Another Malaysian airplane down

[Phokus]

I like how corporations just play with civilian lives

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/jul/17/malaysia-airlines-plane-crashes-ukraine-live

My colleague Dan Milmo in London reports that it has been normal practice for airlines to fly over conflict zones since the Ukraine conflict began. He interviewed a pilot for a major European airline:

"We would often avoid areas where there is air-to-air conflict, but we flew over Iraq and Afghanistan when the British and US armed forces were delpoyed there, because only one side was using military jets."

Explaining why airlines fly over conflict zones where groups might be in possession of ground-to-air missiles, the pilot said: "There will be weapons based on the ground when you are at 30,000 feet, but that is far up in the air. There are not many missile systems that can be so accurate."

His comments suggest that assumptions about weapons capabilities on the ground will have to be reevaluated, pending investigation of the crash

 

[Zaap]

seemed to me the story just disappeared in to thin air

(troll face)

This type of humor isn't going to fly around here.

 

[OutHouse]

Just a reminder that conservatives can't stop sucking Putin's dick because he's so 'strong', unlike that Obama guy.

Stfu

 

[Pneumothorax]

I like how corporations just play with civilian lives

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/jul/17/malaysia-airlines-plane-crashes-ukraine-live

Hey but your side should be happy as they're emitting much less CO2 a known pollutant of the worst degree...

 

[Phokus]

Stfu

Yeah because that totally didn't happen. You conservatives live in a bubble.

 

[nehalem256]

I like how corporations just play with civilian lives

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/jul/17/malaysia-airlines-plane-crashes-ukraine-live

Yep good thing Malaysian Airlines isn't owned by the government...

Malaysian Government investment arm and holding company, Khazanah Nasional's subsidiary, Penerbangan Malaysia Berhad[25] is the majority shareholder with a 52.0% stake

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malaysia_Airlines#Corporate_information

Oh wait ^_^

 

[Phokus]

Yep good thing Malaysian Airlines isn't owned by the government...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malaysia_Airlines#Corporate_information

Oh wait ^_^

1. You do realize that lots of private airliners were flying over that airspace, right? A whole swath of them JUST announced that they were going to avoid that airspace NOW.

2. You do realize that pilot was talking about how it's standard procedure for most airliners to make that assumption, right?

You are not smart.

 

[Fern]

Yep good thing Malaysian Airlines isn't owned by the government...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malaysia_Airlines#Corporate_information

Oh wait ^_^

LOL

Fern

 

[Fanatical Meat]

I request a new thread title, this one has become disrespectful given the circumstances

 

[nehalem256]

You are not smart.

I am not the one trying to claim that a government owned airline company getting its airliner shot down is proof that we shouldn't trust corporations with out safety and instead rely on the government.

 

[sunzt]

Yep good thing Malaysian Airlines isn't owned by the government...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malaysia_Airlines#Corporate_information

Oh wait ^_^

Shouldn't you be happy that a Government is trying to act more like a business?

 

[Phokus]

I am not the one trying to claim that a government owned airline company getting its airliner shot down is proof that we shouldn't trust corporations with out safety and instead rely on the government.

It's still a corporation, you dumbass, you think it stopped being a profit motivated entity? It was just 'luck' that it was Malaysia Airlines, LOTS of airliners were flying over that airspace, you completely missed the point. Thus you are not smart.

 

[Fern]

I like how corporations just play with civilian lives

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/jul/17/malaysia-airlines-plane-crashes-ukraine-live

My colleague Dan Milmo in London reports that it has been normal practice for airlines to fly over conflict zones since the Ukraine conflict began. He interviewed a pilot for a major European airline:

"We would often avoid areas where there is air-to-air conflict, but we flew over Iraq and Afghanistan when the British and US armed forces were delpoyed there, because only one side was using military jets."

Explaining why airlines fly over conflict zones where groups might be in possession of ground-to-air missiles, the pilot said: "There will be weapons based on the ground when you are at 30,000 feet, but that is far up in the air. There are not many missile systems that can be so accurate."

His comments suggest that assumptions about weapons capabilities on the ground will have to be reevaluated, pending investigation of the crash

I would think it a pretty safe assumption that flights over Iraq and Afghanistan would be safe. The US and Britain aren't going to shoot down an airliner. Unlike the pro-Russian rebels here I would also expect us and the Brits to have control over those air spaces and know with certainty who were flying in them (assuming the pro-Russians erroneously thought it was a Ukrainian plane). Also the Iraq/Afghanistan e rebels didn't have access to anything that would hit a plane at 30,000' etc.

Assuming it was Russian backed rebels with an advanced system, I don't think anyone thought Russia was crazy enough to provide that sort of advanced missile system. If it was them, it also reveals that we (USA and other Western nations) don't have good intel on what's happening there. One would think upon knowledge of such systems civil airlines/aircraft would be warned. Then again, maybe it was just an 'Oops' like Benghazi.

