Are elite colleges worth the cost for undergrad?

[CanOWorms]

Originally posted by: bonkers325
academically, there really isnt much of a difference between colleges. but elite colleges present better opportunities to students. the people you meet and associate with in elite colleges will definitely give u an edge when you graduate. if u goto an ivy league, you might meet the future president or something.

I think the complete opposite. I think there's a difference in academics and quality of the average student, even in something specific like top 10 schools vs. schools ranked 10-20.

 

[naddicott]

Originally posted by: CanOWorms

Originally posted by: Gibson486
If I got accepted to MIT, I would have to think hard about it. Yes, teh top professors are there, but, they will never teach you because all classes are taught by TA's. The name will open doors however. It all dpends on what you wanna do after college.

Where do you get the idea that they're all taught by TAs?

The Professors give the lectures, often there are additional TA tought recitation sessions (although I had some recitations taught by a professor as well). Good luck get getting admitted with that spelling/typing of yours, english skills still count there a little.

If you want an MIT education for cheap, go to any full-ride you can get and then make time for open courseware: link. I graduated MIT before they opened up everything to the public, but in retrospect, in many ways I would have preferred to take a full ride elsewhere and take in MIT content at my own leisure. In the economy of the last few years, I don't know many classmates at all that "paid off their loans within 2-3 years". If you're smart, a good worker, and proactive about your career, you will get noticed regardless of where you did your undergrad.

As for the original question of Stanford, I don't think it is worth close to $100k. What if you discover you hate CS and decide to major in Philosophy? How the hell are you going to pay that off then?

Oh, and btw, a 4.0 GPA from MIT is a B average, not bad but not terribly good either. It's a 5.0 scale there.

 

[Einz]

As a current MIT undergrad, I agree and disagree with naddicott.
Coming here I don't regret one bit. It's not just the education, but the atmosphere and the people that you collaborate and work with. Everyone here has gotten in on their own merit, they don't get in here because of a fluke or something. As far as classes being taught by TAs, that's a complete load of bull. I haven't had one class yet that isn't taught by a full fledged professor. And if you're wondering, they're all fricking geniuses. My orgo professor is 26 and she's got a PhD here at MIT and is so smart it's ridiculous.
Along side with opening doors, I found an internship abroad in Germany with very little experience and background; I'm pretty sure that MIT opened the door for me on that one. Now, I'm doing a UROP (undergrad research for all you non MIT people) and I'm expecting to be published within the next few months if everything goes well.
Again, if you think that the top schools aren't worth it, either you're chewing your sour grapes a bit too much or you haven't been to a top school before. Don't regret anything about coming here and don't regret a single penny that my 40k/year costs. If you're up to challenging yourself at all, I would go to Stanford.

Originally posted by: naddicott

Originally posted by: CanOWorms

Originally posted by: Gibson486
If I got accepted to MIT, I would have to think hard about it. Yes, teh top professors are there, but, they will never teach you because all classes are taught by TA's. The name will open doors however. It all dpends on what you wanna do after college.

Where do you get the idea that they're all taught by TAs?

The Professors give the lectures, often there are additional TA tought recitation sessions (although I had some recitations taught by a professor as well). Good luck get getting admitted with that spelling/typing of yours, english skills still count there a little.

If you want an MIT education for cheap, go to any full-ride you can get and then make time for open courseware: link. I graduated MIT before they opened up everything to the public, but in retrospect, in many ways I would have preferred to take a full ride elsewhere and take in MIT content at my own leisure. In the economy of the last few years, I don't know many classmates at all that "paid off their loans within 2-3 years". If you're smart, a good worker, and proactive about your career, you will get noticed regardless of where you did your undergrad.

As for the original question of Stanford, I don't think it is worth close to $100k. What if you discover you hate CS and decide to major in Philosophy? How the hell are you going to pay that off then?

