Another milestone in Iraq

[umbrella39]

Originally posted by: jpeyton

Originally posted by: RabidMongoose

Originally posted by: EatSpam

Originally posted by: RabidMongoose

Originally posted by: EatSpam

Originally posted by: Pabster
Yep, all is lost. We should have just left Saddam in power. <sigh>

Yes, we should have. He never hurt me or anyone in my country.

Wow, you must be a great humanitarian! :laugh:

I just don't like to see my country's resources wasted on foolish things. We have enough people in this country with problems...when we're perfect, we can worry about the other countries.

Yup, great humanitarian outlook there.

Here's an idea: You don't have to be perfect to help other people out. Perfect is a state that can never really be achieved.

So spending $200 billion on our OWN people who live below the poverty line wouldn't be humanitarian?

Or how about helping nations in Africa? Hundreds of millions living oppressed, starving, and diseased over there. I'm sure $200 billion could do a lot there too. So why not help over there instead of Iraq?

Oil. Halliburton. Military spending.

Three things we wouldn't have if we decided to help humanity elsewhere.

/thread

 

[umbrella39]

Originally posted by: Taggart

Originally posted by: Pabster

Originally posted by: Taggart
Let's say Hussein was left in power. He would have continued to violate UN resolutions, and eventually the sanctions would be lifted. You can't tell me that someone so insane, so narcissistic and shown to have used WMD on people in his own country, wouldn't reactivate his weapons program? He would not have stood idly by as Iran developed nuclear weapons. Disregarding every other motivation, a nuclear Iran would be reason alone for Saddam to reactivate his programs. I will never believe in a million years that as soon as the pressure was off Saddam he wouldn't start making WMD's again.

I am not advocating or disagreeing with invasion in this post. I simply cannot agree that Hussein's Iraq wasn't a threat to the US and the world.

Don't even bother to reason with these clowns. The liberals will never admit that the world (and the US in particular) is better off without Saddam. After all, if it had been Kerry, Saddam would still be in power, doing the things you mention.

You can argue about the war; but to continue this charade that somehow we are not safer without Saddam is asinine.

It amazes me that someone thinks it would be ok to have allowed Saddam to get nuclear weapons. People are entitled to their opinions. Thankfully, it's probably less than 1% of the population that holds this view. Probably less than that, actually. There are 280 million Americans, I would bet less than 1 million, and that's being generous.

It amazes me more that someone thinks that Saddam lacked the money or the know how to attain them in the first place. People like you think he was running around blind trying to figure out a way to get a warhead and point then launch it at America. If that had been his goal, he would have done it. You are in the minority no matter how much you try and kid yourself.

 

[mOeeOm]

Originally posted by: umbrella39

Originally posted by: Taggart

Originally posted by: Pabster

Originally posted by: Taggart
Let's say Hussein was left in power. He would have continued to violate UN resolutions, and eventually the sanctions would be lifted. You can't tell me that someone so insane, so narcissistic and shown to have used WMD on people in his own country, wouldn't reactivate his weapons program? He would not have stood idly by as Iran developed nuclear weapons. Disregarding every other motivation, a nuclear Iran would be reason alone for Saddam to reactivate his programs. I will never believe in a million years that as soon as the pressure was off Saddam he wouldn't start making WMD's again.

I am not advocating or disagreeing with invasion in this post. I simply cannot agree that Hussein's Iraq wasn't a threat to the US and the world.

Don't even bother to reason with these clowns. The liberals will never admit that the world (and the US in particular) is better off without Saddam. After all, if it had been Kerry, Saddam would still be in power, doing the things you mention.

You can argue about the war; but to continue this charade that somehow we are not safer without Saddam is asinine.

It amazes me that someone thinks it would be ok to have allowed Saddam to get nuclear weapons. People are entitled to their opinions. Thankfully, it's probably less than 1% of the population that holds this view. Probably less than that, actually. There are 280 million Americans, I would bet less than 1 million, and that's being generous.

It amazes me more that someone thinks that Saddam lacked the money or the know how to attain them in the first place. People like you think he was running around blind trying to figure out a way to get a warhead and point then launch it at America. If that had been his goal, he would have done it. You are in the minority no matter how much you try and kid yourself.

GG.

