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mikeymikec

Lifer
May 19, 2011
18,593
11,276
136
When a scandal threatens the PM, standard UK political policy is to find a scapegoat and pin everything on them even if it makes no sense to. Does that happen in America often too?
 

vi edit

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Oct 28, 1999
62,483
8,344
126
When a scandal threatens the PM, standard UK political policy is to find a scapegoat and pin everything on them even if it makes no sense to. Does that happen in America often too?

At one time, sure. Now? It's just create an endless deluge of scandals that you can't possibly concentrate on a single one for more than a news cycle. Which is another problem. News cycles now are measured in hours. Something bad comes up? Trump says something stupid points in a random direction and reporters trip after one another chasing it.
 
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fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
85,632
50,851
136
More than 370 former federal prosecutors have signed on to a letter stating that the evidence contained in the Mueller report would have led to multiple felony indictments if he were not the president and they say it's not even a close call - Trump easily meets the standard. These individuals stretch back from every administration since Eisenhower.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/trump-would-have-been-charged-with-obstruction-were-he-not-president-hundreds-of-former-federal-prosecutors-assert/2019/05/06/e4946a1a-7006-11e9-9f06-5fc2ee80027a_story.html

We need to be aware of the scope of the national emergency that faces us and why it is utterly necessary to begin impeachment proceedings even if they won't succeed. The current president is a multiple felon and those felonies deal explicitly with him abusing the powers of the presidency for personal gain. If that's not impeachment worthy then what is? Currently the Republicans in Congress and the Attorney General are actively working to undermine the system of justice that could bring him to account.
 

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
111,132
30,082
146
More than 370 former federal prosecutors have signed on to a letter stating that the evidence contained in the Mueller report would have led to multiple felony indictments if he were not the president and they say it's not even a close call - Trump easily meets the standard. These individuals stretch back from every administration since Eisenhower.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/trump-would-have-been-charged-with-obstruction-were-he-not-president-hundreds-of-former-federal-prosecutors-assert/2019/05/06/e4946a1a-7006-11e9-9f06-5fc2ee80027a_story.html

We need to be aware of the scope of the national emergency that faces us and why it is utterly necessary to begin impeachment proceedings even if they won't succeed. The current president is a multiple felon and those felonies deal explicitly with him abusing the powers of the presidency for personal gain. If that's not impeachment worthy then what is? Currently the Republicans in Congress and the Attorney General are actively working to undermine the system of justice that could bring him to account.

Both Grant and Harding wipe the long-standing sweat from their [corpse's] brows. Now no longer the most corrupt, scandalous, and wholly incompetent administrations in history!
 

sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
70,231
5,806
126
I'm beginning to have second thoughts on Impeaching Trump at this time. If the House votes to Impeach and the Senate does not, Trump is going to yet again declare himself Cleared of wrongdoing. Of course that would be ridiculous and only the ignorant or sycophants would fall for it, but people keep falling for it, so...

That said, keep tossing everyone else around him in Jail/Out of power who are involved in his shit and people are going to start putting 2 and 2 together. That will also make it increasingly difficult for Trump to insulate himself as fewer people are going to want to be associated with him.

If he wins in 2020 and the Dems win the Senate, nail his ass to the wall.
 
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blankslate

Diamond Member
Jun 16, 2008
8,705
507
126
If only someone didn't run a
“scripted, soulless campaign”
Then Trump wouldn't have been able to eek out an Electoral College win?
BOOK: Obama Took 2016 Election as ‘Personal Insult,’ Blamed Hillary’s ‘Soulless, Scripted Campaign’

Maybe the New York Times White House Correspondent Peter Baker is just a complete lying sack of crap or perhaps President Obama and others in his administration did really think that's part of the reason Clinton lost.

Shill all you want but Hillary could have made different choices. As far as VP goes President Obama chose someone who was seen as much more experienced in Government than he was which mollified people who mentioned his relative lack of experience. Hillary could have done the same thing by choosing someone who was a noticeably left of her positions rather than choose Tim Kaine who in some ways was to the right of her. WT actual F?!?!

If your reply is going to be base AF shill screed don't bother. Politics isn't like kids sports where everyone is a winner just for showing up.


_________
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
85,632
50,851
136
If only someone didn't run a

Then Trump wouldn't have been able to eek out an Electoral College win?
BOOK: Obama Took 2016 Election as ‘Personal Insult,’ Blamed Hillary’s ‘Soulless, Scripted Campaign’

Maybe the New York Times White House Correspondent Peter Baker is just a complete lying sack of crap or perhaps President Obama and others in his administration did really think that's part of the reason Clinton lost.

Shill all you want but Hillary could have made different choices. As far as VP goes President Obama chose someone who was seen as much more experienced in Government than he was which mollified people who mentioned his relative lack of experience. Hillary could have done the same thing by choosing someone who was a noticeably left of her positions rather than choose Tim Kaine who in some ways was to the right of her. WT actual F?!?!

