Are laptop CD/DVD burners as reliable as full sized?

[Muse]

I've been burning a lot of CDs, even DVDs in this laptop's burner. I just got the idea that this might not be very smart. I've been burning literally hundreds of music CDs. I used to do almost all of this burning with a full sized burner in a midtower machine, which I still have. The burner in there is an IDE burner because the SATA on that machine plain sucks, can't accommodate the SATA burner I bought. However, it is a ton bigger than the one in this laptop. I have been finding some occasional music CDs in my collection that no longer play, a handful the last day or so doing inventory, shuffling my disks around. Those discs were burned a few years ago. They haven't been roughly handled, I don't know why they aren't playable now.

Should I be making my copies in a full sized burner or am I not incurring a higher risk of further "NO DISC" messages in my machines by continuing to copy with a laptop burner?

 

[Gunbuster]

What you "should" do: don't cont on any one media being failure proof. Back up to more than one location/media if it's truly important.

Both laptop and desktop burners are price reduced commodity dinosaur items at this point. Short of buying some professional oriented drive I would not count on either for anything mission critical.

 

[corkyg]

Been using both types for many years, and have never had a problem with either. Today, my laptop optical is in a padded bag, and on rare occasions I replace a second data drive with it. Matter of fact, I just used it today to install Win 10 on an old T-60 laptop. Worked perfectly.

Yes, opticals are obsolescent, but not yet obsolete. There is nothing really good yet to replace mailing a DVD to someone.

 

[Charlie98]

I think burned media has a shelf life... whether or not any burner does a good job, well, you see the results of the laptop burner, I would try something else.

I really hope your source media is backed up....

 

[JackMDS]

Laptops has self protection from rising temperature inside the computer.

If DVD/CD R/W is working for Long time the inside Tempt rise and might slow down or even shut off the Laptop.

 

[Jembo]

Google up a bit of info on "bit rot" & you'll see why your CD's are failing. Humidity & age & sunlight are not good for CD RW.

I've used a $20 USB DVD Writer for 5 years heavily. I must have ripped 2 000 discs & never had a problem. That would be my advice to you. Spend $20 on an external DVD Writer if you're concerned about longevity.

 

[Muse]

Google up a bit of info on "bit rot" & you'll see why your CD's are failing. Humidity & age & sunlight are not good for CD RW.

I've used a $20 USB DVD Writer for 5 years heavily. I must have ripped 2 000 discs & never had a problem. That would be my advice to you. Spend $20 on an external DVD Writer if you're concerned about longevity.

I only found out that maybe a 1/2 dozen of my music CDs in my mega-disc players were unplayable the last few days because I decided to reorganize one of the players. After having done so I figured it was a great idea to actually play a bit of each disk to reveal the CD Text (it's on ~97% of these disks), to make sure what my reports said was in slot X was what was in slot X. In many cases it was not! Fixing that was as simple as fixing my data, but the bad disks? Well, most had backups (other player or stacks of extras I have). One or two I don't have a backup, but they don't mean much to me, so I don't care. But yeah, I will make at least two copies in the future if I want to guard against disk failure.

A USB writer? I figure I should get one anyway. I have a little tablet that doesn't support an internal drive. My workaround is sharing the burner on one of the machines on my network. That works for program installation, but a USB writer/player would be simpler.

 

[Insert_Nickname]

Should I be making my copies in a full sized burner or am I not incurring a higher risk of further "NO DISC" messages in my machines by continuing to copy with a laptop burner?

One additional thing to keep in mind are full sized 5.25" drives usually use a higher powered write laser. This can affect longevity.

The key to reliable optical burning are high quality media, slow(er) burn speed and keeping the discs away from humidity and sunlight if possible. CD's are fragile however, with almost no ECC. Don't expect them to last forever.

 

[Gunbuster]

Reconsidering going to a NAS over your CD changer farm yet? RAID your drives for redundancy, even mirror it out to a second NAS at a remote location... No more worry's about if X out of a thousand CD's has degraded.

