Apple A8 Benchmarked

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Rakehellion

Lifer
Jan 15, 2013
12,181
35
91
Yes and that is because the system is limited to 1 GB. Doubling the amount of RAM allows for a doubling of the limit (not sure if its 300 MB on current devices).

There's no hard limit. And it could be increased with a firmware upgrade.

Pretty good then that the xbox 360 and ps3 were limited to 512 MB. Didn't waste anything.

They only run one app at a time. And 512MB is less than 1GB.
 

Rakehellion

Lifer
Jan 15, 2013
12,181
35
91
Knowing Apple and the fact that they talked about "desktop class scalar engine" I wouldn't be surprised if they would just run (some) games in a lower resolution (2x as on the 6).

Apple doesn't make games. That's up to the developers.
 

Rakehellion

Lifer
Jan 15, 2013
12,181
35
91
The whole point on the 1GB of RAM deal is that this was a standard size back in 2011 and a downright embarrassing amount for a flagship that will carry the brand through 2015. Look it up, the Galaxy S II shipped with 1GB of RAM.

So they should do it just to one-up the competition. Have 8GB of RAM and a 4K display on the next phone because they can.

Android uses a different system of memory management than iOS.

I'll ask again: How is the device actually limited by the amount of memory it currently has? I think that's a legitimate question.
 

Enigmoid

Platinum Member
Sep 27, 2012
2,907
31
91
There's no hard limit. And it could be increased with a firmware upgrade.

They only run one app at a time. And 512MB is less than 1GB.

If you use too much RAM, IOS will dump your app/crash.

More RAM is needed, especially for the ipad.
 

kpkp

Senior member
Oct 11, 2012
468
0
76
Apple doesn't make games. That's up to the developers.
Not relevant (they make more relevant things for this question like the SoC, the OS, drivers, scalar engine...). I disagree.
Apple needs to think about the problems their devices could have and how to mitigate them. If a dev has this question they need to have an answer/solution ready.
 

Eug

Lifer
Mar 11, 2000
23,809
1,388
126
While I believe iOS is more efficient than Android in terms of RAM, that doesn't take away from the fact that 1 GB is insufficient.

I won't be pre-ordering the iPad Air 2 unless leaks prove it has 2 GB. If it only has 1 GB, I'll just wait until next year.
 

Atreidin

Senior member
Mar 31, 2011
464
27
86
There's no reason to act personally offended on behalf of Apple that people want more RAM in their phones.

Apple picked 1GB RAM because they know people who buy their phones don't care about that spec and it helps with their margins.

1GB might end up being enough because the app designers have no choice but to make it work. Other than the aforementioned issues with Safari tabs, this may be limiting in ways that aren't entirely obvious unless we get testimonials from programmers about how they wanted to do something but couldn't because of limited resources.

I'm not sure why anybody wouldn't want more RAM in any computing device they have when there's no appreciable drawback. Well, I guess since it's Apple, they would have raised the price another $100 or more for every extra 1GB of RAM, so I guess wanting your Apple hardware to be at minimum possible specs is better for your wallet.
 

Rakehellion

Lifer
Jan 15, 2013
12,181
35
91
Not relevant (they make more relevant things for this question like the SoC, the OS, drivers, scalar engine...). I disagree.
Apple needs to think about the problems their devices could have and how to mitigate them. If a dev has this question they need to have an answer/solution ready.

Very relevant. Apple has zero input on the size of a framebuffer used for a game instance.
 

Rakehellion

Lifer
Jan 15, 2013
12,181
35
91
There's no reason to act personally offended on behalf of Apple that people want more RAM in their phones.

I asked what iOS software would require a device with more than 1GB of memory. Responses like "Samsung did it" and "Don't be offended" aren't answers to this question.

Also, the operating system limits the memory of each app to well under the hardware limit of the device.
 

witeken

Diamond Member
Dec 25, 2013
3,899
193
106
I asked what iOS software would require a device with more than 1GB of memory. Responses like "Samsung did it" and "Don't be offended" aren't answers to this question.

Also, the operating system limits the memory of each app to well under the hardware limit of the device.
You know that people want to be able to use their ridiculously expensive phone a few years from now just as well, too, right? You can't defend a $1000 phone for not having at least 3GB of RAM.
 

Rakehellion

Lifer
Jan 15, 2013
12,181
35
91
You know that people want to be able to use their ridiculously expensive phone a few years from now just as well, too, right? You can't defend a $1000 phone for not having at least 3GB of RAM.

That's another "Samsung did it" response that completely ignores the question.

Here's a good one: What Android app needs 3GB of memory?
 

ShintaiDK

Lifer
Apr 22, 2012
20,378
145
106
How many apps/services do you run at a time?

Its not about "what app uses 1GB". Its about what do you wish to use that exceeds the memory. And that isnt so hard to hit 1GB with.
 

Eug

Lifer
Mar 11, 2000
23,809
1,388
126
The bottom line is that it is a limitation already in 2014. 1 GB is usable but not ideal, esp. For a 64-bit OS. Plus the RAM requirements increase with time. What is OK (but not "good") today is not Ok in 2-3 years.
 

jpiniero

Lifer
Oct 1, 2010
15,176
5,717
136
There was talk before the launch that the 6+ would have a different/bigger chip than the 6; with that and the loss of the Sapphire I almost wonder if Apple downgraded the specs so they could get the 6+ out sooner.