If your reply is going to be base AF shill screed don't bother. Politics isn't like kids sports where everyone is a winner just for showing up.


_________

You can certainly criticize Clinton for running a bad campaign but you should NEVER allow that to distract from the people who are at fault for Trump - the Republican Party and the people who voted for him.
 
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blankslate

Diamond Member
Jun 16, 2008
8,705
507
126
Hillary could have easily have mitigated it. It's a given that people who voted for Trump were gullible as human feces.

yet even mentioning that Hillary made mistakes is just verboten to some.


___________
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
85,632
50,851
136
Hillary could have easily have mitigated it. It's a given that people who voted for Trump were gullible as human feces.

yet even mentioning that Hillary made mistakes is just verboten to some.


___________

I can't think of anyone who has ever said that any criticism of Clinton is forbidden. I have seen a lot of people say that it's Clinton's fault we have Trump.

It is not, it is the Republicans' fault we have Trump. They nominated him, they voted for him, they support him even today. We can never let them evade their responsibility for this like they tried with GWB.
 
Reactions: Fanatical Meat

interchange

Diamond Member
Oct 10, 1999
8,022
2,872
136
If only someone didn't run a

Then Trump wouldn't have been able to eek out an Electoral College win?
BOOK: Obama Took 2016 Election as ‘Personal Insult,’ Blamed Hillary’s ‘Soulless, Scripted Campaign’

Maybe the New York Times White House Correspondent Peter Baker is just a complete lying sack of crap or perhaps President Obama and others in his administration did really think that's part of the reason Clinton lost.

Shill all you want but Hillary could have made different choices. As far as VP goes President Obama chose someone who was seen as much more experienced in Government than he was which mollified people who mentioned his relative lack of experience. Hillary could have done the same thing by choosing someone who was a noticeably left of her positions rather than choose Tim Kaine who in some ways was to the right of her. WT actual F?!?!

If your reply is going to be base AF shill screed don't bother. Politics isn't like kids sports where everyone is a winner just for showing up.


_________

What does Hillary's campaign have to do with illegal activity by the President and partisan failure to hold him to account for it? The election is long over. None of this has fuckall to do with Hillary.
 

blankslate

Diamond Member
Jun 16, 2008
8,705
507
126
What does Hillary's campaign have to do with illegal activity by the President and partisan failure to hold him to account for it? The election is long over. None of this has fuckall to do with Hillary.

Other than the fact that her
“scripted, soulless campaign”
contributed in part to the fact that he is actually sitting in the Oval Office at least when he's not committing emoluments clause violations and golfing in Mara Lago.


____________
 

fleshconsumed

Diamond Member
Feb 21, 2002
6,485
2,363
136
Hillary could have easily have mitigated it. It's a given that people who voted for Trump were gullible as human feces.


yet even mentioning that Hillary made mistakes is just verboten to some.



___________

Other than the fact that her contributed in part to the fact that he is actually sitting in the Oval Office at least when he's not committing emoluments clause violations and golfing in Mara Lago.



____________


This is a profoundly misguided argument. There is no question that Hillary could have and should have done things better.

However, there were a dozen other candidates in the republican primary, yet republicans voted for Trump in the primaries, and republicans voted for Trump in the general election. Republicans saying Hillary should have done more is like drunk driver saying his buddies should have done more to stop him from driving drunk and wrecking his car. No. He chose to drink that night, and he chose to drive while drunk. Yeah, maybe his buddies should have better friends and done more, but in the end, the responsibility lies with the individual who chose to drink and drive and no one else.
 
Reactions: cytg111 and dank69

blankslate

Diamond Member
Jun 16, 2008
8,705
507
126
This is a profoundly misguided argument. There is no question that Hillary could have and should have done things better.

However, there were a dozen other candidates in the republican primary, yet republicans voted for Trump in the primaries, and republicans voted for Trump in the general election. Republicans saying Hillary should have done more is like drunk driver saying his buddies should have done more to stop him from driving drunk and wrecking his car. No. He chose to drink that night, and he chose to drive while drunk. Yeah, maybe his buddies should have better friends and done more, but in the end, the responsibility lies with the individual who chose to drink and drive and no one else.

Trump was better at lying than all of those other Republican candidates... that doesn't make your characterization of my statements as "profoundly misguided" correct no matter how much you wish it to be so.

I wasn't aware that President Obama was a registered Republican either....



_____________
 

mikeymikec

Lifer
May 19, 2011
18,593
11,276
136
Hillary could have easily have mitigated it. It's a given that people who voted for Trump were gullible as human feces.