 

[Insomniator]

Who still burns CD/DVDs...

 

[Muse]

Reconsidering going to a NAS over your CD changer farm yet? RAID your drives for redundancy, even mirror it out to a second NAS at a remote location... No more worry's about if X out of a thousand CD's has degraded.

I really have to do that. For instance, if a big earthquake hits here (projected to sometime "soon," well, eventually), I could lose the whole bunch of CDs. If I have ripped it all to FLAC, I would still have it, assuming it's not just on my own systems. I have a 3TB external HD in a locker off site right now, plan to put another in a safe deposit box for additional backup. I have a NAS (which is RAID mirrored, two 3TB HDs), that's what I'm backing up to the 3TB external HDs, I have 3 of them.

 

[Muse]

Who still burns CD/DVDs...

If you have music CDs, you either burn them or rip for backup.

 

[Muse]

One additional thing to keep in mind are full sized 5.25" drives usually use a higher powered write laser. This can affect longevity.

The key to reliable optical burning are high quality media, slow(er) burn speed and keeping the discs away from humidity and sunlight if possible. CD's are fragile however, with almost no ECC. Don't expect them to last forever.

What's ECC?

A higher powered write laser, IMPROVES longevity expectations?

 

[Insert_Nickname]

What's ECC?

In general; ErrorCorretionCode.

CD's have precious little of it due to being essentially 70's tech.

Wikipedia has a fairly representative article:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compact_Disc_Digital_Audio

A higher powered write laser, IMPROVES longevity expectations?

A higher powered laser leaves a better "impression"/blotch/burn, whatever, on the dye layer. If you combine with lower write speed* where the laser has more time to affect the dye layer, optical discs tend to last longer. I've got some CD-Rs burned in the late 90's which are perfectly readable today. Not that there is anything important on them, but I do check once a year to see if they're still readable. Fun little experiment to see how long they last.

*find out how fast your drive can go in CLV mode. Its usually 16x or 24x for CDs.

Good quality recording media is also important. Unfortunately Taiyo-Yuden has left the optical business, so the really good ones are out of production, though you might find some in stock somewhere.

Anyway thanks for a good nostalgia trip.

If you want to continue using optical media for data storage, I guess there is no avoiding the occasional audio CD, I'd recommend migrating to blu-ray. They use a phase change recording layer instead of an organic one. So should last a pretty while longer, and fits at least ~35x the data on the same 12cm optical disc.

 

[Muse]

In general; ErrorCorretionCode.

CD's have precious little of it due to being essentially 70's tech.

Wikipedia has a fairly representative article:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compact_Disc_Digital_Audio



A higher powered laser leaves a better "impression"/blotch/burn, whatever, on the dye layer. If you combine with lower write speed* where the laser has more time to affect the dye layer, optical discs tend to last longer. I've got some CD-Rs burned in the late 90's which are perfectly readable today. Not that there is anything important on them, but I do check once a year to see if they're still readable. Fun little experiment to see how long they last.

*find out how fast your drive can go in CLV mode. Its usually 16x or 24x for CDs.

Good quality recording media is also important. Unfortunately Taiyo-Yuden has left the optical business, so the really good ones are out of production, though you might find some in stock somewhere.

Anyway thanks for a good nostalgia trip.

If you want to continue using optical media for data storage, I guess there is no avoiding the occasional audio CD, I'd recommend migrating to blu-ray. They use a phase change recording layer instead of an organic one. So should last a pretty while longer, and fits at least ~35x the data on the same 12cm optical disc.

I still have a lot of blank Taiyo-Yuden DVD-R's. So I guess I can't get anymore unless they are in stock somewhere. I'll just probably go with whatever is highly rated at Amazon when that time comes.

I have been burning my CDs at the default speed. I suppose I should slow that down since disk longevity is one of my priorities.

