Are Intel chips NSA data hubs?

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cytg111

Lifer
Mar 17, 2008
23,561
13,121
136
You forgot protection from mind control..

You jest, but a well formed tinfoil hat is an excellent faraday cage.... And you know, since mainstream science and media is actually reporting advances in mindreading devices you know the gov have had the tech atleast 10 years prior.

You think you're laughing at that guy? He's laughing at you.

 

BSim500

Golden Member
Jun 5, 2013
1,480
216
106
IIRC, that "snooping" conspiracy thing is Intel vPro which is a corporate feature allowing remote access / monitoring of thousands of networked PC's for large corporations / organisations. In order to work, it needs drivers installed (Intel Management Engine) and can be disabled in the BIOS and Device Manager ("PCI Simple Communications Controller"). For consumer chips, vPro (and TXT - "Trusted Execution") are available only on non-K i5/i7's, so if you don't want it, buy a "K" i5/i7 or i3/Pentium that lacks the capability.

And for the hyper-paranoid who swear blind Intel have squeezed a mini iPhone inside each i5 core, secretly broadcasting their porn collection over the airwaves :biggrin:, it's really not that difficult to build a radio frequency direction finder / packet sniffer tuned to known 3G frequencies. You could network several receivers and quickly pinpoint any 3G source via Triangulation / Multilateration (which is exactly how Search & Rescue teams can pinpoint Personal Emergency Locators, even older analog non-GPS capable ones that just "squawk" a tone over & over). Given that you believe you already know the source (your CPU), half a dozen 3G frequency sensors inside your PC 6 inches away couldn't fail to detect any emission from there (that has to be strong enough to reach a cell tower potentially hundreds of meters away) if you drove to a remote area then switched your PC on. So far, no-one has found one. Make of that what you will.
 

crashtech

Lifer
Jan 4, 2013
10,556
2,139
146
You jest, but a well formed tinfoil hat is an excellent faraday cage.... And you know, since mainstream science and media is actually reporting advances in mindreading devices you know the gov have had the tech atleast 10 years prior.

You think you're laughing at that guy? He's laughing at you.

Eh, even the best metal head enclosure must by necessity include a rather large neck hole if it is designed for a living person, so excellent Faraday cage? Not so much. Have to go whole body with a ground if you want to get serious.
 

cytg111

Lifer
Mar 17, 2008
23,561
13,121
136
Eh, even the best metal head enclosure must by necessity include a rather large neck hole if it is designed for a living person, so excellent Faraday cage? Not so much. Have to go whole body with a ground if you want to get serious.

(comon dude, you're spoiling it ...)
 

TrulyUncouth

Senior member
Jul 16, 2013
213
0
76
I know you guys are mostly joking, but replies like this are somewhat frustrating. Just because there might not be a practical way to avoid snooping at the moment doesn't mean we shouldn't discuss it.

Clearly there are wholesale invasions of privacy happening. Joking about it and poking fun at those who discuss it is just silly. The whole "nothing to hide" or "tinfoil hat" response is just counter-productive and rude to this guy.
 

Red Squirrel

No Lifer
May 24, 2003
67,930
12,382
126
www.anyf.ca
I've always been curious about this myself, though is it even technically possible for something at such a low layer to be aware of what is happening at a higher layer?

Ex: if I'm writing a letter in MS Word to mail to my buddies in Jihad land the cpu does not really know that I'm writing a letter or even care about the program I'm using, it's just following low level assembly instructions send by the various layers of software and hardware as I'm typing the letter. I suppose it could take all those actions and store them somewhere to be sent to the NSA and the reverse engineered, but that on it's own would be quite the feat, as I don't think the cpu would even be able to use the network card without drivers, unless there's built in drivers into the cpu for all the popular network cards. That would also generate traffic that someone would eventually figure out while messing around with a packet sniffer on their network.

Of course it could also be producing some supersonic sound waves that can be physically picked up by proximity.

Overall, I don't think it's feasible, but I'm curious myself if perhaps, it is?

