Andrew Luck vs RG3

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Thebobo

Lifer
Jun 19, 2006
18,574
7,671
136
you can, and people have tried, and it never works. a lot of offense in football has to do with chemistry and rythm, and if you're constantly swapping out qbs, you will never have that.

That's the theory but I don't buy it. Has anyone significantly tried it?
 

eits

Lifer
Jun 4, 2005
25,015
3
81
www.integratedssr.com
Sorry, these are excuses. RGIII can't read defenses, has poor foot work, and his pocket presence is awful. Contrary to what you guys claimed, he does not have the skills of Luck or Russell Wilson. Comparing RGIII to Luck at this stage really shows you how deficient RGIII is. He succeeded in his rookie year because Shanahan had a dumbed-down offense with a lot of bootlegs and designed runs.

lol, since when are excuses irrelevant and not worthy of being argued? of course they're excuses... and? so what? you ignore the excuses rather than correct them and give talent away to another team (like the colts did to peyton manning)?

i'm not arguing that rg3 isn't deficient. when you don't get the training necessary to unleash your potential, you are deficient.

andrew luck may be an incredible fantasy football quarterback, but he is still the most overrated quarterback on a consistent basis.
 

Adrenaline

Diamond Member
Jun 12, 2005
5,320
8
81
lol, since when are excuses irrelevant and not worthy of being argued? of course they're excuses... and? so what? you ignore the excuses rather than correct them and give talent away to another team (like the colts did to peyton manning)?

i'm not arguing that rg3 isn't deficient. when you don't get the training necessary to unleash your potential, you are deficient.

andrew luck may be an incredible fantasy football quarterback, but he is still the most overrated quarterback on a consistent basis.

Who would you rather have than Andrew Luck?

Peyton
Brady
Rodgers

I can't think of anyone else as Brees can't play on the road for crap. If you want to break it down further, Rodgers would be the only one considering the age of the other two.

The Colts offensive line and run game are still bad. They have been bad since Luck has been in the NFL. They are not awful, just bad.
 
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eits

Lifer
Jun 4, 2005
25,015
3
81
www.integratedssr.com
Who would you rather have than Andrew Luck?

Peyton
Brady
Rodgers

I can't think of anyone else as Brees can't play on the road for crap. If you want to break it down further, Rodgers would be the only one considering the age of the other two.

The Colts offensive line and run game are still bad. They have been bad since Luck has been in the NFL. They are not awful, just bad.

Luck has consistently had one of the easiest strength of schedules since he entered the league. I don't feel he's been tested enough to be labeled a quality quarterback, overall, or not. It's kinda like being on the Dean's List in a good community college and thinking that really means something in comparison to an ivy league university.

I can't say he sucks, but I can certainly say he's overrated. He doesn't have great accuracy or arm strength, but he has good pocket presence and decisiveness. That may be trainable.

RG3 sucks right now, but has incredible potential. Once he starts getting trained properly to get back to his former self and improve his footwork, he'll be awesome. He has to work on his pocket presence and decisiveness, but that's easily trained. He has to stop hitting the weights and start working on core fundamentals (wax the car, paint the fence, etc.). His ar strength is there and his accuracy is there, he just needs to work on his core stability and motor work. The horrible trainers at Redskins Park fucked it all up.
 

purbeast0

No Lifer
Sep 13, 2001
53,021
5,898
126

saw this yesterday, and if this is true, i'm officially dropping all fandom with the redskins. i have redskins shit hung up in my house, a bunch of jerseys, a helmet, and a buncha other crap. it will all be gone if this happens.

i also just heard on the pregame that the rams turned their trade to the redskins for griffin into 8 draft picks, and 5 of them are currently starters lol. they made out MUCH better than the redskins did with that trade.
 

purbeast0

No Lifer
Sep 13, 2001
53,021
5,898
126
Luck has consistently had one of the easiest strength of schedules since he entered the league. I don't feel he's been tested enough to be labeled a quality quarterback, overall, or not. It's kinda like being on the Dean's List in a good community college and thinking that really means something in comparison to an ivy league university.

I can't say he sucks, but I can certainly say he's overrated. He doesn't have great accuracy or arm strength, but he has good pocket presence and decisiveness. That may be trainable.