In general I think my disks have been well treated, except I suppose my house might get humid at times. I used to get a lot of condensation on my windows in the early morning when the cold outside air reduces the temperature of the glass and it leaches water from the inside air. I've been working on keeping the inside humidity down in the house for a few years and I think it's working pretty well, it's way lower than it was. The humidity around here isn't what it is in a lot of the USA, but it's not very dry most of the time. Days in the 70% or even higher are common, but higher than 85%, I think, rather uncommon, unless it's raining I suppose.

I've got this external burner in my cart at Amazon right now:

LG Electronics 8X USB 2.0 Slim Portable DVD+/-RW External Drive with M-DISC Support, Retail (Black) GP50NB40, $19.99

I suppose that would have a more powerful laser than the drive in my laptop.

I have no kind of Blu-ray burner. I don't know that one would help me with my CD burning, however. I haven't looked into burning Blu-ray. I figure at some point I'll want to, though.

 

[Insert_Nickname]

In general I think my disks have been well treated, except I suppose my house might get humid at times. I used to get a lot of condensation on my windows in the early morning when the cold outside air reduces the temperature of the glass and it leaches water from the inside air. I've been working on keeping the inside humidity down in the house for a few years and I think it's working pretty well, it's way lower than it was. The humidity around here isn't what it is in a lot of the USA, but it's not very dry most of the time. Days in the 70% or even higher are common, but higher than 85%, I think, rather uncommon, unless it's raining I suppose.

Kind of sounds like the climate around here. That shouldn't be a problem. Very high humidity environments (think 95%+) can cause problems. Not only for discs, but all kinds of electronics.

If you store them somewhere with a stable temperature, humidity and away from sunlight, things should be fine.

I've got this external burner in my cart at Amazon right now:

LG Electronics 8X USB 2.0 Slim Portable DVD+/-RW External Drive with M-DISC Support, Retail (Black) GP50NB40, $19.99

I suppose that would have a more powerful laser than the drive in my laptop.

From the look of it, that's just an average laptop drive in an external case.

I'd look for something looking like a 5.25" drive in an external case.

Just a couple of examples:

http://www.lg.com/us/burners-drives/lg-GE24NU40-external-dvd-rewriter

Note this one is a BDXL writer, so it may be a bit overkill...

http://www.lg.com/us/burners-drives/lg-BE14NU40-external-blu-ray-dvd-drive

I have no kind of Blu-ray burner. I don't know that one would help me with my CD burning, however. I haven't looked into burning Blu-ray. I figure at some point I'll want to, though.

A blu-ray writer will not help with CD/DVDs. Blu-rays uses a laser with a different wavelength. There are actually two R/W lasers inside a blu-ray drive, one for each standard.

 

[Muse]

Kind of sounds like the climate around here. That shouldn't be a problem. Very high humidity environments (think 95%+) can cause problems. Not only for discs, but all kinds of electronics.

If you store them somewhere with a stable temperature, humidity and away from sunlight, things should be fine.



From the look of it, that's just an average laptop drive in an external case.

I'd look for something looking like a 5.25" drive in an external case.

Just a couple of examples:

http://www.lg.com/us/burners-drives/lg-GE24NU40-external-dvd-rewriter

Note this one is a BDXL writer, so it may be a bit overkill...

http://www.lg.com/us/burners-drives/lg-BE14NU40-external-blu-ray-dvd-drive

A blu-ray writer will not help with CD/DVDs. Blu-rays uses a laser with a different wavelength. There are actually two R/W lasers inside a blu-ray drive, one for each standard.

Thanks for the tips. I just confirmed a Buy-it-Now on a manufacturer refurbished GE24NU40BK with software on Ebay, shipped for $28.59:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/262249653518

 

[JeffMD]

#1 once it is burnt, if it is readable then you will generally not have any more or less an issue down the road compared to any other burner. high error rates may cause problems with poor reading drives.

#2 today dvd burning is kind of mastered. Even the crappiest NEW burners will burn disc with their eyes closed. Failure rates are strictly a media problem.

