Are you kidding??? Early School Start Times are bad for students

[spacejamz]

http://www.cnn.com/2014/08/28/health/school-start-times/index.html?hpt=hp_c2

here is the what the CNN article referenced:
http://www.healio.com/pediatrics/ad...sleep-among-adolescents-a-public-health-issue

As if kids need to be coddled anymore....heaven forbid their parents make them go to bed earlier....

OMG social media is making our kids stay up later so we need to push the school start times past 8:30AM so they get enough sleep...

I can see it now...Sorry boss...I can't come in at 8 anymore because it is bad for my kids to get up early....

 

[senseamp]

The scientists are giving you the data, you can decide what to do with it, don't be all mad that they gave you data. Data doesn't coddle anyone or make anyone late for work.

 

[Mai72]

American kids need to see what South Korean students go through. SK kids arrive at school at 7am and end at 1am. Sure, the suicide rate is high but the extremely long hours they spend in school builds character and a certain toughness.

American kids have turned into wimps.

 

[brycejones]

OP why are you so outraged?

 

[Oldgamer]

Spacejamz, they are giving scientific evidence. I for one felt my kids when they were little did better at later times in the morning as far as memory retention and being able to focus. All my kids had a very hard time with super early morning times. If I got them up at 9am they did much better. But having to get them out of bed at 6:00 am every morning to make the bus at 7:20am was really difficult. As a parent I for one agree with this study. For the record we put our kids to bed at 9pm every night, no exceptions and they still had a hard time getting up that early.

 

[Newell Steamer]

Nope.

The student's won't dictate how schools should accommodate for them (unless the student is handicapped, etc.) - especially when it comes to schedules.

Up until 18, you will show up and do what you are told, at the noted time. Then, when you get to college, you can take your 2pm classes and stay up all night doing whatever you want.

Standard have been set:
- lunches
- programs (help & tutoring)
- subjects (pick a language, pick a pre-college course)
- after school activities (sports, clubs, etc.)
- considering special needs (again, handicapped, diets, etc.)

Shifting the time, to account for staying up late, will throw everything off - and why? Because Jimmy wants to stay up late slinging slurs on XBox? Not going to happen.

 

[nehalem256]

The technical report released with the policy statement says that sleep-deprived teens tend to eat more carbohydrates and fats, with every hour of sleep that is lost increasing the odds of obesity by 80%. Adolescents that go to sleep at midnight or later are also more likely to suffer from depression and have suicidal thoughts.

The American Academy of Pediatrics recommends that adolescents get 8.5 to 9.5 hours of sleep per night, which parents can help enforce by setting bedtimes and limiting their child's use of electronic devices and social media in bed.

Sounds like the solution is parenting!

 

[PokerGuy]

I have no problem with the science and research into the effects of early times etc, but I do have a problem with the conclusion and recommendation that start times be changed to at least 8:30 AM. The problem is that the kids are not getting enough sleep, and that means they should be going to bed earlier, not that we need to shift the school schedules to later. There are big implications to shifting school schedules to later (especially for parents who work outside the home). Heaven forbid that we expect parents to actually parent and get their kid in bed rather than screwing around on facebook 'till midnight.

 

[PokerGuy]

Sounds like the solution is parenting!

Gasp.. you can't be serious. We can't expect parents to parent, we need to make society responsible for parenting, and blame society when the kids don't receive appropriate parental guidance

 

[dphantom]

Gasp.. you can't be serious. We can't expect parents to parent, we need to make society responsible for parenting, and blame society when the kids don't receive appropriate parental guidance

it takes a village. :sneaky:

 

[Anubis]

its not just teenagers, the 8-5 work day is not optimal for many persons

however the topic at hand is correct, however nothing will change. what needs to change is the amount of other shit people have their kids do today. 8 million extra activities and sports and whatever means less time for doing school work, so people stay up later and blah blah blah

cutting out some of that and limiting time spent on stupid shit like facebook would help people get to bed earlier. that however would not change the fact that many people are simply not wired to learn/work early in the morning


ive always been that way, you could wake me up from a year long coma and I would still be a zombie if it was before 9 am

 

[spacejamz]

OP why are you so outraged?

Probably because the conclusion to move the school start times past 8:30 is just utterly stupid and based on the fact that kids are staying up later because of social media...their phones, mobile devices and computers in their room are cause...instead of recommending that they cut down on these activities, they recommend to push the start time back.

 

[nickbits]

Sounds good to me. Mornings suck. I usually was half asleep until noon most of HS.

 

[spacejamz]

Spacejamz, they are giving scientific evidence. I for one felt my kids when they were little did better at later times in the morning as far as memory retention and being able to focus. All my kids had a very hard time with super early morning times. If I got them up at 9am they did much better. But having to get them out of bed at 6:00 am every morning to make the bus at 7:20am was really difficult. As a parent I for one agree with this study. For the record we put our kids to bed at 9pm every night, no exceptions and they still had a hard time getting up that early.

What about all of those other students who make very good grades at the current start times? are they just outliers???

 

[spacejamz]

Sounds good to me. Mornings suck. I usually was half asleep until noon most of HS.

What time did you go to sleep back then?

 

[Anubis]

What time did you go to sleep back then?

