Any integrated graphics sufficient for gaming?

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The Sauce

Diamond Member
Oct 31, 1999
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I've been out of the loop for a while and I don't really know what the latest gen CPU's integrated graphics are capable of. I am looking into a new laptop with Haswell for power-saving. All of the "gaming" laptops sport discreet graphics processors. The question is - would any Haswell CPU be sufficient for gaming with integrated graphics, even if it meant not enabling all the glitter and wing-dings?
 

blackened23

Diamond Member
Jul 26, 2011
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Iris Pro is going to be great for lower resolution gaming - and this will be available in a wide variety of ultrabooks and NUCs next month. As far as gaming, though, this is all relative depending on what resolution you want to use, though - i'd say if you're wanting 1080p gaming, a dGPU is required unless you're content with 20-30 fps framerate levels.

I don't really consider any iGPU to be sufficient for 1080p gaming (without sacrifices), but this may be okay in an ultrabook - where you won't need to game at 1080p.
 

Elixer

Lifer
May 7, 2002
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It depends on the game, if it is gfx demanding, then, no, intel's latest isn't that great, and you need either a nvidia or AMD card in the laptop.
 

Zodiark1593

Platinum Member
Oct 21, 2012
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At best, I think you're looking at something the level of a Radeon 6670 (with an A10 processor from AMD), if that. A dGPU is still the way to go if you intend to play games.
 

blackened23

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Jul 26, 2011
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You may want to go through this review: http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/core-i7-4770k-haswell-review,3521-4.html

Mostly the AMD APU wins, but on CPU demanding games, the Intel wins.

That's mostly based on LGA desktop processors though, I think the OP is thinking more about an ultrabook or something along those lines. I think the Iris Pro is a very good solution - although few ultrabooks are using at this point. Heck, ultrabooks or laptops with dGPU aren't too expensive either, but I can't think of many iGPUs that rival discrete GPUs other than the Iris Pro. Of course, the Iris Pro isn't cheap, either.
 
Aug 11, 2008
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Well the lowest discrete mobile gpu considered suitable for gaming is the GT650m. It is faster than any igp in the mobile space. The Iris Pro comes close, but is very limited in availability and expensive.

The A10 from AMD is still ahead of the normally available HD4600, but both will be limited to older games and less demanding current titles at anything over 720p, low/med settings.

Here is the anand review comparing HD4600 and AMD Richland:

HD4600 vs Richland.
 
Aug 11, 2008
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I read the announcement, and they only mentioned discrete cards. I would think it could be adapted to an APU though. APUs are bandwidth limited, so I dont know how mantle would affect this. It would be sort of counter to their emphasis on APUs if Mantle could not be adopted to APUs.

Just like every new API or software that comes out, this sounds great. We will have to wait for real games utilizing the technology to see how much effect it really has, and how many developers actually use it. Since this is used in place of DX11, does that mean there would have to be a separate version for nVidia cards, or would Mantle and DX11 be programmed in and the gpu would select the path to use?
 

monkeydelmagico

Diamond Member
Nov 16, 2011
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I have played oblivion, neverwinter online, dragons age, and war thunder on cheap i3 lappy with hd4000 at 1600 x 900. I've been impressed with the integrated graphics, especially for the price. Next few games I have slated for it are the recent indie humble bundle, mass effect 2, and SWTOR.

Haswell upped their integrated to HD4600 so should be even more capable depending on the laptop screen resolution.

Everything is relative and YMMV. I don't expect nor try to have my laptop play recent benchmark games like batman, crysis, battlefront, skyrim, etc. It might play stalker though......hmmmm..... gonna have to try that.
 

jvroig

Platinum Member
Nov 4, 2009
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Everything is relative and YMMV.
This is very true.

This reminds me of a story.

So several years ago, after conquering the dragons that were the panel of professors judging my thesis, I found myself sitting in the auditorium, joining the graduation rites for earning my Master's degree. I was pretty happy and content, I kicked the butt of everybody else in the class, and they were gonna hang a medal around my neck or something. Pretty sweet.

So as the graduation rites went on (and on, and on, and on...), I got a text message from a friend of mine. His message read: "Dude, awesome advice on the new hardware! Left for Dead plays awesome!" (He obviously had no clue I was attending my own graduation rites). Since the graduation rites seemed never-ending, I decided to engage my friend in the magic of instantaneous communication through SMS.

He was absolutely thrilled at his new hardware, an entirely new PC on a completely shoe-string budget (at that time, he was just starting out in his career, almost fresh out of HRM; he was a Starbucks Barista, so very lowly paid, bills to pay and all). I was, of course, very glad that my awesome barista friend enjoyed the hardware.

The thing is, that hardware, from our (AT forum enthusiasts) point of view, is absolute crap and "not made for gaming!". It was a GT 210, newly released (I think it was summer of 2009 then). I didn't want to recommend a GT 210, but when he gave me his budget, and we browsed the pricelist of my favorite store, he really couldn't afford anything else that time. I wanted to steer him towards a better card, but at the end of the day he really had to settle on a 210. I was rather sorry for him, to be honest, and part of me just wanted to give him money - after all, no one should be "forced" to play games on entry-level cards, that's just downright dehumanizing, right?