 

[shira]

Originally posted by: BBond
I have so much more faith in THE PRESIDENT after the example he set for all of the world to see in his forceful response to Hurricane Katrina.

Yeah, I took just love his forcdfulness. For example, there was that forceful, "You're doing a great job, Brownie!" uttered at his first post-Katrina news conference, less than a week before Brown resigned in shame. There was the forceful way he cut short his 5-week vacation. The forceful way he doesn't read newspapers, books, or any other information sources. The forceful way he "accepted responsibility" for the failed government response to Katrina, without telling any of us what exactly he was accepting responsibility for.

Maybe it's just the fact that he walks with a swagger, acts like his incompetence is an annointment from God, and can barely suppress a smirk with every ignorant comment he makes and every misguided action he takes.

Until recently, I didn't fully understand what makes people like Bush so dangerous: It's the fact that there are tens of millionis of Americans who see nothing beyond the image. They want "strength". They want "vision". They want sometone who ACTS as though he knows what he's doing. It's the craving for Moses, for Jesus, for a Messiah. Real answers, real truth, are irrelevant.

 

[HardWarrior]

Isn't it amazing that anyone who sees this BS for what it is are automatically branded a "liberal" by these chimps? It doesn't matter that there are MANY conservatives, some of note, who've said that this endeavor was insane from the start. All of you pro-war goons wouldn't know a conservative thought if it punched you in the mouth. And the fun doesn't stop there, the chickenhawk PUSSIES who spend their time here name-calling, avoiding anything factual and doing their best impressions of thought-controlled vegetables won't volunteer to help bring their heroic fantasies about. They have "other priorites", I guess.

"Just ignore the facts, ignore common sense, ignore the billion or so people who DESPISE us, ignore the death\brutality\cost of this "war of choice", ignore national AND international law and ignore your own eyes and ears, everthing will be fine, because we're AMERICA!" This is the mantra of fools, future slaves and intellectual cowards.

 

[mOeeOm]

Originally posted by: HardWarrior
Isn't it amazing that anyone who sees this BS for what it is are automatically branded a "liberal" by these chimps? It doesn't matter that there are MANY conservatives, some of note, who've said that this endeavor was insane from the start. All of you pro-war goons wouldn't know a conservative thought if it punched you in the mouth. And the fun doesn't stop there, the chickenhawk PUSSIES who spend their time here name-calling, avoiding anything factual and doing their best impressions of thought-controlled vegetables won't volunteer to help bring their heroic fantasies about. They have "other priorites", I guess.

"Just ignore the facts, ignore common sense, ignore the billion or so people who DESPISE us, ignore the death\brutality\cost of this "war of choice", ignore national AND international law and ignore your own eyes and ears, everthing will be fine, because we're AMERICA!" The is the mantra of fools, future slaves and intellectual cowards.

Would you stop being such a liberal?

 

[HardWarrior]

Originally posted by: mOeeOm

Originally posted by: HardWarrior
Isn't it amazing that anyone who sees this BS for what it is are automatically branded a "liberal" by these chimps? It doesn't matter that there are MANY conservatives, some of note, who've said that this endeavor was insane from the start. All of you pro-war goons wouldn't know a conservative thought if it punched you in the mouth. And the fun doesn't stop there, the chickenhawk PUSSIES who spend their time here name-calling, avoiding anything factual and doing their best impressions of thought-controlled vegetables won't volunteer to help bring their heroic fantasies about. They have "other priorites", I guess.

"Just ignore the facts, ignore common sense, ignore the billion or so people who DESPISE us, ignore the death\brutality\cost of this "war of choice", ignore national AND international law and ignore your own eyes and ears, everthing will be fine, because we're AMERICA!" The is the mantra of fools, future slaves and intellectual cowards.

Would you stop being such a liberal?

The really crazy thing about the liberal=anti-war+sissy equation is that it isn't even true. Don't true lefties like Hillary and Kerry think that this stuff is just fine, and that we should feed even more troops into the meat-grinder?

