Any electricians in the house?

[boomhower]

I am going to install a camera system in my house an was looking for an outlet in the attic and came across this hot mess. Any idea what it is/was and if can be a source to make an outlet?

 

[arkcom]

Probably a doorbell transformer. Might be able to squeeze another splice in there for an outlet, or move some to another box.

 

[Mixolydian]

Probably a doorbell transformer.

This.

 

[Drako]

Is that a packing peanut in there? :biggrin:

 

[natto fire]

Probably a doorbell transformer. Might be able to squeeze another splice in there for an outlet, or move some to another box.

I wouldn't try to put an outlet on that octagon box without a deep extension. I would find out if the transformer is working too, or if that circuit is on a switch leg.

What is the green string looking stuff?, and are those grey wires in those orange wire nuts with red and blue wires? Check for 18-24v across the transformer terminals to see if it is working. If not, check for 120v on the leads on the inside.

 

[Drako]

What is the green string looking stuff?

It looks like party popper debris

 

[bommy261]

Doesn't even look like a proper electrical junction box was used. Isn't this a fire hazard? If one of those wires shorted out and ignited that material, it would burn that wall down no problem. Typically an electrical junction box would (in the event of a short circuit that produces sparks) contain the fire somewhat so that it doesn't burn inside your wall. Also, appears that there are way too many neutral (I count 5 white wires) on that wire nut.

 

[Thebobo]

Take a sharper picture

 

[Drako]

Doesn't even look like a proper electrical junction box was used. Isn't this a fire hazard? If one of those wires shorted out and ignited that material, it would burn that wall down no problem. Typically an electrical junction box would (in the event of a short circuit that produces sparks) contain the fire somewhat so that it doesn't burn inside your wall. Also, appears that there are way too many neutral (I count 5 white wires) on that wire nut.

It looks like a standard junction box for a ceiling light, which I assume this is. I'm not sure why it's not covered up though?

 

[Greenman]

I wouldn't try to put an outlet on that octagon box without a deep extension. I would find out if the transformer is working too, or if that circuit is on a switch leg.

What is the green string looking stuff?, and are those grey wires in those orange wire nuts with red and blue wires? Check for 18-24v across the transformer terminals to see if it is working. If not, check for 120v on the leads on the inside.

I've never run across a door bell transformer on a switched leg.

 

[Thebobo]

Looks like 3 Romax cables

1. 120 V in
2. Bell switch wires
3. Bell wires

Plenty of room

 

[DrPizza]

Yes, you can use that box, but you would have to put an extension on it to make it deeper. Major pain in the ass with that many wires to deal with. Look for code for cubic inches and number of wires in the box. There's a formula you use to determine how many wires of which gauge are allowed, based on the cubic inches. Off the top of my head, I can't remember the exact formula. It's something like: all the ground wires count as one wire. Add up all your other wires. Add 2 for each device (switch, outlet, etc.), and multiply by (2? I think it's 2 for 14 gauge; not sure if it is, or what it is for 12 gauge.) Shouldn't be too hard to google. Afaik, there isn't a 4 conductor limit for wire nuts. It depends on the wire nut. I'm unaware that there is a limit (other than specifications of the wire nut.) I find it a pain in the ass at 3 conductors. Much more of a pain in the ass with 4. An incredible pain in the ass with 5. I can't recall 6, though I'm pretty sure the blue or gray wire nuts are labeled for 6 conductors (might be 6 14 gauge wires.) If you have the cubic inches available, you can take that bundle of 5, your 6th wire, and then a jumper wire of the same gauge & do two wire nuts with 4 wires each. At least, that's what I'd do, since getting them to all line up just right & get them twisted together, and that nut on, is a pain in the ass.

 

[boomhower]

It looks like a standard junction box for a ceiling light, which I assume this is. I'm not sure why it's not covered up though?

That's it. Right above my living room ceiling fan. Now why it isn't covered is a completely different question. My guess shoddy repair work by the former owner. Yet going to use a drop cord for this week. Just need to power a DVR for the cameras for a week. Had something come up last minute and need to get them up before I leave town. I'll do a proper install and run everything downstairs when I get back.

 

[Drako]

That's it. Right above my living room ceiling fan. Now why it isn't covered is a completely different question. My guess shoddy repair work by the former owner. Yet going to use a drop cord for this week. Just need to power a DVR for the cameras for a week. Had something come up last minute and need to get them up before I leave town. I'll do a proper install and run everything downstairs when I get back.

What's with the party popper streamers and the packing peanut? :biggrin:

 

[bommy261]

The transformer housing isn't in cased in a junction box. I would definitely recommend you adding an extension onto this existing box to prevent overheating. The problem is, that NEC code requires the extension to be flush with the wall, so you will have to make the existing ceiling box go deeper into the wall.

 

[JEDI]

The transformer housing isn't in cased in a junction box. I would definitely recommend you adding an extension onto this existing box to prevent overheating. The problem is, that NEC code requires the extension to be flush with the wall, so you will have to make the existing ceiling box go deeper into the wall.

he doesn't need to follow code if he does his own repairs on his house.

and for extension needs to be flush with wall, isn't that for new construction?

 

[stormkroe]

I can't verify NEC, but CEE has no restrictions on junction box protrusion amounts. And while boxes must have covers by code (the ingress of objects a few millimeters or so in size must be impossible), it's not for fire protection but so any 'hot' wires will touch ground and trip before they touch you and cook you.
If that box is in an out of the way area, spend $3 for an octagon extension, pigtail a white, black, and ground, and put a duplex octagon Taylor cover on it. Your 75 watt dvr will not trip that circuit.
Also, class 1 and 2 transformers don't have to be enclosed in boxes, but they aren't allowed to be in contact with insulation so moving it up into the knockout on the extension ring would be a step in the right direction.

 

[boomhower]

What's with the party popper streamers and the packing peanut? :biggrin:

Free extras with the house I guess. Need to get it taken out as the fan has been taken out and it's just a light now.

 

[bommy261]

he doesn't need to follow code if he does his own repairs on his house.

and for extension needs to be flush with wall, isn't that for new construction?

You need to follow code whenever you do any work on your house. See 314.19 thru 314.22. It appears that as long as your extension is flush or protrudes from your wall you should be ok.

 

[feralkid]

The transformer housing isn't in cased in a junction box. I would definitely recommend you adding an extension onto this existing box to prevent overheating. The problem is, that NEC code requires the extension to be flush with the wall, so you will have to make the existing ceiling box go deeper into the wall.

So should he first move the box from the attic floor?

 

[SparkyJJO]

You need to follow code whenever you do any work on your house. See 314.19 thru 314.22. It appears that as long as your extension is flush or protrudes from your wall you should be ok.

It is in the ceiling of an attic. That isn't a wall. No problem with making it not flush as it won't ever come near the wall

 

[Red Squirrel]

If you want to add a plug I would add another junction box, though I guess an extender can work too, I think you can get special adapters that let you put a plug on an octagon box.

There is a box fill max for junction boxes and that one looks fairly full, I would not want to add anything to it that will remove some of the space. (a plug will take up lot of room). Box extender will be ok though.

 

[13Gigatons]

I can't understand why conduit isn't code across the entire country.

I can't understand why wire nuts are allowed.

 

[feralkid]

I can't understand why conduit isn't code across the entire country.


Because it's not needed.



I can't understand why wire nuts are allowed

Because they work.

So there

 

[Rakehellion]

he doesn't need to follow code if he does his own repairs on his house.

Don't you?