them down to @fskimospy level". Taxes collected should reflect the spending the electorate demands which should broadly benefit the American people as a whole. If you need to tax a rich guy heavily to build infrastructure then so be it, that rich person will benefit as well. If you want to tax a rich guy heavily just to feel better about yourself only making $200k instead of $200m then you suck and should reexamine your morals.
Great, since I only want to tax the rich to pay for what the country needs we're in total agreement!
It seems there is significant disagreement on "what the country needs."
I'm sure there is, but what the country needs should be decided on by a majority of the citizens instead of the system we currently have which is designed to promote the interests of rich people.
I am fine with eliminating the SALT deduction AND eliminating tax cuts for the rich AND easing the tax burden on the working and middle class. I would also make military pay tax free.
Maybe your state should STFU for a while and fix your own corruption before opining about how the rest of the country doesn't know what it needs and "votes against its own self-interest." Maybe then you wouldn't need such high state and local taxes and capping SALT wouldn't impact you so much.
https://www.politico.com/magazine/s...k-became-most-corrupt-state-in-america-117652
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/11/18/nyregion/new-york-subway-system-failure-delays.html
I guess this means the argument is over as you've switched to unrelated ranting.
What argument? You're acting like our discussions here have any impact whatsoever on tax rates. If GOP gets in and "gives the rich a big tax break" then that will happen. If Dems win and institute their 70% tax rate then so be it. I no more care what you think the "proper" tax rate is for the rich then you care what I think it is, threads like this are simply to argue for the sake of arguing. If you want to imagine somehow it will be a better world when "the rich" are taxed at 70% and you can smile and say "serves you right jerk" then feel free.
And what do you think is going to happen when the Democrats jack up the tax rates of the suburban affluent? The midterm suburban shift to blue was not an embrace of liberal policies, it was educated people rejecting Trump. Affluent suburbia is also ground zero of NIMBYism and resistance to anything that jeopardizes its school systems, vacation lifestyles and luxury SUVs.
I meant that the discussion is no longer interesting to me because you've started ranting about unrelated topics.
What argument? You're acting like our discussions here have any impact whatsoever on tax rates. If GOP gets in and "gives the rich a big tax break" then that will happen. If Dems win and institute their 70% tax rate then so be it. I no more care what you think the "proper" tax rate is for the rich then you care what I think it is, threads like this are simply to argue for the sake of arguing. If you want to imagine somehow it will be a better world when "the rich" are taxed at 70% and you can smile and say "serves you right jerk" then feel free.
Yeah I realize that your interest lies in taxing the rich at exorbitant rates and pretending that you'll gladly pay higher rates yourself and that mentioning your state and city wastes billions in corruption would kill your mood. However what and we use tax proceeds and that they aren't being squandered is just as important if not more important than the "why" of unrelated goals like "bring the rich down a peg" which you also enjoy thinking about.