Oh, and btw, a 4.0 GPA from MIT is a B average, not bad but not terribly good either. It's a 5.0 scale there.

 

[dangereuxjeux]

I don't really think that you should make the consideration based on financial projections of your later life. That sounds stupid, especially since I go to one of those expensive-as-#$@# Ivy-league schools, but you really can't be making charts counting on your future wages before you even know what major you'll graduate with on your degree. And maybe, just maybe, you should consider that even if there's not a enormous difference in wages, you could still enjoy and learn more at that better (and possibly more expensive school). I like learning and getting a great education regardless of my future salary (and I picked a field that is definitely going to make me less than I could have made either in computers or economics). This is not to say that expensive schools have a monopoly on top educations, as there are plenty of great schools that are public and much less expensive. But if you can make it happen, why not go for the best you can do (be it an expensive private or less so public)?

I know a lot of people who think I'm crazy for going here when I could have gone to any school back at home for less money, but I've definitely found it to be worth it. I'm not rich, but it's been great and from what I've seen when I've visited and gone to classes at other schools, worth the difference in tuition. It will have its benefits on my resume... but even aside from that, it's been worth it. Might not be so for anyone...

P.S. I'm not an Engineering major, so I can't really comment on that. If you're absolutely certain (and I mean certain, because I changed my mind during my first two years and so did most people I know) that you want that, some of the expensive schools like mine aren't even the best choice.

 

[RossGr]

The quality of your education is more depentent on the student (that's you!) then the school or professor. The name of your shcool may get your resume looked at for your first job. It will not get you that job (unless of course it is a "good ol' boy" firm).

 

[LordFortius]

What do you guys think of the University of Pennsylvania? I can go there for 30k/yr

 

[Aznbruin]

Originally posted by: LordFortius
What do you guys think of the University of Pennsylvania? I can go there for 30k/yr

great school as well. Go visit it though, because I'm not too fond of Philadelphia and I think Palo alto is a much nicer neighborhood. I've lived in both places for about a year. If you do go Stanford remember to do Sake bombs at Miyaki(sp?)

 

[WinkOsmosis]

Originally posted by: csf
These debates are always pretty amusing; those who went to public/state schools are full of unwarranted vitriol against Ivy/Ivy-type schools; those that went to Ivy-type schools are vigorously defensive about their choice.

That said, I would go for it if I were you, but the thing is you have to be sure you like the environment, the campus, and the general atmosphere. If you're interested not just for the name, you should definitely go.

I go to the University of Texas and I'm defending the elite schools.

 

[WinkOsmosis]

You should also consider whether you can do the work at a top school... not just cost.

 

[eLiu]

Originally posted by: Gibson486
If I got accepted to MIT, I would have to think hard about it. Yes, teh top professors are there, but, they will never teach you because all classes are taught by TA's. The name will open doors however. It all dpends on what you wanna do after college.

Uhh...actually, there aren't any classes taught by TAs at MIT. And you do take plenty of classes under top professors. For example, one of the introductory biology courses is taught by Prof. (Eric) Lander, one of the leaders of the human genome project. Though after intro classes, the profs aren't all that "elite" until you hit the more advanced stuff.

On the other hand, a lot of the MIT experience isn't about the classroom. They have a highly integrated research program called UROP which basically allows you to do research in a field that interests you under any of MIT's professors, who are very open/supportive of the project (b/c to them, you = cheap labor...well I'm generalizing too much, but you get the idea)

-Eric

 

[ajayjuneja]

So I'm finishing up from CMU Computer Science now (three more weeks!!!), and, while I didn't quite realize it when I first came here, I am realizing now that there were so many doors opened to me from just being around here, it's not even funny.

I would not have had the opportunity to go so in depth into research with dialogue systems and NLP at too many other schools. MIT & Stanford would have been great places too. If I was to do it all over, I'd have chosen Stanford, because of the weather, the beautiful campus, and they tend to be a bit more "balanced" there than folks at CMU.