 

[dahunan]

Originally posted by: Pabster

Originally posted by: Taggart
Let's say Hussein was left in power. He would have continued to violate UN resolutions, and eventually the sanctions would be lifted. You can't tell me that someone so insane, so narcissistic and shown to have used WMD on people in his own country, wouldn't reactivate his weapons program? He would not have stood idly by as Iran developed nuclear weapons. Disregarding every other motivation, a nuclear Iran would be reason alone for Saddam to reactivate his programs. I will never believe in a million years that as soon as the pressure was off Saddam he wouldn't start making WMD's again.

I am not advocating or disagreeing with invasion in this post. I simply cannot agree that Hussein's Iraq wasn't a threat to the US and the world.

Don't even bother to reason with these clowns. The liberals will never admit that the world (and the US in particular) is better off without Saddam. After all, if it had been Kerry, Saddam would still be in power, doing the things you mention.

You can argue about the war; but to continue this charade that somehow we are not safer without Saddam is asinine.

I HONESTLY wonder if things were this bad in Iraq under Saddam?

Please.. think for more than 4 minutes before answering thta question.

 

[mOeeOm]

No they weren't, well all I have is hearsay, my Aunt lived in Iraq for many years with her husband before leaving after the whole American/Iraq thing, she told us it was waaaaaaaaaaay better with Saddam and not as bad as the media makes it seem. But hey, because she's a Muslim she is an extremist and spreading concipracy theories, right?

 

[dahunan]

Originally posted by: mOeeOm
No they weren't, well all I have is hearsay, my Aunt lived in Iraq for many years with her husband before leaving after the whole American/Iraq thing, she told us it was waaaaaaaaaaay better with Saddam and not as bad as the media makes it seem. But hey, because she's a Muslim she is an extremist and spreading concipracy theories, right?

I know that some of his henchmen had horrible habits and his sons supposedly did too..

but I totally agree that things are TRUE HELL now in Iraq compared to what it was under Saddam

^^^ this is why I hate Conservatives/Republicans who support Bush and this war

True story: before the invasion and occupation started I would sit in my home and try to imagine myself being a Iraqi man who was sitting in his own home in Iraq and what must be on his mind concerning the coming invasion... I was scared to death.. all that was going through my mind was the stories of missiles not hitting their target and murdering 50-100 citizens in their apartments and the fear of american bombs and missiles was just intense...

 

[K1052]

Originally posted by: mOeeOm
No they weren't, well all I have is hearsay, my Aunt lived in Iraq for many years with her husband before leaving after the whole American/Iraq thing, she told us it was waaaaaaaaaaay better with Saddam and not as bad as the media makes it seem. But hey, because she's a Muslim she is an extremist and spreading concipracy theories, right?

I assume your family that lived there were Sunni, like yourself, and thus had the most to lose with the falling of Saddam's rule.

 

[mOeeOm]

Originally posted by: K1052

Originally posted by: mOeeOm
No they weren't, well all I have is hearsay, my Aunt lived in Iraq for many years with her husband before leaving after the whole American/Iraq thing, she told us it was waaaaaaaaaaay better with Saddam and not as bad as the media makes it seem. But hey, because she's a Muslim she is an extremist and spreading concipracy theories, right?

I assume your family that lived there were Sunni, like yourself, and thus had the most to lose with the falling of Saddam's rule.

Actually yes we're sunni, but we live(d) in Kuwait and Yemen...only my Aunt was in Iraq, and she was just there to study, for so many years? None of us lost anything whether Saddam was in power or not....she was going to move back to Yemen anyways.

Nice try though!

 

[jpeyton]

Originally posted by: mOeeOm

Originally posted by: K1052

Originally posted by: mOeeOm
No they weren't, well all I have is hearsay, my Aunt lived in Iraq for many years with her husband before leaving after the whole American/Iraq thing, she told us it was waaaaaaaaaaay better with Saddam and not as bad as the media makes it seem. But hey, because she's a Muslim she is an extremist and spreading concipracy theories, right?

I assume your family that lived there were Sunni, like yourself, and thus had the most to lose with the falling of Saddam's rule.

Actually yes we're sunni, but we live(d) in Kuwait and Yemen...only my Aunt was in Iraq, and she was just there to study, for so many years? None of us lost anything whether Saddam was in power or not....she was going to move back to Yemen anyways.

Nice try though!

Don't blame him. It's the American way to believe you know more than everyone else because you have access to 5 cable news channels. Of course he would rather form his opinions based on pundit rhetoric vs. listening to the people on the ground, like your aunt.