RG3 sucks right now, but has incredible potential. Once he starts getting trained properly to get back to his former self and improve his footwork, he'll be awesome. He has to work on his pocket presence and decisiveness, but that's easily trained. He has to stop hitting the weights and start working on core fundamentals (wax the car, paint the fence, etc.). His ar strength is there and his accuracy is there, he just needs to work on his core stability and motor work. The horrible trainers at Redskins Park fucked it all up.

i dont know what games of andrew luck you have seen, but he is fucking awesome. not sure how you can call him overrated when he has the stats to back him up.

you sound like one of those rg3 fans who are stuck back in 2012 rg3 mode. that rg3 is gone and will never be back. it's obvious he has lost speed and elusiveness. whether it's due to his injury or whatever, it's gone and its never coming back.

rg3 sucks. he is missing fundamentals that aren't things you can learn. they are things he didn't have to use when he was younger because he was simply faster than everyone and could use his feet to get out of pressure. he never developed the qb vision and presence in the pocket because he simply did not have to. it's not something he has and the people who know more about football than i do and live/breathe it in the nfl think that he simply will never have it. it's an instinct thing.

you keep saying he can get better blah blah blah. i remember this SAME EXACT argument when jason campbell was on the redskins. everyone said it wasn't his fault, made excuses about the line, everything. everyone said he would go somewhere else and be great. well since he left here, he's been a career backup, with stints here and there as a starter when people get injured, and he also isn't good.

also not sure what you are talking about with his accuracy. his accuracy sucks. it only seemed good in 2012 because wide receivers were WIDE OPEN due to play design. that is another flaw of his - he can only throw to receivers who are already wide open. he can't hit people before their breaks in their pattern. he has to wait for them to be wide open, which is why he holds the ball long as shit waiting for people to get open, then scrambles like a chicken with his head cut off or gets sacked. i listen to chris cooley's film break down every week and he's been saying this forever.

rg3 sucks. just get over it. stop holding on to the past in 2012, it's gone and never coming back. 2012 was a fluke.
 

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
111,131
30,082
146
Luck has consistently had one of the easiest strength of schedules since he entered the league. I don't feel he's been tested enough to be labeled a quality quarterback, overall, or not. It's kinda like being on the Dean's List in a good community college and thinking that really means something in comparison to an ivy league university.

I can't say he sucks, but I can certainly say he's overrated. He doesn't have great accuracy or arm strength, but he has good pocket presence and decisiveness. That may be trainable.

have you ever watched Luck play? None of that describes Luck. lol.
 

Ban Bot

Senior member
Jun 1, 2010
796
1
76
uh oh we got a butt hurt seahawks fan!

guess she forgot to read the thread title.

I didn't forget to read anything.

See: Poll options on the OP.

Your comment pretty much sums up the depth of the counter position of Wilson detractors. The first problem is even though Wilson is an option (he is the 3rd option in the poll) he doesn't even merit a place in the OP subject line despite his success since day 1. Wilson isn't given much thoughtful consideration--everyone gravitates to the big name 1st and 2nd pick guys.

And when some detailed information is given on Wilson instead of polite interaction Wilson haters resort to name calling and insults.

Which if that is the best his detractors can muscle then we can lock the poll and thread because the results are in: Wilson in a landslide. But it will drive some people batty to no end as he is a midget non-prototypical black quarterback who isn't a volume passer who critics continue to lump in with "running quarterbacks" and excuse his success as merely a byproduct of his team.

Ps- Luck is a good young QB. He has crazy upside. But his game is very different from Wilson's. You look at Luck's propensity for turnovers in year 1&2 and how Seattle has depended greatly on Wilson using his legs to capture key plays I don't think Seattle 2012 or 2013 is a better team with Luck. Seattle had a number of comeback games where Wilson has had to be a volume passer and he rarely throws picks even in those need-to-pass situations. And it isn't like Wilson has had a great line or good receivers since he got to Seattle.

Football is a team sport. Indy is lucky to have Luck. Seattle is fortunate to have Wilson and Wilson has been the best fit for Seattle out of the Luck-Griffin-Wilson triumvirate and that is emphatically accented by the fact Seattle got him in the 3rd round which allowed them to nab Bruce Irvin in the 1st and Bobby Wagner in the 2nd rounds in 2012. Not to mention Wilson's cap hit is $5mm less than Luck this year ($4mm last year). Which Seattle promptly spent on a Lambo (Harvin 1st-3rd-7th picks and ~ $20mm for 8 games in 2 years) which they traded in for some pocket lint and gumballs.
 

purbeast0

No Lifer
Sep 13, 2001
53,021
5,898
126
I didn't forget to read anything.

See: Poll options on the OP.

