Another Malaysian airplane down

[Zorba]

Well look at that, the government preventing corporations from doing something dumb.

That was an easy decision for the FAA to make, because I doubt any normally scheduled US flight flew over that airspace, since US Flag Carriers can't do Europe to Asia routes.

The FAA would have a much harder time closing air space over Eastern Canada, for example.

 

[Phokus]

Just a reminder that you're a worthless, hate-filled troll with nothing of any worth to offer with your useless life.

It's funny how conservatives can't deal with the fact that reality will ALWAYS come back to bite them in the ass.

 

[Fern]

Except all those other European airlines were flying over that airspace. American airliners would be too if it weren't for the US government.

(Gasp!) Criticism of the socialist govts of Europe?

Fern

 

[-slash-]

It'd be hilarious of a republican were president, he'd be backtracking his previous ass kissing of Putin so fast...

I doubt we'd be in this piss poor situation to begin with. Instead we have a leader playing political games and cowering like a dog while Putin is is playing with peoples lives and shoving it in Americas face.

 

[-slash-]

It's funny how conservatives can't deal with the fact that reality will ALWAYS come back to bite them in the ass.

Reality just bit someone in the ass in the form of a SAM hitting a passenger plane while the UN twiddles it's thumbs with paperwork and verbal threats. That is reality.

 

[Phokus]

That was an easy decision for the FAA to make, because I doubt any normally scheduled US flight flew over that airspace, since US Flag Carriers can't do Europe to Asia routes.

Actually it looks like Delta Airlines goes from New York/New Jersey to western Russia, what are you talking about.

 

[sunzt]

That was an easy decision for the FAA to make, because I doubt any normally scheduled US flight flew over that airspace, since US Flag Carriers can't do Europe to Asia routes.

False. Apparently Delta did. United flies more international flights than Delta so I would imagine they did as well.

http://news.yahoo.com/delta-stops-routing-flights-ukrainian-airspace-192432117.html

 

[Phokus]

I doubt we'd be in this piss poor situation to begin with. Instead we have a leader playing political games and cowering like a dog while Putin is is playing with peoples lives and shoving it in Americas face.

Reality just bit someone in the ass in the form of a SAM hitting a passenger plane while the UN twiddles it's thumbs with paperwork and verbal threats. That is reality.

The way conservatives have been behaving, a GOP president would be making excuses for Russia's behavior like a battered wife does for her abusive husband.

*McCain/Romney slips Putin a note at the G8 meeting: "Do you like me? One wink for yes, two winks for no*

 

[Fern]

I think the US has an idea of Russian capability and their support of rebels. It's part of the reason why the FAA banned US flights from going over there.

Well look at that, the government preventing corporations from doing something dumb.

Hmmm. If this article is correct the FAA never banned anything flying over the Ukraine where this Malaysian aircraft was shot down:

In April, the FAA declared Ukraine's troubled Crimean peninsula a virtual no-fly zone for US air carriers and pilots.

Its so-called Special Federal Aviation Regulation -- in effect for a year, pending developments -- did not extend to all of Ukraine, including the eastern portion where Malaysian Airlines Flight MH17 went down Thursday.

http://news.yahoo.com/delta-stops-routing-flights-ukrainian-airspace-192432117.html

Looks like the corporations are doing it on their own.

Fern

 

[Fern]

Originally Posted by Zorba View Post
That was an easy decision for the FAA to make, because I doubt any normally scheduled US flight flew over that airspace, since US Flag Carriers can't do Europe to Asia routes.

Actually it looks like Delta Airlines goes from New York/New Jersey to western Russia, what are you talking about.

IDK if he's correct or not, but he said "Europe to Asia routes" and your example is USA to Asia. Not the same thing.

Fern

 

[sunzt]

IDK if he's correct or not, but he said "Europe to Asia routes" and your example is USA to Asia. Not the same thing.

Fern

Doesn't matter the origin/destination, as long as it flew through the airspace.

 

[Victorian Gray]

Yep good thing Malaysian Airlines isn't owned by the government...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malaysia_Airlines#Corporate_information

Oh wait ^_^

So you are claiming that it's not a publicly traded company that was incorporated back in 1937?

Did you even read your link? Seems like a whole bunch of shareholders are involved not to mention that the holding company that holds the majority of shares seems anxious to sell a lot of those shares

"Following the Widespread Asset Unbundling (WAU) restructuring of Malaysia Airlines, Malaysian Government investment arm and holding company, Khazanah Nasional's subsidiary, Penerbangan Malaysia Berhad[25] is the majority shareholder with a 52.0% stake.[25] After Penerbangan Malaysia Berhad, the second-largest shareholder is Khazanah Nasional, which holds 17.33% of the shares. Minority shareholders include Employees Provident Fund Board (10.72%), Amanah Raya Nominees (Tempatan) Sdn Bhd (5.69%), State Financial Secretary Sarawak (2.71%), foreign shareholders (5.13%)[25] and Warisan Harta Sabah (2.4%). It has 19,546 employees (as of March, 2007).[26] The Malaysian government reported that the government's holding company, Khazanah Nasional is keen on selling shares of Malaysia Airlines to remain globally competitive in an industry which is fast-consolidating.[27]"

Troll fails again.

