Andrew Luck vs RG3

[Captante]

Others on that list haven't even taken their teams to the playoffs let alone perennially. Also one of his teammates shows up on that list. I can with absolute certainly say that Wilson is more important to the Seahawks success than Bobby Wagner.

Yeah which is baffling. I think he's top 1-2QB in the league right now.

There's been some chatter that it might be closer to $50mil for Mahomes, but he's also said he's considering how his contract can impact the team's ability to provide talent around him. If I were the Chiefs, I'd have offered him a 10 year $350million contract before last season. Now I'd consider offering him a similar deal but almost entirely guaranteed, with some bonus incentives. Which, they could easily end up paying him $500million over the next 10 years and feel it was money well spent.

Post Super Bowl I'd have to go with a solid #2 for Wilson but otherwise I agree completely.

I was actually wrong about Mahomes I knew he was good but not like he's turned out. Unless he loses discipline now that he's won once I see him potentially as an all-time great.

 

[manly]

Others on that list haven't even taken their teams to the playoffs let alone perennially. Also one of his teammates shows up on that list. I can with absolute certainly say that Wilson is more important to the Seahawks success than Bobby Wagner.

Yeah which is baffling. I think he's top 1-2QB in the league right now.

There's been some chatter that it might be closer to $50mil for Mahomes, but he's also said he's considering how his contract can impact the team's ability to provide talent around him. If I were the Chiefs, I'd have offered him a 10 year $350million contract before last season. Now I'd consider offering him a similar deal but almost entirely guaranteed, with some bonus incentives. Which, they could easily end up paying him $500million over the next 10 years and feel it was money well spent.

Huh? I'm pretty sure the vast majority of those MVP votes went to guys on a division winner. I'd be surprised to see any votes for a player that missed the playoffs; that's just not how MVP voters in the major sports leagues work. As for RW specifically, remember when they won divisions and went to Super Bowls, he was a very young player and not the focal point of the team's success. Since developing into a standout QB, the Seahawks have mostly posted 10 wins as a wild card. It's just hard to get any MVP votes that way. In 2019, RW was unlucky that Lamar Jackson had a video game season (and the Seahawks again were a wild card).

It's debatable that RW is a top 1-2 QB right now. Obviously every GM is gonna (privately) say Mahomes. Wilson is legitimately top 4, but you have past MVP winners like ARod and Lamar to compare against. I don't personally believe Lamar is a top-5 QB yet, but he is the reigning MVP award winner. Old men Brady and Brees and perhaps Matt Ryan are somewhat still in the top-5 conversation, as well.

There's a pretty firm salary cap in the NFL and with COVID-19 depressing the economy, it's a reach to think Mahomes will sniff anywhere close to $50M annual average. Even $40M is a jaw-dropping number, as record-setting contracts usually exceed the previous maximum by a couple M$ per season, not $5M. Mahomes is worth every penny, but at the same time, he's smart enough to know that the more he makes, the less the team spends on other guys.

 

[darkswordsman17]

Huh? I'm pretty sure the vast majority of those MVP votes went to guys on a division winner. I'd be surprised to see any votes for a player that missed the playoffs; that's just not how MVP voters in the major sports leagues work. As for RW specifically, remember when they won divisions and went to Super Bowls, he was a very young player and not the focal point of the team's success. Since developing into a standout QB, the Seahawks have mostly posted 10 wins as a wild card. It's just hard to get any MVP votes that way. In 2019, RW was unlucky that Lamar Jackson had a video game season (and the Seahawks again were a wild card).

It's debatable that RW is a top 1-2 QB right now. Obviously every GM is gonna (privately) say Mahomes. Wilson is legitimately top 4, but you have past MVP winners like ARod and Lamar to compare against. I don't personally believe Lamar is a top-5 QB yet, but he is the reigning MVP award winner. Old men Brady and Brees and perhaps Matt Ryan are somewhat still in the top-5 conversation, as well.

There's a pretty firm salary cap in the NFL and with COVID-19 depressing the economy, it's a reach to think Mahomes will sniff anywhere close to $50M annual average. Even $40M is a jaw-dropping number, as record-setting contracts usually exceed the previous maximum by a couple M$ per season, not $5M. Mahomes is worth every penny, but at the same time, he's smart enough to know that the more he makes, the less the team spends on other guys.

I was wrong (I thought Murray was Kyler) and forgot the Raiders actually eked into the playoffs one year with Carr. And Peterson was also on a Wild Card team. There's no way you can argue that basically any of the names past Brees have any legit claims for receiving votes while Russell Wilson didn't. Plus as I pointed out there's no way using that explanation that Bobby Wagner should have an MVP vote but Wilson doesn't. Wilson has easily been as much the focus of the team and reason for its success as Wagner.

I'm not saying he should have won, as him, Watt, and Brees have had bad luck where some other guy just clearly has a season that is deserving that makes it almost impossible for them to win. But to not even get any votes is ridiculous and has no explanation that makes any sense.

I'd take Wilson over every single QB in the league other than Mahomes. I'd struggle to argue that Wilson wouldn't do as well as Mahomes on the Chiefs. He's the only other QB that I think could have done what Mahomes did in the playoffs and Super Bowl.

I'm aware, I'm just saying what the more recent talk has been. And $10mil is one maybe two playmakers, or 3-4 role players these days, its not going to make that big of a difference. But that's why I said the Chiefs should offer him a long contract with lower per year, even if they had to do guaranteed or offer incentives. People thought Brees' contract(s) were poison to the Saints, but it clearly wasn't, and that's for a much older Brees. Obviously teams have to manage their rosters well, but that's true no matter what.