I know they do intercept Cisco routers and put special chips in them to basically act as a back door, so if they could do the same to cpus it would be a gold mine for them. Of course that's also much harder from a technical stand point just because of how small a cpu actually is. It's pretty hard to modify a semiconductor die.
 

Red Squirrel

No Lifer
May 24, 2003
67,930
12,382
126
www.anyf.ca
You jest, but a well formed tinfoil hat is an excellent faraday cage.... And you know, since mainstream science and media is actually reporting advances in mindreading devices you know the gov have had the tech atleast 10 years prior.

You think you're laughing at that guy? He's laughing at you.


The kicker is, tin foil is not enough, you need thick steel or lead or something.

Wrap your phone in foil and try calling it. The call will go through.

The NSA is upon us, even through the power of tin foil. :biggrin:
 

GreenChile

Member
Sep 4, 2007
190
0
0
Not sure who's worse, tin-foil-hatters or religious extremists. Both groups are so convinced they know the truth that they immediately dismiss any evidence that is contrary to their beliefs.

I'm not sure what the OP is trying to do here other than stir up a conspiracy against Intel. How is a handful of anonymous posters from a tech forum supposed to uncover a hypothetical partnership between Intel and the NSA? Should be good for a laugh I suppose.
 

Makaveli

Diamond Member
Feb 8, 2002
4,761
1,160
136
Not sure who's worse, tin-foil-hatters or religious extremists. Both groups are so convinced they know the truth that they immediately dismiss any evidence that is contrary to their beliefs.

I'm not sure what the OP is trying to do here other than stir up a conspiracy against Intel. How is a handful of anonymous posters from a tech forum supposed to uncover a hypothetical partnership between Intel and the NSA? Should be good for a laugh I suppose.

i'm not sure this thread is suppose to be serious the NSA is watching this also!
 

SlickR12345

Senior member
Jan 9, 2010
542
44
91
www.clubvalenciacf.com
Not sure who's worse, tin-foil-hatters or religious extremists. Both groups are so convinced they know the truth that they immediately dismiss any evidence that is contrary to their beliefs.

I'm not sure what the OP is trying to do here other than stir up a conspiracy against Intel. How is a handful of anonymous posters from a tech forum supposed to uncover a hypothetical partnership between Intel and the NSA? Should be good for a laugh I suppose.

Not sure who's worse, 80IQ and lower ignoramus or North Korea type lemmings.

I'm not sure what you are trying to do, other than stir up spam posts to deflect from the discussion about Intel being inbed with the NSA.
 

GreenChile

Member
Sep 4, 2007
190
0
0
Not sure who's worse, 80IQ and lower ignoramus or North Korea type lemmings.

I'm not sure what you are trying to do, other than stir up spam posts to deflect from the discussion about Intel being inbed with the NSA.
Way to go outing yourself as a troll. Is that how you backup your claims? By attacking those who disagree with your conspiracy theory?
 

DominionSeraph

Diamond Member
Jul 22, 2009
8,391
31
91
Yes, Intel processors are backdoored.


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cytg111

Lifer
Mar 17, 2008
23,561
13,121
136
I've always been curious about this myself, though is it even technically possible for something at such a low layer to be aware of what is happening at a higher layer?

Ex: if I'm writing a letter in MS Word to mail to my buddies in Jihad land the cpu does not really know that I'm writing a letter or even care about the program I'm using, it's just following low level assembly instructions send by the various layers of software and hardware as I'm typing the letter. I suppose it could take all those actions and store them somewhere to be sent to the NSA and the reverse engineered, but that on it's own would be quite the feat, as I don't think the cpu would even be able to use the network card without drivers, unless there's built in drivers into the cpu for all the popular network cards. That would also generate traffic that someone would eventually figure out while messing around with a packet sniffer on their network.

Of course it could also be producing some supersonic sound waves that can be physically picked up by proximity.

Overall, I don't think it's feasible, but I'm curious myself if perhaps, it is?

I know they do intercept Cisco routers and put special chips in them to basically act as a back door, so if they could do the same to cpus it would be a gold mine for them. Of course that's also much harder from a technical stand point just because of how small a cpu actually is. It's pretty hard to modify a semiconductor die.