Fern

 

[freegeeks]

I would think it a pretty safe assumption that flights over Iraq and Afghanistan would be safe. The US and Britain aren't going to shoot down an airliner. Unlike the pro-Russian rebels here I would also expect us and the Brits to have control over those air spaces and know with certainty who were flying in them (assuming the pro-Russians erroneously thought it was a Ukrainian plane). Also the Iraq/Afghanistan e rebels didn't have access to anything that would hit a plane at 30,000' etc.

Assuming it was Russian backed rebels with an advanced system, I don't think anyone thought Russia was crazy enough to provide that sort of advanced missile system. If it was them, it also reveals that we (USA and other Western nations) don't have good intel on what's happening there. One would think upon knowledge of system such systems civil airlines/aircraft would be warned. Then again, maybe it was just an 'Oops' like Benghazi.

Fern

the rebels captured a BUK missile system end of june

http://en.itar-tass.com/world/738262

 

[sunzt]

If it was them, it also reveals that we (USA and other Western nations) don't have good intel on what's happening there. One would think upon knowledge of such systems civil airlines/aircraft would be warned. Then again, maybe it was just an 'Oops' like Benghazi.

Fern

I think the US has an idea of Russian capability and their support of rebels. It's part of the reason why the FAA banned US flights from going over there.

 

[-slash-]

Yeah because that totally didn't happen. You conservatives live in a bubble.

:awe:

Better watch out, another round of sanctions

 

[Fern]

the rebels captured a BUK missile system end of june

http://en.itar-tass.com/world/738262

Thanks.

Well, looks it was a big 'Oops'.

Fern

 

[Phokus]

I think the US has an idea of Russian capability and their support of rebels. It's part of the reason why the FAA banned US flights from going over there.

Well look at that, the government preventing corporations from doing something dumb.

 

[Phokus]

:awe:

Better watch out, another round of sanctions

It'd be hilarious of a republican were president, he'd be backtracking his previous ass kissing of Putin so fast...

 

[Fern]

Well look at that, the government preventing corporations from doing something dumb.

The Malaysian government hasn't exactly impressed as of late re: running airlines etc., has it?

Fern

 

[Zorba]

I would think it a pretty safe assumption that flights over Iraq and Afghanistan would be safe. The US and Britain aren't going to shoot down an airliner. Unlike the pro-Russian rebels here I would also expect us and the Brits to have control over those air spaces and know with certainty who were flying in them (assuming the pro-Russians erroneously thought it was a Ukrainian plane). Also the Iraq/Afghanistan e rebels didn't have access to anything that would hit a plane at 30,000' etc.

Assuming it was Russian backed rebels with an advanced system, I don't think anyone thought Russia was crazy enough to provide that sort of advanced missile system. If it was them, it also reveals that we (USA and other Western nations) don't have good intel on what's happening there. One would think upon knowledge of such systems civil airlines/aircraft would be warned. Then again, maybe it was just an 'Oops' like Benghazi.

Fern

The NSA is too busy reading your grandma's sexting conversations to actually do its real job.

 

[FerrelGeek]

Just a reminder that conservatives can't stop sucking Putin's dick because he's so 'strong', unlike that Obama guy.

Just a reminder that you're a worthless, hate-filled troll with nothing of any worth to offer with your useless life.

 

[Phokus]

The Malaysian government hasn't exactly impressed as of late re: running airlines etc., has it?

Fern

Except all those other European airlines were flying over that airspace. American airliners would be too if it weren't for the US government.

 

[-slash-]

1. You do realize that lots of private airliners were flying over that airspace, right? A whole swath of them JUST announced that they were going to avoid that airspace NOW.

2. You do realize that pilot was talking about how it's standard procedure for most airliners to make that assumption, right?

You are not smart.

Assumption of risk.

You make the choice to use air travel to get from place to place. Air travel always has associated risks. If you do not like the policies and practices of a private corporation, do not use them. Simple as that. Every time you travel you are putting your life in the hands of the chosen airline company and its employees. It is your choice to do so. Talk about living in a bubble

Do I think they should have been flying over said airspace, no. That is their prerogative though, just as it is yours to use said airlines.

 

[werepossum]

Sad that in order to save some fuel, commercial airliners would overfly this conflict assuming they would not be misidentified and/or that at 30,000 feet they are safe - even though both sides have advanced air defense systems and 30,000 feet is a perfectly rational altitude for a strategic bomber. Of course, this is hindsight, but that just seems insane on the face of it.

As far as being safe to overfly Iraq and Afghanistan, that's because we had reduced their already inferior air defense systems to negligible, not because we're Americans. This sort of mis-identification happens to everyone, including us, in the fog of war.