Anti immigrant riots in the UK and our weak open border policy in America

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Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
73,193
6,319
126
That's the problem with haters of democracy!

Democracy allows them to demonstrate democracy doesn't work by just blockading any progress.

As stated by Gobbels (Hitler's #2) himself:

“We are an anti-parliamentarian party that for good reasons rejects the Weimar constitution and its republican institutions. We oppose a fake democracy that treats the intelligent and the foolish, the industrious and the lazy, in the same way. We see in the present system of majorities and organized irresponsibility the main cause of our steadily increasing miseries.

So why do we want to be in the Reichstag?

We enter the Reichstag to arm ourselves with the weapons of democracy. If democracy is foolish enough to give us free railway passes and salaries, that is its problem. It does not concern us. Any way of bringing about the revolution is fine by us.

If we succeed in getting sixty or seventy of our party’s agitators and organizers elected to the various parliaments, the state itself will pay for our fighting organization. That is amusing and entertaining enough to be worth trying.

Will we be corrupted by joining parliament? Not likely. Do you think us such miserable revolutionaries that you fear that the thick red carpets and the well-upholstered sleeping halls will make us forget our historical mission?

Is our entry into the Reichstag the beginning of a compromise? Do you really think that we who have stood before you a hundred or a thousand times preaching faith in a new Germany, who have smilingly faced death dozens of times from the red mob, who have joined you in battling every form of resistance whether of official or nonofficial nature, who have bent before no command or terror, do you really think that we would lay down our weapons in exchange for a railroad pass?

If we only wanted to become representatives, we would not be National Socialists, but German National Party members or Social Democrats. We do not beg for votes. We demand conviction, devotion, passion! A vote is only a tool for us as well as for you. We will march into the marble halls of parliament, bringing with us the revolutionary will of the broad masses from which we came, called by fate and forming fate. We do not want to join this pile of manure. We are coming to shovel it out.


Do not believe that parliament is our goal. We have shown the enemy our nature from the podiums of our mass meetings and in the enormous demonstrations of our brown army. We will show it as well in the leaden atmosphere of parliament. We are coming neither as friends or neutrals. We come as enemies! As the wolf attacks the sheep, so come we. You are not among your friends any longer! You will not enjoy having us among you!”
This is profoundly interesting. I see in it the ginned up self importance of a mindset born of personal despair and shattered childhood optimism, of deep inner rage and a desire for self affirmation via bad ass self puffery pronounced as a death threat. “ I will make you as dead as I am and pronounce it as Holy War.”
 

HomerJS

Lifer
Feb 6, 2002
36,620
28,746
136
Actually the biggest change was Biden's scrapping of "Remain in Mexico" for asylum seekers. He let them revenge migrate here en masse and even wanted to compensate those who were not able to get in during the previous administration.
So you are saying the end of remain in Mexico caused open borders.

I took the initiative to look up 2 sets of numbers. Illegal southern border crossings Dec 2020 and June 2024 per the CBP

Dec 2020 Trump’s last full month 73,203
July 2024 57,000 estimated

Now, tell me again about who has open borders?? Or maybe you don’t know the definition of open borders. I’ll let you clarify.
 

sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
70,217
5,796
126
I hope Musk goes broke. He's turned out to be a wolf in sheep's clothing. Openly encouraging Civil War in Britain is immoral and stupid.
 
Reactions: iRONic

FelixDeCat

Lifer
Aug 4, 2000
29,569
2,247
126
I hope Musk goes broke. He's turned out to be a wolf in sheep's clothing. Openly encouraging Civil War in Britain is immoral and stupid.
I agree. Calling for violence for any reason is irrational and reckless. Considering his wealth he should be held responsible.
 

FelixDeCat

Lifer
Aug 4, 2000
29,569
2,247
126
So you are saying the end of remain in Mexico caused open borders.

I took the initiative to look up 2 sets of numbers. Illegal southern border crossings Dec 2020 and June 2024 per the CBP

Dec 2020 Trump’s last full month 73,203
July 2024 57,000 estimated

Now, tell me again about who has open borders?? Or maybe you don’t know the definition of open borders. I’ll let you clarify.
That's cherry picking. People love to cite more apprehensions during Democratic administrations however the difference is we send them home. Democrats apprend but then release instead of deport like they should.

Those who claim asylum should not be allowed to accumulate while waiting years for a hearing. They should remain in friendly countries like Mexico.
 

HomerJS

Lifer
Feb 6, 2002
36,620
28,746
136
That's cherry picking. People love to cite more apprehensions during Democratic administrations however the difference is we send them home. Democrats apprend but then release instead of deport like they should.