 

[t1gran]

I've just listened Russian rebels phone negotiations, published on YouTube by Ukrainian intelligence service. It proves the plain was shot by Russian militants. Final words of the officer, when he was told it was a civil plain: "So, they carried spies, f... them. They should have not f... fly, it's a f... war"

 

[Victorian Gray]

Yep good thing Malaysian Airlines isn't owned by the government...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malaysia_Airlines#Corporate_information

Oh wait ^_^

still waiting

 

[Londo_Jowo]

US to Moscow flights take a more northerly route and wouldn't pass over Ukraine. Nor do flights heading from Moscow to Southeast Asia. Only flights heading from Western Europe to Southeast Asia would fly close to Ukraine.

 

[-slash-]

The way conservatives have been behaving, a GOP president would be making excuses for Russia's behavior like a battered wife does for her abusive husband.

*McCain/Romney slips Putin a note at the G8 meeting: "Do you like me? One wink for yes, two winks for no*

Speculation with no backing when presented with facts. Typical liberal spin. No facts, no action, no inkling to the effectiveness of anything the current party has done regarding the situation. Your comparison to a battered wife swings both ways, the current party just keeps saying stop without fixing the situation (calling the cops for your simple mind).

"Yeah we haven't done anything, but you wouldn't either"

 

[Zorba]

Actually it looks like Delta Airlines goes from New York/New Jersey to western Russia, what are you talking about.

False. Apparently Delta did. United flies more international flights than Delta so I would imagine they did as well.

http://news.yahoo.com/delta-stops-routing-flights-ukrainian-airspace-192432117.html

Delta noted that it does not operate any flights over another area in Ukraine subject to a US Federal Aviation Administration security advisory.

http://www.gcmap.com/mapui?P=JFK-SVO and according to Delta's website JFK-SVO is the only flight they fly into Russia.

United doesn't even fly to Moscow, and I know American cancelled their Moscow flights a few years ago, don't think they brought it back.

You guys just fell for typical airline PR. Delta says they won't fly over Ukraine anymore, they get press, even though they never did. Giving them a huge benefit of the doubt, maybe they meant they won't code share on routes that do overfly Ukraine, but I doubt that.

When the FAA makes rules they weigh the impact of those rules, when there is no impact, the rule is easy to push through. If it affected hundreds of flights it is harder to push. Which is probably why the FAA had pushed it through but EASA hadn't.

BTW: I've been in the Airline industry for years.

EDIT: Yesterdays DL466 flight to Moscow: Link and the day before. It doesn't look like the schedule flight path goes over the extreme western edge of Ukraine for some reason, all the tracks that actually show the real path have it on the GC route, though.

And the return: Link

 

[nehalem256]

So you are claiming that it's not a publicly traded company that was incorporated back in 1937?

Did you even read your link? Seems like a whole bunch of shareholders are involved not to mention that the holding company that holds the majority of shares seems anxious to sell a lot of those shares

"Following the Widespread Asset Unbundling (WAU) restructuring of Malaysia Airlines, Malaysian Government investment arm and holding company, Khazanah Nasional's subsidiary, Penerbangan Malaysia Berhad[25] is the majority shareholder with a 52.0% stake.[25] After Penerbangan Malaysia Berhad, the second-largest shareholder is Khazanah Nasional, which holds 17.33% of the shares. Minority shareholders include Employees Provident Fund Board (10.72%), Amanah Raya Nominees (Tempatan) Sdn Bhd (5.69%), State Financial Secretary Sarawak (2.71%), foreign shareholders (5.13%)[25] and Warisan Harta Sabah (2.4%). It has 19,546 employees (as of March, 2007).[26] The Malaysian government reported that the government's holding company, Khazanah Nasional is keen on selling shares of Malaysia Airlines to remain globally competitive in an industry which is fast-consolidating.[27]"

Troll fails again.

Its a publicly traded company that is majority owned by the Malaysian government. If you are the majority owner of a company that means you have a pretty substantial say in how its run right?

So presumably if the Malaysian government cared about people not being blown up by SAMs they could make sure the planes were routed around areas that was likely to happen.

 

[nehalem256]

Actually it looks like Delta Airlines goes from New York/New Jersey to western Russia, what are you talking about.

Which continent is western Russia located in?

HINT: Its not in Asia.

 

[Zorba]

Doesn't matter the origin/destination, as long as it flew through the airspace.

Except airlines try to fly as close to the great circle route as possible, so origin/destination does matter a lot.

 

[JEDIYoda]

who wants to buy my Malaysian Frequent Flyer Miles?????

 

[Phokus]

Which continent is western Russia located in?

HINT: Its not in Asia.

Russia is one of the few transcontinental nations, you tremendous dumbass:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_transcontinental_countries

The IMPORTANT part is that Ukraine is to the WEST of Western Russia

 

[squarecut1]

who wants to buy my Malaysian Frequent Flyer Miles?????

Not in good taste

 

[Londo_Jowo]

Except airlines try to fly as close to the great circle route as possible, so origin/destination does matter a lot.

Yep, many flights fly northerly routes as it's shorter and uses less fuel.

When I flew on Singapore Air from Houston-Moscow-Singapore it flew from Houston over Canada, Greenland, Norway, Sweden, Finland, and into Russia.

http://www.gcmap.com/mapui?P=IAH-DME

The route from Moscow to Singapore started well north of Ukraine and didn't get any closer.

http://www.gcmap.com/mapui?P=DME-SIN

 

[Zorba]

who wants to buy my Malaysian Frequent Flyer Miles?????

It is getting harder and harder to fly in SE Asia, since Lion Air and pretty much every other Indonesian airline should be avoided.