Your comment pretty much sums up the depth of the counter position of Wilson detractors. The first problem is even though Wilson is an option (he is the 3rd option in the poll) he doesn't even merit a place in the OP subject line despite his success since day 1. Wilson isn't given much thoughtful consideration--everyone gravitates to the big name 1st and 2nd pick guys.

And when some detailed information is given on Wilson instead of polite interaction Wilson haters resort to name calling and insults.

Which if that is the best his detractors can muscle then we can lock the poll and thread because the results are in: Wilson in a landslide. But it will drive some people batty to no end as he is a midget non-prototypical black quarterback who isn't a volume passer who critics continue to lump in with "running quarterbacks" and excuse his success as merely a byproduct of his team.

Ps- Luck is a good young QB. He has crazy upside. But his game is very different from Wilson's. You look at Luck's propensity for turnovers in year 1&2 and how Seattle has depended greatly on Wilson using his legs to capture key plays I don't think Seattle 2012 or 2013 is a better team with Luck. Seattle had a number of comeback games where Wilson has had to be a volume passer and he rarely throws picks even in those need-to-pass situations. And it isn't like Wilson has had a great line or good receivers since he got to Seattle.

Football is a team sport. Indy is lucky to have Luck. Seattle is fortunate to have Wilson and Wilson has been the best fit for Seattle out of the Luck-Griffin-Wilson triumvirate and that is emphatically accented by the fact Seattle got him in the 3rd round which allowed them to nab Bruce Irvin in the 1st and Bobby Wagner in the 2nd rounds in 2012. Not to mention Wilson's cap hit is $5mm less than Luck this year ($4mm last year). Which Seattle promptly spent on a Lambo (Harvin 1st-3rd-7th picks and ~ $20mm for 8 games in 2 years) which they traded in for some pocket lint and gumballs.

wilson was added after the thread was started because people were whining about it.
 

IndyColtsFan

Lifer
Sep 22, 2007
33,655
687
126
andrew luck may be an incredible fantasy football quarterback, but he is still the most overrated quarterback on a consistent basis.

More proof you have no clue. Luck continues to set records while the only record RGIII is setting is the number of splinters in his ass from sitting on the bench. Luck is not overrated, quite the contrary -- he, like Peyton, hides the deficiencies of the Colts very, very well. If Luck goes out tomorrow, the Colts are a 3 to 5 win team, max.

RGIII was the most overhyped, overrated QB coming out of college in recent memory. You saying Luck is overrated and then in the next breath saying that RGIII is like Steve Young was one of the dumbest things I've read in a football thread on AT. Do you even think about what you're typing?

Those of us who know football told you guys RGIII would have a good first year and fade. That is EXACTLY what happened. RGIII doesn't have the football IQ of Luck nor does he have the necessary attitude and work ethic to succeed in the NFL. If he doesn't correct his attitude and quit worrying about his silly-ass "brand," he'll be a benchwarmer forever.

Who would you rather have than Andrew Luck?

Peyton
Brady
Rodgers

I can't think of anyone else as Brees can't play on the road for crap. If you want to break it down further, Rodgers would be the only one considering the age of the other two.

The Colts offensive line and run game are still bad. They have been bad since Luck has been in the NFL. They are not awful, just bad.

This. Tell us eits, who would YOU pick if you had to build a team right now ahead of Luck besides those mentioned above?

I've said it before and I'll say it again. I had no problem with the second team in the 2012 draft picking Griffin. What I had a problem with was the price the Redskins paid -- it was a very, very foolish price to pay for someone whose style of play has NEVER resulted in an NFL star and whose style of play regularly resulted in multiple injuries for players playing that style of ball. The Redskins knew this too, which is why they wisely decided to also pick Cousins.
 
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eits

Lifer
Jun 4, 2005
25,015
3
81
www.integratedssr.com
Trust you? Bwahahaha. Reading your comments in this thread, it is very clear you don't know much about football.

Lol, I know way more about player ability and potential than you do. I also know that any quarterback who throws 40 times a game because they lack a strong run game and because they play consistently awful secondaries doesn't mean that they're great quarterbacks just because they beat weak defenses.

How's the Browns game going? They have a good defense. How's that game going?

Luck is overrated. Pipe down.
 

IndyColtsFan

Lifer
Sep 22, 2007
33,655
687
126
Lol, I know way more about player ability and potential than you do. I also know that any quarterback who throws 40 times a game because they lack a strong run game and because they play consistently awful secondaries doesn't mean that they're great quarterbacks just because they beat weak defenses.

How's the Browns game going? They have a good defense. How's that game going?