Those who claim asylum should not be allowed to accumulate while waiting years for a hearing. They should remain in friendly countries like Mexico.
Using Trump's last number and Biden's latest number is less cherry-picking vs the "open border claim" is complete bullshit. The numbers fluctuate over time. Example Biden's worse numbers are close to Bush's worse numbers and no one claimed he had open borders.

Another claim that Trump "secured" the border while never defining what that means.
 

Amused

Elite Member
Apr 14, 2001
56,476
16,115
146
Using Trump's last number and Biden's latest number is less cherry-picking vs the "open border claim" is complete bullshit. The numbers fluctuate over time. Example Biden's worse numbers are close to Bush's worse numbers and no one claimed he had open borders.

Another claim that Trump "secured" the border while never defining what that means.

Yep. Felix here is falling for the boogieman rage porn while the oligarchs convince him to vote against his own self interest.
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
85,533
50,706
136
That's cherry picking. People love to cite more apprehensions during Democratic administrations however the difference is we send them home. Democrats apprend but then release instead of deport like they should.

Those who claim asylum should not be allowed to accumulate while waiting years for a hearing. They should remain in friendly countries like Mexico.
What's funny is that Republicans deliberately voted to make asylum cases take longer to adjudicate.

Sounds like you shouldn't vote for people who do that.
 

dank69

Lifer
Oct 6, 2009
36,057
30,361
136
I'm a touch confused here. If the voters elect an anti immigration president, isn't that democracy? Isn't that the will of the various states?
The will of the states, lol. Very telling how he worded that. Can't claim the will of the people because the anti-immigration president didn't get the most votes.
 

iRONic

Diamond Member
Jan 28, 2006
7,425
2,683
136
Shitlol

This local pastor tells you everything you need to know about what the state of Texas is doing to/at the border:

“It’s all a political show and they’re using Eagle Pass as a pawn for their political games,” Leyva said. “I’m for border security, but if they would use that money for the infrastructure here, we’d be in hog heaven,” he said.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news...le-pass-texas-migration-border-trump-election
 

Jaskalas

Lifer
Jun 23, 2004
33,922
7,953
136
Daily reminder that the border is not "open".
Define not open.
People arrive. People stay.
Our border patrol helps escort them in for safety and processing. After processing they are free to stay until some court date in a future year, where a good number of them never show.

As an advocate for sustainability, I want to see our population stop growing. As immigration (legal and otherwise) is the source of our growth, I must oppose its unfettered access. And I find it absurd that a process without immediate expulsion is defined as anything other than open. It is a game that is played, all the while more people enter... and more people stay. All the while we divide finite land and resources among an ever larger population. Spreading us thinner and thinner per person.

Luckily for Democrats, we have more pressing issues. And are likely to have them for the foreseeable future.
 
Reactions: FelixDeCat

WelshBloke

Lifer
Jan 12, 2005
31,379
9,268
136
Define not open.
People arrive. People stay.
Our border patrol helps escort them in for safety and processing. After processing they are free to stay until some court date in a future year, where a good number of them never show.

As an advocate for sustainability, I want to see our population stop growing. As immigration (legal and otherwise) is the source of our growth, I must oppose its unfettered access. And I find it absurd that a process without immediate expulsion is defined as anything other than open. It is a game that is played, all the while more people enter... and more people stay. All the while we divide finite land and resources among an ever larger population. Spreading us thinner and thinner per person.

Luckily for Democrats, we have more pressing issues. And are likely to have them for the foreseeable future.
There are definitely arguments for controlling immigration but the US being overpopulated is not one of them.

 

Indus

Lifer
May 11, 2002
11,607
8,057
136
There are definitely arguments for controlling immigration but the US being overpopulated is not one of them.

View attachment 105206

98.5% of the US I would agree with you but San Francisco and NYC and some other city centers are so densely populated.. people get road rage just from not being able to find parking for hours..

Hell I took my wife hiking to a state park upstate and it's 115 miles away. Took me 2.5 hours.. Of that 1.5 hours was in the city and suburbs. Once I got past that I could easily do 80 MPH or more on the highway. Same thing on the way back.. did 100 miles in an hour and the last 15 took another hour and a half.

So there are some densely populated areas that just can't handle any more but if more housing were built in suburbs or rural areas.. I think the US could handle more.
 
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ch33zw1z

Lifer
Nov 4, 2004
38,139
18,623
146
98.5% of the US I would agree with you but San Francisco and NYC and some other city centers are so densely populated.. people get road rage just from not being able to find parking for hours..