The opportunities alone are worth the extra costs. If you go to Stanford, you'll see

Also, I'd choose Stanford over Penn any day for engineering. Better weather, nicer campus, and most importantly, hotter women

 

[SuperTool]

Are you gonna pay in state tuition at CU Boulder?
Go see what professors are there. What facilities do they have? See if they work with the industry, etc. There are design houses around boulder where you can get experience.

 

[dr150]

Having gone to very elite schools and being out in the workforce in top jobs, I'll tell you that an Ivy-caliber college degree is EXTREMELY verpriced. Toooo many fall into this trap (i.e. media brain-wash) of Armani-type brand names.

Regarding engineering degrees, there is an INSIGNIFICANT disparity in wages between say Prinecton/Rice over a well respected state school. There have been well respected studies confirming this.

I've been on the hiring end of "elite" jobs which most Ivy Leaguers would give their right hand for. All I can say is that there really isn't a worthwhile wage gap. AFTER someone gets their foot in the door, they're on the spot...and EVERYONE is on ground level with NO preferences. Our firm's favorite workers mostly came from smaller name schools (with tailored practical teaching reputations) who were great workers and naturally wise to the ways of business. They were the ones that ultimately received promotions--to the Iveyers angst. Once you get that promo, you're one the company's wage scale, thus ultimate parity is achieved. In other words, brand name schools don't mean sh*t anymore in ANY regard.

My advice is SAVE the money. Go to a well respected STATE program in your field of study that is HIGHLY NOTED for ACCESS to practical teaching and not "from the book" presentations. Preferably choose a school in the area where you would like to work. If you ultimately go to grad school, then I'd recommend a program that gives you ACCESS to top professors.....this shouldn't be a problem in grad school, however, getting a good prof. in college is very difficult. Stanford for college will leave a sour taste and a huge hole in your pocket.

 

[SuperTool]

Originally posted by: dr150
Having gone to very elite schools and being out in the workforce in top jobs, I'll tell you that an Ivy-caliber college degree is EXTREMELY verpriced. Toooo many fall into this trap (i.e. media brain-wash) of Armani-type brand names.

Regarding engineering degrees, there is an INSIGNIFICANT disparity in wages between say Prinecton/Rice over a well respected state school. There have been well respected studies confirming this.

I've been on the hiring end of "elite" jobs which most Ivy Leaguers would give their right hand for. All I can say is that there really isn't a worthwhile wage gap. AFTER someone gets their foot in the door, they're on the spot...and EVERYONE is on ground level with NO preferences. Our firm's favorite workers mostly came from smaller name schools (with tailored practical teaching reputations) who were great workers and naturally wise to the ways of business. They were the ones that ultimately received promotions--to the Iveyers angst. Once you get that promo, you're one the company's wage scale, thus ultimate parity is achieved. In other words, brand name schools don't mean sh*t anymore in ANY regard.

My advice is SAVE the money. Go to a well respected STATE program in your field of study that is HIGHLY NOTED for ACCESS to practical teaching and not "from the book" presentations. Preferably choose a school in the area where you would like to work. If you ultimately go to grad school, then I'd recommend a program that gives you ACCESS to top professors.....this shouldn't be a problem in grad school, however, getting a good prof. in college is very difficult. Stanford for college will leave a sour taste and a huge hole in your pocket.

This is absulutely correct. The only reason I went to an Ivy school over a state school, is because they gave me so much financial aid, it was cheaper for me to go there.
If you have to pay out of pocket SAVE YOUR MONEY. If you go onto grad school, it won't matter much what undergrad you did. How do I know? Because of all the H1B's who got their undergrads in India and China, and Masters in the US, noone ever asks them where they got their undergrad. Almost noone asks them where they got their masters either after they get their first job. If you are going to get an MBA, you are going to need that cash, so don't blow it all on a fancy name on your diploma.

 

[elanarchist]

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