AS Issue, MODS Pleeze LOCK

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Spankthru

Platinum Member
Nov 28, 2000
2,120
0
0
Why do people screw up? Human are relative idiots. Not really,
but I did read the application intructions before I attempted it.
Problems was the syringe wouldn't not compress. I thought it may be sealed
so I punctured it with a razor blade. It came slowly at first but due to a
caffiene assisted unsteady hand it gushed out at the last minute. Could happen to
any idiot like me. I think I have to change my name.


Brett
 

Nevin

Senior member
Oct 29, 1999
292
0
0
Richardito,

Air is also slightly capacitive, although less than AS2. Do we therefore define air as an electrical conductor? No, air is designated as an electrical insulator.

Given enough voltage however, air, like just about anything else will conduct. (Just rub your feet across the carpet and then slowly reach for a friend. Go for the earlobe if you don't like him much.) Luckily, inside a computer we are dealing with 12 volts or less, not thousands or tens of thousands of volts.

In all cases, Arctic Silver products used as intended and as per the instructions will not cause any problem.

And as I stated in another thread, since you are using this forum to council against Arctic Silver products at every opportunity, you should also mention that you are considering introducing your own line of competing thermal compounds and epoxies so that everyone will understand your complete agenda.

Nevin House
Arctic Silver LLC
 

LostHiWay

Golden Member
Apr 22, 2001
1,544
0
76
The very best way to get Artic silver off is Lighter Fluid. I tried this stuff and it made the processor look brand new.
 

Nevin

Senior member
Oct 29, 1999
292
0
0
Just don't smoke as you clean it!

(Should I add that to the instructions?)

Nevin
 

Spankthru

Platinum Member
Nov 28, 2000
2,120
0
0
I did it. Scrubbed it with my daily use toothbrush and dawn dish soap.
Most of it came off although the chip looks kinda homely now. I will still
love it though. Posted OK, running OK right now. we'll see.
Thanks again to compuwiz1 and the wonderful inventor of the Element Silver
and his silver compound, Nevin.

And lastly I would like to invoke the thought provoking lyrics of 311:

"People want Pt, they want Au, but let me tell you what you really oughta do.
Figure out a way to master silicon."
 

Technonut

Diamond Member
Mar 19, 2000
4,041
0
0


<< Just don't smoke as you clean it! (Should I add that to the instructions?) >>


LOL Nevin! I could see the rash of Arctic Silver cleaning induced fires on the front page of HardOCP now......
 

Richardito

Golden Member
Feb 24, 2001
1,411
0
0


<< Richardito,

Air is also slightly capacitive, although less than AS2. Do we therefore define air as an electrical conductor? No, air is designated as an electrical insulator.

Given enough voltage however, air, like just about anything else will conduct. (Just rub your feet across the carpet and then slowly reach for a friend. Go for the earlobe if you don't like him much.) Luckily, inside a computer we are dealing with 12 volts or less, not thousands or tens of thousands of volts.

In all cases, Arctic Silver products used as intended and as per the instructions will not cause any problem.

And as I stated in another thread, since you are using this forum to council against Arctic Silver products at every opportunity, you should also mention that you are considering introducing your own line of competing thermal compounds and epoxies so that everyone will understand your complete agenda.

Nevin House
Arctic Silver LLC
>>



As I've stated before, regular thermal transfer compounds contain ZnO for a very good reason. ZnO doesn't conducts electricity and that is one of the requirements for the electronics industry. So how do you explain the fact that some people have burned their video cards and CPU's by using AS and the AS silver adhesive? That you can't deny. So what's your explanation of what happened in those cases? Arching static electricity discharge? This would never happen if you used an epoxy adhesive with ZnO, I know this by experience.

The people need to realize that there are more products out there than AS. Education is the key to empowerment and advertisement is 99.99% of the time misinformation. Of course you are going to praise the product because your income depends on it. It is funny how you keep on mentioning about me considering a line of thermal compounds and epoxies. Do you think the people doesn't know what your agenda is?
 

MrThompson

Senior member
Jun 24, 2001
820
0
0


<< Richardito,

As I've stated before, regular thermal transfer compounds contain ZnO for a very good reason. ZnO doesn't conducts electricity and that is one of the requirements for the electronics industry. So how do you explain the fact that some people have burned their video cards and CPU's by using AS and the AS silver adhesive? That you can't deny. So what's your explanation of what happened in those cases? Arching static electricity discharge? This would never happen if you used an epoxy adhesive with ZnO, I know this by experience.

The people need to realize that there are more products out there than AS. Education is the key to empowerment and advertisement is 99.99% of the time misinformation. Of course you are going to praise the product because your income depends on it. It is funny how you keep on mentioning about me considering a line of thermal compounds and epoxies. Do you think the people doesn't know what your agenda is?
>>



It seems to me that there is a great deal of speculation and innuendo going on in this thread. Folks are worried about Artic Silver being conductive and are willing to believe rumors about this without taking the time to use a VOM to measure it. Then there are anecdotal stories about people toasting their video cards and speculating that this may have happened because of arching or static electricity discharge. And finally personal attacks on Nevin implying that he is pimping his product for personal benefit.

Go to Artic Silver?s Web Site. Read the material. If you are still concerned about Artic Silver?s conductivity, measure it with a VOM instead of parroting someone who heard something about this somewhere.