The only difference between the two is the bigger screen and the OIS; it's certainly not costing Apple anywhere near $100. It does feel like they were also going to give it more GPU cores and extra memory.
 

witeken

Diamond Member
Dec 25, 2013
3,899
193
106
That's another "Samsung did it" response that completely ignores the question.

Here's a good one: What Android app needs 3GB of memory?

It doesn't even matter if no app uses 3GB and it doesn't ignore your question. Do you think 1GB will be enough for a high-end device a few years from now?

1GB is fine for low-end smartphones, not for high-end ones.
 

ZGR

Platinum Member
Oct 26, 2012
2,058
671
136
I'm always low on memory and so are most iOS users.
Keeping apps open in active memory leaves me with a bit of free memory:



Closing all active apps:




This is on my iPhone 5. If free memory runs out, iOS will try to kill backgrounded apps. Safari is the biggest memory hog on iOS and really needs to be slimmed down for 1GB to be feasible.

I remember how terrible the user experience the iPhone 3G was in its later support life. I only had around 50mb free to play with, and once the number got too low, the app crashed. 128mb vs 1gb is a lot different; I'm hoping it won't be nearly as crashy
 
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TreVader

Platinum Member
Oct 28, 2013
2,057
2
0
I think apple is kinda screwing the iPhone 6 buyers and I guarantee apple will release a 6S next September with a much better CPU and 2-3GB LPDDR4

Prob same form factor/screen size tho
 

Qwertilot

Golden Member
Nov 28, 2013
1,604
257
126
If by much better you mean a much faster CPU, I wouldn't be at all sure. They might well have decided that they've got enough performance for any rational phone based use now/into the next couple of years.
(surely they have objectively?).

If they have they'll just keep pushing efficiency/battery life (which the A8 does quite well as per their claims.). They've already shown total disinterest in getting into broadly marketing based specification fights.
 

ShintaiDK

Lifer
Apr 22, 2012
20,378
145
106
I'm always low on memory and so are most iOS users.
Keeping apps open in active memory leaves me with a bit of free memory:



Closing all active apps:




This is on my iPhone 5. If free memory runs out, iOS will try to kill backgrounded apps. Safari is the biggest memory hog on iOS and really needs to be slimmed down for 1GB to be feasible.

I remember how terrible the user experience the iPhone 3G was in its later support life. I only had around 50mb free to play with, and once the number got too low, the app crashed. 128mb vs 1gb is a lot different; I'm hoping it won't be nearly as crashy

Nice example. Hopefully it will put the "1GB is enough" to rest.

Considering the almost irrelevant cost of 2GB compared to the iPhone cost. I cant imagine why they didnt do it. unless they want to sabotage/force people up upgrade to the same thing later with 2GB or more.
 

jpiniero

Lifer
Oct 1, 2010
15,176
5,717
136
An iPad Air teardown I found had the memory costing $10.50. I guess we will have to see how much the 6 parts cost, but 2 GB of memory could cost more than the A8+M8 processors. Apple could obviously afford it, but you have to remember that Apple still only really allows the foreground app to run. It's not like Android or especially Windows. I just don't think forcing apps to reload is that big of a deal, esp when the developer is accounting for that.
 

Enigmoid

Platinum Member
Sep 27, 2012
2,907
31
91
An iPad Air teardown I found had the memory costing $10.50. I guess we will have to see how much the 6 parts cost, but 2 GB of memory could cost more than the A8+M8 processors. Apple could obviously afford it, but you have to remember that Apple still only really allows the foreground app to run. It's not like Android or especially Windows. I just don't think forcing apps to reload is that big of a deal, esp when the developer is accounting for that.

Memory has gotten cheaper. $20 is still almost irrelevant when compared to the cost of the device and the margins apple is making. I have no problem finding $199 2GB android or win8 tablets for example.
 

Homeles

Platinum Member
Dec 9, 2011
2,580
0
0
Memory has gotten cheaper. $20 is still almost irrelevant when compared to the cost of the device and the margins apple is making. I have no problem finding $199 2GB android or win8 tablets for example.
I dunno, memory is relatively expensive right now for consumers. I don't know if it's the same for OEMs, but it's certainly not cheap. Still, Apple would hardly stand to lose much if anything by going to 2GB, as there would be increased demand, and consumers would benefit greatly.
 

Enigmoid

Platinum Member
Sep 27, 2012
2,907
31
91
I dunno, memory is relatively expensive right now for consumers. I don't know if it's the same for OEMs, but it's certainly not cheap. Still, Apple would hardly stand to lose much if anything by going to 2GB, as there would be increased demand, and consumers would benefit greatly.

The price went up because producers shifted capacity toward mobile.
 

Eug

Lifer
Mar 11, 2000
23,809
1,388
126
Charge me 25 bucks more for another one gigabyte of RAM, I don't care. I just want my 2 GB of RAM in that new iPad Air 2.
 

TreVader

Platinum Member
Oct 28, 2013
2,057
2
0
My guess is Apple must know it works well enough for most. It's not a problem for me on my 5s (although I have noticed the reloading tabs thing in safari) and it won't be an issue on the 6 at 1334x750 but the HD screen on the 6+ is gonna make safari even more of a memory hog.


I actually know somebody who was using a 3GS as recently as this last June. I was just amazed it was still running apps. iOS 4 I think?
 
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