Provided one is playing the right tune. Trump's been playing the xenophobia siren song for quite some time.
 

cytg111

Lifer
Mar 17, 2008
23,993
13,519
136
I'm beginning to have second thoughts on Impeaching Trump at this time. If the House votes to Impeach and the Senate does not, Trump is going to yet again declare himself Cleared of wrongdoing. Of course that would be ridiculous and only the ignorant or sycophants would fall for it, but people keep falling for it, so...

That said, keep tossing everyone else around him in Jail/Out of power who are involved in his shit and people are going to start putting 2 and 2 together. That will also make it increasingly difficult for Trump to insulate himself as fewer people are going to want to be associated with him.

If he wins in 2020 and the Dems win the Senate, nail his ass to the wall.

If you do nothing now. History will judge you.
If you do nothing now and Trump wins 2020. History will fucking destroy you.
 
Last edited:
Reactions: dank69

pcgeek11

Lifer
Jun 12, 2005
21,630
4,683
136
Yeah we are getting ready to vote to hold the US Attorney General in contempt of congress for ignoring subpoenas. We're definitely going....somewhere.


It isn't like it hasn't happened before. I think Holder broke that cherry.

On June 20, 2012, the Oversight Committee voted 23–17 along party lines to hold Holder in contempt of Congress for not releasing documents the committee had requested. ... On June 28, 2012, Holder became the first U.S. Attorney General in history to be held in both criminal and civil contempt.
 

dank69

Lifer
Oct 6, 2009
36,125
30,516
136
Not there yet. Trump's approval rating just ticked up to 46% per Gallup. Americans are fine people.
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
85,632
50,851
136
Not there yet. Trump's approval rating just ticked up to 46% per Gallup. Americans are fine people.

And his polling averages are still in the same range they are always in.

Not sure why people cherry pick polls. What’s the point?
 
Mar 11, 2004
23,279
5,720
146
Hillary could have easily have mitigated it. It's a given that people who voted for Trump were gullible as human feces.

yet even mentioning that Hillary made mistakes is just verboten to some.


___________

I like how you try to dismiss any criticisms of your one point that is based entirely on a quote from a book allegedly about how Obama felt.

Do you have something more substantial than that? Or are you wanting your participation trophy so you can go and pretend that you won an inane argument that you want to have...for some reason, even though it has absolutely no bearing on things now? You're almost as bad as Turmp spending over a year trying to convince people he really did in fact win the election. You just look like a simpleton that is as petty and empty as you're trying to proclaim others as, while trying to dumb your argument down into literally just a few words that you repeat over and over. Goddamn dude, you have to be one of the dipshits that voted for Turmp and have been stewing that well its not your fault cause Hilary wasn't "likeable" (which chances are, you really mean sexually attractive) enough so you just couldn't with good conscious vote for her!

Now run along kiddo, while the adults discuss the matters at hand.
 

dank69

Lifer
Oct 6, 2009
36,125
30,516
136
And his polling averages are still in the same range they are always in.

Not sure why people cherry pick polls. What’s the point?
Not cherry picking, just pointing out that his rating was trending up despite all the obstruction and shenannigans he is pulling. Granted this poll was conducted the day before Mueller's letter was made public, so we'll have to see how that affects it and how the 400+ former prosecutors thing affects it, but still, for it to be trending up at all is just depressing.
 
Mar 11, 2004
23,279
5,720
146
We don't need guns. We could just quit buying shit we don't need and bring the economy and country to its knees. The government might not give a shit about us individuals but when businesses and investors start complaining the politicians will listen.

That's a nice thought, but unfortunately they have the American people right where they want them (living paycheck to paycheck so that they're already stretched as thin as can be).
 

SMOGZINN

Lifer
Jun 17, 2005
14,221
4,452
136
Trump was better at lying than all of those other Republican candidates... that doesn't make your characterization of my statements as "profoundly misguided" correct no matter how much you wish it to be so.

I wasn't aware that President Obama was a registered Republican either....

Your argument basically comes down to we are standing on the edge of a roof of a burning building and have to jump for it. There is two places we can land, a pile of shit and a large airbag that is safe but ugly.

You are saying that because the airbag had a terrible paisley print we of course decided to fall into the pile of shit that might not even break our fall.

HOW DOES THIS MAKE SENSE?

Hillary made mistakes, no doubt. Mistakes that might have cost her the election against a normal candidate. None of those mistakes were even a tenth of what Trump made. None of them were so big that people should have decided that Trump was the better candidate. Trump talked about his penis during a national debate.

In the end I have to conclude that It did not matter if Hillary ran the perfect campaign. She was not going to win. Americans just decided they wanted the worst piece of trash they could find. Nothing was going to change that.
 
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fleshconsumed

Diamond Member
Feb 21, 2002
6,485
2,363
136
Again, back to the topic at hand, treasury just denied access to Trump's taxes, same taxes that Cohen said could prove allegations of financial fraud by Trump. It's painful to see half of the America cheering corruption and slow slide into fascism.
 
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