Luck is overrated. Pipe down.

I have forgotten more about football than you'll ever know. You know little about player ability and potential. RGIII has been a dismal failure and is a coach killer. Those are facts. His success was due to Shanahan dumbing down the playbook and inserting a liberal number of bootlegs. What are you going to say next? "But...but...but...RGIII is like Steve Young!!" Bwahahaha!

Go ahead, talk about RGIII's athletic ability. Keep harping on it. I'll put Vick's athletic ability up against RGIII any day (at the same point in their respective careers). RGIII might be faster but Vick had a far stronger arm. How did that work out for Vick? RGIII doesn't have the attitude or work ethic at this point. It remains to be seen if he ever will.

Speaking of games, how'd that Tampa game go for RGIII? Did RGIII beat Denver, San Francisco, and Seattle like Luck did last year? No? I thought not.

And you don't even realize that a QB having to throw 40 times per game isn't a strength but is a huge team weakness.
 
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purbeast0

No Lifer
Sep 13, 2001
53,021
5,898
126
Lol, I know way more about player ability and potential than you do. I also know that any quarterback who throws 40 times a game because they lack a strong run game and because they play consistently awful secondaries doesn't mean that they're great quarterbacks just because they beat weak defenses.

How's the Browns game going? They have a good defense. How's that game going?

Luck is overrated. Pipe down.

seriously dude ... are you this dense?

the colts are 8-4 and are probably going to the playoffs AGAIN with luck at the helm, and you're seriously trying to say that he is overrated?

he might lead them to a win right now too with this drive they are on.

EDIT:

yup, just threw for what is probably going to be the game wining touchdown with 30 seconds left.
 
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eits

Lifer
Jun 4, 2005
25,015
3
81
www.integratedssr.com
seriously dude ... are you this dense?

the colts are 8-4 and are probably going to the playoffs AGAIN with luck at the helm, and you're seriously trying to say that he is overrated?

he might lead them to a win right now too with this drive they are on.

Look at their strength of schedule over the past three years.

Which team would be more likely to succeed, the team that plays the easiest defenses to beat in the NFL or the team that doesn't?

It will be a long time before the Colts make it to the AFC Championship.
 

IndyColtsFan

Lifer
Sep 22, 2007
33,655
687
126
Look at their strength of schedule over the past three years.

Which team would be more likely to succeed, the team that plays the easiest defenses to beat in the NFL or the team that doesn't?

It will be a long time before the Colts make it to the AFC Championship.

Before this game, Luck was #1 in yards, #2 in TDs, and #3 in QB rating IIRC. Yeah, he's overrated.
 

IndyColtsFan

Lifer
Sep 22, 2007
33,655
687
126
Look at their strength of schedule over the past three years.

Which team would be more likely to succeed, the team that plays the easiest defenses to beat in the NFL or the team that doesn't?

It will be a long time before the Colts make it to the AFC Championship.

Uh, the Colts have played a first place schedule 2 years in a row. The Redskins? Uh, no. Colts beat San Francisco, Seattle, and Denver last year.

The Colts are a one-man team right now and won't last in the playoffs. Of course they're not going to the AFC Championship any time soon. However, I'd wager Luck makes it there before RGIII unless RGIII is signed as a backup to Manning or Brady.

BTW, the Colts just beat Cleveland on a clutch drive by Luck. You were saying?

seriously dude ... are you this dense?

the colts are 8-4 and are probably going to the playoffs AGAIN with luck at the helm, and you're seriously trying to say that he is overrated?

he might lead them to a win right now too with this drive they are on.

EDIT:

yup, just threw for what is probably going to be the game wining touchdown with 30 seconds left.

Sadly, the Colts are a one-man team yet again and won't last in the playoffs. If Trent Richardson couldn't get up and perform for this game, well, there's no hope for him.
 
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eits

Lifer
Jun 4, 2005
25,015
3
81
www.integratedssr.com
Colts barely won that game. Congrats, Hoyer is awful.

I feel like I'm talking to an invalid...

Again, if you throw tons of times per game because you don't have a strong run game and you play weak defenses, then you should expect wins and tons of yards thrown.
 

IndyColtsFan

Lifer
Sep 22, 2007
33,655
687
126
Again, if you throw tons of times per game because you don't have a strong run game and you play weak defenses, then you should expect wins and tons of yards thrown.

Having a one-dimensional offense is not good and is easy to stop. The fact that Luck continues to play well in spite of the team being one dimensional is to his credit.
 
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