Hell I took my wife hiking to a state park upstate and it's 115 miles away. Took me 2.5 hours.. Of that 1.5 hours was in the city and suburbs. Once I got past that I could easily do 80 MPH or more on the highway. Same thing on the way back.. did 100 miles in an hour and the last 15 took another hour and a half.

So there are some densely populated areas that just can't handle any more but if more housing were built in suburbs or rural areas.. I think the US could handle more.

Bro, can you not go 100 mph and just enjoy the ride?
 
Reactions: Indus

ch33zw1z

Lifer
Nov 4, 2004
38,139
18,623
146

Pens1566

Lifer
Oct 11, 2005
12,224
9,026
136
Define not open.
People arrive. People stay.
Our border patrol helps escort them in for safety and processing. After processing they are free to stay until some court date in a future year, where a good number of them never show.

As an advocate for sustainability, I want to see our population stop growing. As immigration (legal and otherwise) is the source of our growth, I must oppose its unfettered access. And I find it absurd that a process without immediate expulsion is defined as anything other than open. It is a game that is played, all the while more people enter... and more people stay. All the while we divide finite land and resources among an ever larger population. Spreading us thinner and thinner per person.

Luckily for Democrats, we have more pressing issues. And are likely to have them for the foreseeable future.

Not everyone gets in. We stop/turn away millions every day. It's highly disingenuous to suggest the border is in anyway "open".

Also, fun fact, vast majority of "illegals" are those on overstayed visas that come in from NOT THE SOUTHERN BORDER.
 

Stokely

Platinum Member
Jun 5, 2017
2,199
2,962
136
Yep, anyone continuing to say "open borders" when they 1) haven't been open and 2) are basically unchanged through several presidencies is not arguing in good faith. Not to say the border/immigration situation can't be improved. As noted, overstaying visas by the numbers are more of a problem, if there is a problem. Gee, another thing ignored in the terrified "THE BORDER" screeches I hear from magas. People like Desantis get people scared over border issues and FL isn't even a damn border state.

JD Vance has a plan to deport millions of people. Putting aside the abject shittiness of that, I suggest asking a bunch of businesses how they feel about it. Fruit pickers, road construction outfits, roofers, etc. Ask businesses in Springfield, OH that are hiring Haitian refugees--to the angst of Republicans of course--because the city has been losing people and nobody wants the work. Btw, ask House Republicans why they oppose funding programs that would teach immigrants English and help them assimilate--that's easy to answer, they don't want them here at all and don't want to support immigration in any way. I'm sure a lot of middle-aged fat red-blooded Americans can't wait to get out there all day in 100+ degree heat to work for low wages and little benefits.
 
Last edited:

ch33zw1z

Lifer
Nov 4, 2004
38,139
18,623
146
Yep, anyone continuing to say "open borders" when they 1) haven't been open and 2) are basically unchanged through several presidencies is not arguing in good faith. Not to say the border/immigration situation can't be improved. As noted, overstaying visas by the numbers are more of a problem, if there is a problem. Gee, another thing ignored in the terrified "THE BORDER" screeches I hear from magas. People like Desantis get people scared over border issues and FL isn't even a damn border state.

JD Vance has a plan to deport millions of people. Putting aside the abject shittiness of that, I suggest asking a bunch of businesses how they feel about it. Fruit pickers, road construction outfits, roofers, etc. Ask businesses in Springfield, OH that are hiring Haitian refugees--to the angst of Republicans of course--because the city has been losing people and nobody wants the work. Btw, ask House Republicans why they oppose funding programs that would teach immigrants English and help them assimilate--that's easy to answer, they don't want them here at all and don't want to support immigration in any way. I'm sure a lot of middle-aged fat red-blooded Americans can't wait to get out there all day in 100+ degree heat to work for low wages and little benefits.

Cutting off nose to something something BUILD THE WALL!!!!
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
85,533
50,706
136
98.5% of the US I would agree with you but San Francisco and NYC and some other city centers are so densely populated.. people get road rage just from not being able to find parking for hours..

Hell I took my wife hiking to a state park upstate and it's 115 miles away. Took me 2.5 hours.. Of that 1.5 hours was in the city and suburbs. Once I got past that I could easily do 80 MPH or more on the highway. Same thing on the way back.. did 100 miles in an hour and the last 15 took another hour and a half.

So there are some densely populated areas that just can't handle any more but if more housing were built in suburbs or rural areas.. I think the US could handle more.
At its height Manhattan had a population nearly 50% larger than it has today. San Francisco's population density is about 20% lower than that of Queens, commonly thought of as a pretty suburban borough. Both areas could easily accommodate far more density.

As far as parking goes, lol. The best thing NYC could do with its land area is eliminate free street parking entirely. What a waste of space and money.
 
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