#3 that said, laptop dvd burners are still a couple steps behind desktop burners in speeds by like %50, probably due to not being able to anchor the disc down with enough metal to combat vibrations. If you do a lot of burning, try a full sized dvd drive in an external enclosure.

 

[Puffnstuff]

I would burn and not think about it. When the dvdrw in my sons laptop died I spent just a few bucks and bought a replacement which took all of about 10 minutes to install. When the unit in my alienware fails I will replace it with a Panasonic bdrw.

 

[Muse]

#1 once it is burnt, if it is readable then you will generally not have any more or less an issue down the road compared to any other burner. high error rates may cause problems with poor reading drives.

#2 today dvd burning is kind of mastered. Even the crappiest NEW burners will burn disc with their eyes closed. Failure rates are strictly a media problem.

#3 that said, laptop dvd burners are still a couple steps behind desktop burners in speeds by like %50, probably due to not being able to anchor the disc down with enough metal to combat vibrations.

Thanks for these assessments.

If you do a lot of burning, try a full sized dvd drive in an external enclosure.

This validates my purchase, that's what I just bought (see my last post), should have it by Wednesday, i.e. within 5 days. Currently I'm doing more burning than I've ever done, by far. I bought the 81 disk Glenn Gould remastered set and am making two copies of each disk, altering the badly composed CD Text fields before burning. That's 162 disks right there, I'm about 25% done.

 

[Insert_Nickname]

#1 once it is burnt, if it is readable then you will generally not have any more or less an issue down the road compared to any other burner. high error rates may cause problems with poor reading drives.

CD players tend to be more forgiving then PC drives with disc errors. Data CDs are another matter entirely. Some drives don't like particular media and so on.

#2 today dvd burning is kind of mastered. Even the crappiest NEW burners will burn disc with their eyes closed. Failure rates are strictly a media problem.

Fortunately burners today are pretty standardized. That does not mean there aren't quality differences however.

Always use quality media.

#3 that said, laptop dvd burners are still a couple steps behind desktop burners in speeds by like %50, probably due to not being able to anchor the disc down with enough metal to combat vibrations. If you do a lot of burning, try a full sized dvd drive in an external enclosure.

Speed rating is a very poor indicator of drive (and burn) quality. High quality mobile drives do exist. High burn speed also means less time for the laser to affect the dye layer.

How I do miss my old Yamaha CRW-F1 at times.

 

[Cerb]

I have been finding some occasional music CDs in my collection that no longer play, a handful the last day or so doing inventory, shuffling my disks around. Those discs were burned a few years ago. They haven't been roughly handled, I don't know why they aren't playable now.

Just make new ones.

Good quality old Verbatim Datalife Plus, genuine Sony, genuine TDK, or TY, last. I've got late 90s CDs that still play, made from discs that took miracles with EAC and multiple drives to rip. I could leave those old CD-Rs in my car, and they'd last 6-12 months. OTOH, newer ones I consider to have good longevity if they last more than a year or two normally, and 3+ months in my car (yeah, one of these days I'll be replacing the factory system, but I keep procrastinating, and CD-Rs are cheap).

Should I be making my copies in a full sized burner or am I not incurring a higher risk of further "NO DISC" messages in my machines by continuing to copy with a laptop burner?

The discs are disposable. It's been a long time since you could buy known-quality media for CD.

You should be making copies from files on hard drives that have some kind of CRC checking available, like FLAC, at least, if not being stored on a filesystem that can detect such things (like ZFS, ReFS, and BTRFS). What you burn them with is much less important. With the quality players out of anything but BD discs, now, media quality is a roll of the dice.

 

[TylerHartman]

Google up a bit of info on "bit rot" & you'll see why your CD's are failing. Humidity & age & sunlight are not good for CD RW.

I've used a $20 USB DVD Writer for 5 years heavily. I must have ripped 2 000 discs & never had a problem. That would be my advice to you. Spend $20 on an external DVD Writer if you're concerned about longevity.

What he said