I went to bed between 1030-1130 when I was in HS and got up at 7

that's pmuch 8 hours of sleep, was never enough

going to sleep any earlier than that was not really doable

school got out at 3, sports stuff went to 5 or later if it was an away event
Dinner
homework

and this was before most modern tech

 

[HumblePie]

Some people are morning people and some are not. I am not a morning person. I can go to bed at 8pm to 9pm every night, wake up at 5am every morning, and do that for years. Guess what? I'm still tired when I wake up at 5am every single time. Even though I get 8 to 9 hours of sleep it doesn't do me any good. Funny thing is, if I go to bed at 4am and wake up at 9am, which is only 5 hours of sleep I am right as rain every single time. Not tired, not messed up, not anything. 9am is my magic wake up time. Doesn't matter when I go to sleep as long as I get 4 hours or more I am good so long as I wake up at 9am or later.

Strange isn't? Don't know why but it has always been the case for me. Still I make myself wakeup at 6am every morning for work and drag my ass in loading up on caffeine as I can. Sucks badly.

 

[spacejamz]

I went to bed between 1030-1130 when I was in HS and got up at 7

that's pmuch 8 hours of sleep, was never enough

going to sleep any earlier than that was not really doable

school got out at 3, sports stuff went to 5 or later if it was an away event
Dinner
homework

and this was before most modern tech

My anecdotal story: I went to HS from 84-87. My junior/senior year, I was a stocker at a grocery store working 30 a week (usually worked to 10 or 11 when I worked). Would typically go to sleep around midnight and had a 3.8 GPA...

 

[Atomic Playboy]

Some people are morning people and some are not. I am not a morning person. I can go to bed at 8pm to 9pm every night, wake up at 5am every morning, and do that for years. Guess what? I'm still tired when I wake up at 5am every single time. Even though I get 8 to 9 hours of sleep it doesn't do me any good. Funny thing is, if I go to bed at 4am and wake up at 9am, which is only 5 hours of sleep I am right as rain every single time. Not tired, not messed up, not anything. 9am is my magic wake up time. Doesn't matter when I go to sleep as long as I get 4 hours or more I am good so long as I wake up at 9am or later.

Strange isn't? Don't know why but it has always been the case for me. Still I make myself wakeup at 6am every morning for work and drag my ass in loading up on caffeine as I can. Sucks badly.

To make this a true scientific experiment, try going to bed at 12AM and waking up at 5. Maybe your body needs exactly 5 hours of sleep and the extra sleep you get by going to bed early is detrimental.

 

[Subyman]

I don't really see an issue. If you move the time to 9-10am, then they will just stay up until 3-4am instead of 1-2am. Who is going to take their kids to school at 9-10am? Most people are at work. That's why the times are early, so parents can get their kids to school as they go to work.

 

[nickbits]

What time did you go to sleep back then?

10pm I think.

 

[Brainonska511]

It's not kids being coddled. It may come as a surprise to you, but research has shown that people of different ages have different periods of the day that they are most alert and active. Forcing people to go to bed earlier won't necessarily cancel biology. This is simply about putting school at times that they would be most amenable to paying attention, which would also have the side benefit of giving teens the much needed sleep they need during development.

Obviously, there are issues with balancing society and work schedules with school schedules. But those societal issues don't discredit the merits of research in sleep and periods of maximum alertness that change based on stage of development.

 

[fleshconsumed]

The technical report released with the policy statement says that sleep-deprived teens tend to eat more carbohydrates and fats, with every hour of sleep that is lost increasing the odds of obesity by 80%. Adolescents that go to sleep at midnight or later are also more likely to suffer from depression and have suicidal thoughts.

On the other hand, middle and high schools that start later in the day tend to have students with less daytime sleepiness, less tardiness, fewer attention difficulties and better academic performance than early-starting schools.

Stupid/obvious research/article is stupid/obvious. Of course if someone goes to bed at midnight or later and then has to wake up at 6 to get to HS at 7 then he is going to be sleep deprived, groggy, and possibly depressed. The solution is not to start the school later. That will just shift the whole daily schedule couple of hours forward so everyone who'd go to bed at midnight, will now go to bed at 1 or 2 am. The solution is to cut stuff out of the daily routine so that students go to bed earlier. If they spend too much time watching TV and playing video games, then cut those out, they don't contribute much to the kid development anyway. If the problem is the kid has too many extra curricular activities, it gets a little harder to decide what gets cut, but if you have to get enough sleep, that's what has to be done. The problem is not that the school starts early, the problem, as article implied is that kids are going to sleep at midnight thus not getting enough sleep. Not enough sleep is the real problem. Starting school later doesn't fix anything because it just shifts everything 1 or 2 hours forward including going to bed. Stupid is stupid. Can't believe anyone anyone spent time/money on this stupid research and can't believe I commented on it. Should have stayed away and saved myself 5 minutes.

 

[CU]

To make this a true scientific experiment, try going to bed at 12AM and waking up at 5. Maybe your body needs exactly 5 hours of sleep and the extra sleep you get by going to bed early is detrimental.

I am the same way and I have tried that. I was still tired. I am also a heavy sleeper and can sleep 11 hours without much trouble if nothing wakes me up. But no matter how many hours of sleep I get if I wake up early say 5, 6, 7, and even sometimes 8 I feel really tired. I don't really consider myself fully awake and at my top performance level until noon. I also rarely get sleepy late at night, no matter how many hours I get of sleep. But, on the flip side if I lay down at any time I can fall asleep at the drop of a hat.

 

[LegendKiller]

American kids need to see what South Korean students go through. SK kids arrive at school at 7am and end at 1am. Sure, the suicide rate is high but the extremely long hours they spend in school builds character and a certain toughness.

American kids have turned into wimps.

So you're telling me that Korean kids spend 18 hours in school? Let's assume another hour to get there and back, plus an hour of extra time, that means they get what, 4hrs of sleep per morning?

Yeah, sure.