 

[K1052]

Originally posted by: mOeeOm

Originally posted by: K1052

Originally posted by: mOeeOm
No they weren't, well all I have is hearsay, my Aunt lived in Iraq for many years with her husband before leaving after the whole American/Iraq thing, she told us it was waaaaaaaaaaay better with Saddam and not as bad as the media makes it seem. But hey, because she's a Muslim she is an extremist and spreading concipracy theories, right?

I assume your family that lived there were Sunni, like yourself, and thus had the most to lose with the falling of Saddam's rule.

Actually yes we're sunni, but we live(d) in Kuwait and Yemen...only my Aunt was in Iraq, and she was just there to study, for so many years? None of us lost anything whether Saddam was in power or not....she was going to move back to Yemen anyways.

Nice try though!

She would have certainly been the LEAST likely of anyone there to see the not so nice side of Saddam.

 

[mOeeOm]

Originally posted by: jpeyton

Originally posted by: mOeeOm

Originally posted by: K1052

Originally posted by: mOeeOm
No they weren't, well all I have is hearsay, my Aunt lived in Iraq for many years with her husband before leaving after the whole American/Iraq thing, she told us it was waaaaaaaaaaay better with Saddam and not as bad as the media makes it seem. But hey, because she's a Muslim she is an extremist and spreading concipracy theories, right?

I assume your family that lived there were Sunni, like yourself, and thus had the most to lose with the falling of Saddam's rule.

Actually yes we're sunni, but we live(d) in Kuwait and Yemen...only my Aunt was in Iraq, and she was just there to study, for so many years? None of us lost anything whether Saddam was in power or not....she was going to move back to Yemen anyways.

Nice try though!

Don't blame him. It's the American way to believe you know more than everyone else because you have access to 5 cable news channels. Of course he would rather form his opinions based on pundit rhetoric vs. listening to the people on the ground, like your aunt.

Yup, I see a lot of that on the forum...

 

[K1052]

Originally posted by: jpeyton

Originally posted by: mOeeOm

Originally posted by: K1052

Originally posted by: mOeeOm
No they weren't, well all I have is hearsay, my Aunt lived in Iraq for many years with her husband before leaving after the whole American/Iraq thing, she told us it was waaaaaaaaaaay better with Saddam and not as bad as the media makes it seem. But hey, because she's a Muslim she is an extremist and spreading concipracy theories, right?

I assume your family that lived there were Sunni, like yourself, and thus had the most to lose with the falling of Saddam's rule.

Actually yes we're sunni, but we live(d) in Kuwait and Yemen...only my Aunt was in Iraq, and she was just there to study, for so many years? None of us lost anything whether Saddam was in power or not....she was going to move back to Yemen anyways.

Nice try though!

Don't blame him. It's the American way to believe you know more than everyone else because you have access to 5 cable news channels. Of course he would rather form his opinions based on pundit rhetoric vs. listening to the people on the ground, like your aunt.

On a forum where we swim eyeball deep in bias I should have thought that at least considering the source would be prudent.

Oh well, too much to ask I suppose.

 

[dahunan]

Y'all know that Iraqi Christians were SIGNIFICANTLY SAFER UNDER SADDAMS's RULE than they are now.. right?

Iraq is so fvcked up right now and has been for TWO YEARS STRAIGHT.. no school .. no real jobs.. murders left and right ... lawlessness... kidnappings.. assasinations.. etc etc

 

[K1052]

Originally posted by: dahunan
Y'all know that Iraqi Christians were SIGNIFICANTLY SAFER UNDER SADDAMS's RULE than they are now.. right?

Iraq is so fvcked up right now and has been for TWO YEARS STRAIGHT.. no school .. no real jobs.. murders left and right ... lawlessness... kidnappings.. assasinations.. etc etc

For the record, I was never a big fan of this action in the first place. I don't expect it to turn out well even though I do really hope it will.

However, defending Saddam as a providing shining beacon of how a state should run is completely insane.

 

[dahunan]

Originally posted by: K1052

Originally posted by: dahunan
Y'all know that Iraqi Christians were SIGNIFICANTLY SAFER UNDER SADDAMS's RULE than they are now.. right?