Anyway, so it turned out alright, and he was super thrilled and excited he could finally play L4D and some RPG and an MMO or something, I don't really remember. All I could remember, at that very day when all I should have been thinking about was "when the hell are they gonna hang that medal on me, we're losing daylight!", was "Wow, that turned out better than expected for him".

The moral of the story, as Magic Monkey pointed out above (which I quoted), asking "what is sufficient for gaming" is hard to answer, and most replies may not apply to you, especially here. The more useful answers are YMMV, <1080P at conservative settings, depends on games you play, etc, but whether that is sufficient depends really on your expectations.

Enthusiasts want graphics in their full-glory (naturally, since this is a tech forum), so they will be prone to downplay what is good enough and settle on what more casual/normal gamers might consider excessive. That's all well and good if that is also your personal level of "sufficiency". Otherwise, if, like my friend, you would have been satisfied at a much lower level of performance, you might end up over-provisioning for something that would not have made a material difference to your enjoyment. For example, using 20/20 hindsight, I see now that if I were able to convince my barista friend to spend more dough on a mid-range card, it might have done him little good if he was already super pumped at the entry-level. Obviously, his standards and expectations were lower than mine, and he didn't require a mid-range card. I wouldn't have known had he not settled on a low-end card and reported his enthusiasm, and I could never have imagined such enjoyment from low-end. As an enthusiast, such a thing simply does not register in my brain.

If you don't know yet what is borderline acceptable for you, you may not be able to judge properly what minimum hardware you will need to play the games you want sufficiently even by looking at benchmarks. There is no single answer that can guide you, and no member here either can give you a perfect answer (i.e., perfectly right on the spot for your needs and budgets). Try out your friends' laptops / desktops if possible to see what level of hardware is "good enough" for you before you buy, if at all possible, so you can be in a more-informed position before settling on a Haswell-powered laptop sans dedicated graphics.


EDIT: Of course, I'd also add my personal view on Haswell graphics. In laptops, HD4600 will most certainly be good for lots of gaming. It won't be high-end gaming, and you can't have all the bells and whistles in every game, but it has enough muscle for you to enjoy lots of games on it. Even more if you are willing to drop settings as needed, or even drop the resolution and play in windowed mode (so still native res of the LCD is in effect for sharper image) or not mind not being in the native res of the screen.
 
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Wolfpup

Member
Jan 25, 2006
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amd a10-4600m or the a10-5750m will power true most games at 720p

some videos in sig yt playlist.

Yep, I think an A10 from AMD isn't a joke. Will run stuff kind of medium resolutions and whatnot from what I've seen/heard (although system requirements are probably about to skyrocket over the next year or three because of the new "lowest common denominator" Xbox One).

From what I've seen on my 16 core Intel Ivy Bridge, it'll run some stuff, but high end stuff, even from 2007, won't even run at lowest settings. Haswell is only 25% faster, so...it also couldn't remotely hit 10fps with lowest settings.

now supposedly that L4 cache/Iris Pro stuff brings it up to AMD levels, buuuuut I don't know, I'm kind of not holding my breath, and also it costs more, making it like "umm why not just add a separate GPU?"
 

blackened23

Diamond Member
Jul 26, 2011
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Again, we're talking about Mobile. AMD's A10 is a LGA desktop processor and is thus not applicable to the OP's question.

While the Iris Pro isn't cheap, it is also only paired with the most high end Quad core mobile i7's. So you're getting the best of both worlds really: GT650/GT740M level graphical performance with a quad core mobile i7. You can get an AMD APU, sure, but the CPU performance will be anemic which in turn will have negative effects on any game that is CPU limited (which, at lower resolutions, is most of them). So I think the Iris Pro would be a great consideration, otherwise a quad i7 mobile with a discrete GPU such as the 750m would also be worth considering, although the 750m obviously is not an iGPU.
 

monstercameron

Diamond Member
Feb 12, 2013
3,818
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Again, we're talking about Mobile. AMD's A10 is a LGA desktop processor and is thus not applicable to the OP's question.

While the Iris Pro isn't cheap, it is also only paired with the most high end Quad core mobile i7's. So you're getting the best of both worlds really: GT650/GT740M level graphical performance with a quad core mobile i7. You can get an AMD APU, sure, but the CPU performance will be anemic which in turn will have negative effects on any game that is CPU limited (which, at lower resolutions, is most of them). So I think the Iris Pro would be a great consideration, otherwise a quad i7 mobile with a discrete GPU such as the 750m would also be worth considering, although the 750m obviously is not an iGPU.

get your facts straight sir, there is the "mobile" a10-4600m and a10-5750m, though not quite as fast as iris pro but are quite a bit cheaper.
 

genrichs

Junior Member
Oct 1, 2014
7
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Agreed, the AMD A10-4600M is the most powerful APU in the market. I've tested it against an Intel i7 4702MQ which is a clearly faster CPU, but when coming to gaming the A10 beats it for a fraction of the price.
 

stahlhart

Super Moderator Graphics Cards
Dec 21, 2010
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Please don't necro aged threads that the original participants have long since moved on from.
-- stahlhart
 
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