Oh I am quite sure it is possible and is happening .. Its fun to make fun of, but while 'tounge in cheek' it is with a certain level of seriousness to it.
Can we be sure as in 100%? Hell no, nothing in this verse is 100% except perhaps the love for our children.
To take your jihadist word letter as example, here is my personal take on it.
Lets start under water.

http://tech.slashdot.org/story/08/12/19/1932219/mediterranean-undersea-cables-cut-again
http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2013/mar/28/egypt-undersea-cable-arrests

One way or the other, your traffic is being monitored and analyzed, analyzed by relatively simple constructs, wordlists, encryption schemes etc. but also more advanced stuff, AI, basysian reasoning, neural networks and more.

So your traffic got flagged. U might think proxying or even chain proxying your traffic is smart but based on relativly simple statistics tools you are easily identified.

Now they know where you live. A couple of options here
1. Break in, install malware/cameras while you're not here
2. Use non-invasive surveillance methods, while not as accurate as numer 1. they are still pretty accurate.
3. The mobile cell tower: The dark van parked outside your house, fires the emp that fires up the hidden 3G modem in your intel cpu and taps into everything from there. (PC not powered on? We issue a WOL on the bus and take it from there)

Now, the NEXT jihad letter you get around to... We're watching you.. errh freudian slip, THEY are watching you...
 

Idontcare

Elite Member
Oct 10, 1999
21,118
59
91
That is the kind of thinking they had in Nazi Germany, Communist China, Soviet Russia, North Korea, oh there is NOTHING you can do, just be a good little slave and go along with it. We all know what that leads to.

Have you lived under, or within, any of those regimes?

By what manner of irrefutable proof do you possess that factually demonstrates any of those regimes have or do exist?

You are worried about your CPU letting others spy on you, and yet you blithely accept a supposed global narrative regarding other nations, past and present, that has you seeing spooky spooks in the dark corners?

Question your sources of all the info you believe you possess. If "they" can get into your CPU then surely "they" have gotten into your indoctrination education and brain as well.

(have any vaccines in your life? nanobots, every single one of them)
 

Idontcare

Elite Member
Oct 10, 1999
21,118
59
91
Now, the NEXT jihad letter you get around to... We're watching you.. errh freudian slip, THEY are watching you...

Dammmmit Agent Smith, er, I mean cytg111, we can't have you going all loose cannon on us like that. Put a cork in it. We all know how imperative "Operation SlickR12345" is to the POTUS! We need this to go by the book!

BTW, Jane says hi and wants to know if you'll be here for this Saturday's BBQ around 5pm or 6pm?

Hold on, wait, what? Oh my, this is rather embarrassing, central just informed me this isn't an inter-NIS chat window but just a regular public forum post, I sure hope my playful kitten Whiskers doesn't pounce on the sendbsurlbsvlkdfkzlbj bf
 

MarkizSchnitzel

Senior member
Nov 10, 2013
424
50
91
To the OP: I sure hope so.

But really, if our law systems were a little better and compatible, I would very much like to drop some kind of a privacy destroying bomb all over the world. It would not affect me in any meaningful way, but it would make the world a better place, even if NSA type organizations would be making sure of it.

Privacy is much too overrated these days. It's more likely all of these personal privacy concerns that affect regular Joes are just instigated by those very same NSAs to divert attention of the flock. there are innumerable more important issues a person can work on to improve.
 

Madpacket

Platinum Member
Nov 15, 2005
2,068
326
126
I think this quote from a recent Bruce Schneier article is worth consideration.

"We are all vulnerable to everyone because the NSA wanted us to be vulnerable to them.

We have one infrastructure. We can't choose a world where the US gets to spy and the Chinese don't. We get to choose a world where everyone can spy, or a world where no one can spy. We can be secure from everyone, or vulnerable to anyone. And I'm tired of us choosing surveillance over security."
 

Markfw

Moderator Emeritus, Elite Member
May 16, 2002
25,758
14,785
136

This has gone out of any possible legitimate CPU discussion, but to OT, so I am locking this thread.
 
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