Arizona Republicans Propose Bill That Would Not Allow Atheists To Graduate High Schoo

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cave_dweller

Senior member
Mar 3, 2012
231
0
0
You think states are able to just ignore the Constitution?

The feds were not granted the power to protect individuals from unwise or unjust state laws. Your constitution was setup to limit your federal governments rights. The supreme court is there to overturn unconstitutional federal laws. It wasn't design to strike dpwn state laws that is why Texas can make Dildo's illegal if they want to.
 

IronWing

No Lifer
Jul 20, 2001
69,532
27,835
136
The feds were not granted the power to protect individuals from unwise or unjust state laws. Your constitution was setup to limit your federal governments rights. The supreme court is there to overturn unconstitutional federal laws. It wasn't design to strike dpwn state laws that is why Texas can make Dildo's illegal if they want to.
You are wrong. It's that simple.

Amendment XIV

Section 1.

All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the state wherein they reside. No state shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any state deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.
 
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tommo123

Platinum Member
Sep 25, 2005
2,617
48
91
So an atheist is unable to recite the words: "So help me God"?

can they change the line to "so help me Allah?". hell, why not say "so help me Satan?" or go with the older gods - zeus/odin etc.

why does this kind of thing happen so much in the US? i've been there a few times and people seemed fine, but these stories make you all look like a bunch of retarded freaks who believe in a magic man on a cloud

i wonder when you'll get a pres who's an atheist - fox news' reaction would be priceless
 

Rangoric

Senior member
Apr 5, 2006
532
0
71
The United States, our Declaration, our Constitution, our Bill of Rights, every fiber of our ourselves was founded under natural law. That no government can or will take away our god given rights. That human rights need to stand above governments, as they come from god.

That pledge and its end are not unique, nor a mistake. Its the traditional affirmation of our Judeo-Christian heritage, the basis for our laws.

Atheists who have a problem with this saying, are thereby contesting natural law. Which, as I hope I've explained, is a very... interesting... stance to take.

Yes God is so important. That's why under God has been in the pledge for about 60 years! And on coins for 150 and bills for 60 years. All since the start of this nation... Oh wait.

This is aside from the whole "to disagree with god is to think murder is good and freedom sucks" nonsense you are trying.

That's a very... interesting... stance to take.
 

nehalem256

Lifer
Apr 13, 2012
15,669
8
0
Yes God is so important. That's why under God has been in the pledge for about 60 years! And on coins for 150 and bills for 60 years. All since the start of this nation... Oh wait.

So what you are saying is that Atheists cannot use US currency or coinage... oh wait.
 

Jaskalas

Lifer
Jun 23, 2004
33,581
7,642
136
...
No High School student will reach real truth via an oath that is forced. Education, real education, only that education that awakens the human heart will do any good...

Don't know about the rest, but we are in absolute agreement on that particular.
 

Jaskalas

Lifer
Jun 23, 2004
33,581
7,642
136
Yes God is so important. That's why under God has been in the pledge for about 60 years! And on coins for 150 and bills for 60 years. All since the start of this nation... Oh wait.

I suggest you learn what the founders thought of natural law, what it meant to them, and the right of Americans to kill the British for our liberty.

Here's a taste:

When in the Course of human events it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness.
 
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IronWing

No Lifer
Jul 20, 2001
69,532
27,835
136
I suggest you learn what the founders thought of natural law, what it meant to them, and the right of Americans to kill the British for our liberty.

Here's a taste:
And yet the founders chose to leave all mention of natural law and god(s) out of the Constitution. Given their interest in these matters it would be hard to argue that this was anything but an intentional omission.
 

Jaskalas

Lifer
Jun 23, 2004
33,581
7,642
136
And yet the founders chose to leave all mention of natural law and god(s) out of the Constitution. Given their interest in these matters it would be hard to argue that this was anything but an intentional omission.

On the contrary, the Bill of Rights is to protect us from our government. A limited government of enumerated powers. Why would they do that, if not to attempt to stop future assault on natural law? The modern term for it is human rights.
 

Bulk Beef

Diamond Member
Aug 14, 2001
5,466
0
76
The feds were not granted the power to protect individuals from unwise or unjust state laws. Your constitution was setup to limit your federal governments rights. The supreme court is there to overturn unconstitutional federal laws. It wasn't design to strike dpwn state laws that is why Texas can make Dildo's illegal if they want to.
You're so fucking wrong, I hope to GOD (yeah I went there) that you're not a high school graduate yourself. If you are, I weep for whatever generation you belong to.
 

Onceler

Golden Member
Feb 28, 2008
1,264
0
71
Just lie it shouldn't be too much of a stretch for atheists who don't believe in afterlife punishment.
 

LunarRay

Diamond Member
Mar 2, 2003
9,993
1
76
It seems the issue is absence of a religious affiliation....

IF the believers in Xenu or Smith, along with the Christian and Jew and Muslim and Hindu and all the rest can call their belief system appropriate for graduation because they have either a god or some such advantage why can't the atheist...
Call it "A Theist" where their god instructs his flock to reject him via intuitive implantation of the message and the sure knowledge that he will return and align the stars to spell "I'm Back".... in Attica Greek.

The advantage of 'A Theist' is that there exists NO evidence of his existence so this belief IS based on the evidence... While all the rest require some faith in a reality based on evidence.
 

Atreus21

Lifer
Aug 21, 2007
12,007
572
126
Okay, thread title is mildly misleading. The bill does not say "No atheists may graduate." It says, "Everyone must say 'So help me God' after an oath."
 

Atreus21

Lifer
Aug 21, 2007
12,007
572
126
It seems the issue is absence of a religious affiliation....

IF the believers in Xenu or Smith, along with the Christian and Jew and Muslim and Hindu and all the rest can call their belief system appropriate for graduation because they have either a god or some such advantage why can't the atheist...
Call it "A Theist" where their god instructs his flock to reject him via intuitive implantation of the message and the sure knowledge that he will return and align the stars to spell "I'm Back".... in Attica Greek.

The advantage of 'A Theist' is that there exists NO evidence of his existence so this belief IS based on the evidence... While all the rest require some faith in a reality based on evidence.

No evidence? Did all of the universe come from nowhere?
 

zsdersw

Lifer
Oct 29, 2003
10,560
2
0
Its a basically empty phrase(certainly for Atheists) commonly tacked on to oaths.

EDIT: Would you feel better if atheists could instead say "So help me invisibly sky fairy"?

They shouldn't be required to take any oath whatsoever.
 

Darwin333

Lifer
Dec 11, 2006
19,946
2,329
126
Students should be supporting the Constitution, If they dont like it then maybe they should go somewhere else. If we followed the Constitution we would be much better off

Oh how your post would be different if the last few words were "So help me Allah"

but the absolute most important part is quoted in the article:

“Nothing says ‘I take this obligation freely’ quite like a state law that withholds your diploma unless you swear an oath.”
 

zsdersw

Lifer
Oct 29, 2003
10,560
2
0
Students should be supporting the Constitution, If they dont like it then maybe they should go somewhere else. If we followed the Constitution we would be much better off

You missed the boat. They shouldn't be required to take any oath whatsoever.

 
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