Iraq is so fvcked up right now and has been for TWO YEARS STRAIGHT.. no school .. no real jobs.. murders left and right ... lawlessness... kidnappings.. assasinations.. etc etc

For the record, I was never a big fan of this action in the first place. I don't expect it to turn out well even though I do really hope it will.

However, defending Saddam as a providing shining beacon of how a state should run is completely insane.

I give zero defense of Saddam.. but as we can all see.. there were serious tensions between religious factions/extremists there that he had to deal with .. his methods were despicable and not just...

I do however truly believe that we were only told what OUR Govts wanted us to hear.. whether it was the truth or just propaganda...

Remember the stories about Iraqi soldiers going into Kuwait and throwing babies from incubators and onto the floor in Kuwaiti Hospitals.. *it was used to get the American Sheeple to support the war ****turned out after the war that is was ALL BS -- lies and propaganda started by our govt. -- the truth is only what they want us to know

 

[dahunan]

The stories about Hallabjah .. "gassed his own citizens" -- I have read freedom of information papers that quoted CIA ops.. as saying the deaths were from materials that were only known to be used by IRAN/Islamic Republic at that time... and they could not say it was Saddam.. WE also knew what Saddam did and didn't have because we were working with him and helping to supply him with weapons against Iran...

 

[K1052]

Originally posted by: dahunan

Originally posted by: K1052

Originally posted by: dahunan
Y'all know that Iraqi Christians were SIGNIFICANTLY SAFER UNDER SADDAMS's RULE than they are now.. right?

Iraq is so fvcked up right now and has been for TWO YEARS STRAIGHT.. no school .. no real jobs.. murders left and right ... lawlessness... kidnappings.. assasinations.. etc etc

For the record, I was never a big fan of this action in the first place. I don't expect it to turn out well even though I do really hope it will.

However, defending Saddam as a providing shining beacon of how a state should run is completely insane.

I give zero defense of Saddam.. but as we can all see.. there were serious tensions between religious factions/extremists there that he had to deal with .. his methods were despicable and not just...

I do however truly believe that we were only told what OUR Govts wanted us to hear.. whether it was the truth or just propaganda...

Remember the stories about Iraqi soldiers going into Kuwait and throwing babies from incubators and onto the floor in Kuwaiti Hospitals.. *it was used to get the American Sheeple to support the war ****turned out after the war that is was ALL BS -- lies and propaganda started by our govt. -- the truth is only what they want us to know

Yes I remember that and also that our own news agencies were only too happy to oblige at the time. The problem with the news is that getting it right ususally takes a back seat to getting it first.

Though, very few nations were happy to see Saddam sieze Kuwait and as such decided to (rightfully) restore that country's sovereignty.

 

[CanOWorms]

Originally posted by: dahunan
The stories about Hallabjah .. "gassed his own citizens" -- I have read freedom of information papers that quoted CIA ops.. as saying the deaths were from materials that were only known to be used by IRAN/Islamic Republic at that time... and they could not say it was Saddam.. WE also knew what Saddam did and didn't have because we were working with him and helping to supply him with weapons against Iran...

Nah, I think it was space aliens that gassed the undesirable Kurds. Let's forget that they were allied with Iran. And the fact that the US never provided full-fledge chemical weapons to Iraq.

 

[dahunan]

I had read and heard that the Kuwaitis were Slant-Drilling into Iraqi oilfields and Stealing oil from Iraq.. Knowingly

 

[CanOWorms]

Originally posted by: dahunan
I had read and heard that the Kuwaitis were Slant-Drilling into Iraqi oilfields and Stealing oil from Iraq.. Knowingly

I heard that aliens also stole Iraq's oil. Or maybe Iraq owed Kuwait tens of billions of dollars and Kuwait wouldn't forgive it, Kuwait refused to cut oil production, believed that Kuwait had no right to exist (believed it was created by the British), and also the slant drilling into the disputed border. I don't think that things are as simple as you think they are.

 

[CanOWorms]

I think that it's really sad that many people view Saddam as some sort of folk hero now. I didn't agree with the invasion, but I don't see why you have to think that Saddam is a hero just because you're against Bush. Many people view Hitler as a sort of folk hero nowadays too.