Regarding video cards, there is not enough voltage or current to cause arching or static discharge. Damage to a video card due to a sloppy application of Artic Silver Epoxy is in the form of memory leakage. Given enough epoxy between the pins, this can happen. Please note that video cards have not been ?toasted? i.e. gone up in smoke, the have simply quit functioning. Quote from Artic Silver Epoxy application instructions ?If there is a possibility that excess adhesive could contact the chip leads after squeezing out of the mating junction, electrically insulate any leads in harm's way with non-corrosive silicone or a conformal coating.? If people would just use the product as stated in the instructions, there would be no problems. You don?t take your brand new super cab diesel pickup, fill the tank with gasoline and then blame the manufacture for the consequences do you? No, because the INSTRUCTIONS tell you to fill the tank with diesel. Read the instructions and use the product accordingly and you should not have problems.

On all of the various forums I read daily, I have yet to see Nevin pimp his products. Posts have been made to correct misinformation or help with application and use. In all of these posts he has clearly identified himself as Nevin from Artic Silver LLC. This is not pimping, it?s customer support. Can you name one other manufacture that is so willing to put the time and energy into public forums to insure the end user gets value for his hard earned money?

Finally the comparisons between plain old white grease and Artic Silver seem a bit ridiculous on a forum with a focus on overclocking. Artic Silver has ten times the thermal conductivity of the white goop. It takes a little more effort to apply properly, just as it takes a little more effort to overclock a PC. It?s really not that much effort and it?s fool proof if you follow the manufacturers instructions. Isn?t that simple? Isn?t Artic Silver?s increased performance part of the very essence of overclocking?

Mr. Thompson
 

MrThompson

Senior member
Jun 24, 2001
820
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0


<< Guys,
Check out www.coldcpu.com and click on thermal grease. You may find this interesting.
>>



Regarding the info from the link to coldcpu.com: Interesting disclaimer on the Ultra Silver &quot;*While we believe our testing results to be accurate, please keep in mind that there are probably hundreds of factors (including variations in the application of the compounds, etc...), which may affect the test results.&quot; Note that Utlra Silver is &quot;Made with ultra pure (99.9%) micronized silver&quot; but they don't state what the Ultra Silver?s silver content is. Artic Silver is made with 99.9% silver but Artic Silver is honest and does not insinuate that this is the silver content of their product as this blurb about Ultra Silver does. There seems to be an integrity issue here.
 

Richardito

Golden Member
Feb 24, 2001
1,411
0
0
&quot;It seems to me that there is a great deal of speculation and innuendo going on in this thread. Folks are worried about Artic Silver being conductive and are willing to believe rumors about this without taking the time to use a VOM to measure it. Then there are anecdotal stories about people toasting their video cards and speculating that this may have happened because of arching or static electricity discharge.&quot;

---First of all it isn't speculation, AS is conductive. Testing it with a voltmeter is not the prefered test for a compound like this. It will show electrical conductivity when applied in a thin sheet and pressure is applied. Isn't this what happens when a heat sink is installed? Are you saying that the people that state that their video card got damaged are lying? Shame on you for calling people you don't know liers.


&quot;Damage to a video card due to a sloppy application of Artic Silver Epoxy is in the form of memory leakage.&quot;

---WTF?? Can someone translate this?? Can memory leak??

&quot;Given enough epoxy between the pins, this can happen.&quot;

---Epoxy resin is an insulator, the silver in AS is what causes the damage.


&quot;If people would just use the product as stated in the instructions, there would be no problems.&quot;

---The product is plain dangerous because you can fry your video card with it and that's a fact.

&quot;On all of the various forums I read daily, I have yet to see Nevin pimp his products. Posts have been made to correct misinformation or help with application and use.&quot;

---And where did you come from? You just created a user profile and this is your first post. Isn't that suspicious? Is Mr. Thompson an alias?

&quot;Artic Silver has ten times the thermal conductivity of the white goop.&quot;

---That is false, review your chemistry.

&quot;Isn?t Artic Silver?s increased performance part of the very essence of overclocking?&quot;

---That is what a lot of people (like you) want to shove down our throats...
 

MrThompson

Senior member
Jun 24, 2001
820
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0


<< &quot;It seems to me that there is a great deal of speculation and innuendo going on in this thread. Folks are worried about Artic Silver being conductive and are willing to believe rumors about this without taking the time to use a VOM to measure it. Then there are anecdotal stories about people toasting their video cards and speculating that this may have happened because of arching or static electricity discharge.&quot;

---First of all it isn't speculation, AS is conductive. Testing it with a voltmeter is not the prefered test for a compound like this. It will show electrical conductivity when applied in a thin sheet and pressure is applied. Isn't this what happens when a heat sink is installed? Are you saying that the people that state that their video card got damaged are lying? Shame on you for calling people you don't know liers.


&quot;Damage to a video card due to a sloppy application of Artic Silver Epoxy is in the form of memory leakage.&quot;

---WTF?? Can someone translate this?? Can memory leak??

&quot;Given enough epoxy between the pins, this can happen.&quot;

---Epoxy resin is an insulator, the silver in AS is what causes the damage.


&quot;If people would just use the product as stated in the instructions, there would be no problems.&quot;

---The product is plain dangerous because you can fry your video card with it and that's a fact.

&quot;On all of the various forums I read daily, I have yet to see Nevin pimp his products. Posts have been made to correct misinformation or help with application and use.&quot;

---And where did you come from? You just created a user profile and this is your first post. Isn't that suspicious? Is Mr. Thompson an alias?

&quot;Artic Silver has ten times the thermal conductivity of the white goop.&quot;

---That is false, review your chemistry.

&quot;Isn?t Artic Silver?s increased performance part of the very essence of overclocking?&quot;

---That is what a lot of people (like you) want to shove down our throats...
>>



More speculation and no empirical data. I suppose this is how &quot;chemical engineers&quot; work.

Silver has a thermal conductivity of 427.77 k/W m-1K-1. Zinc oxide, the primary component in the generic thermal compounds has a thermal conductivity of 27.196 k/W m-1K-1. The manufacturers specifications for Artic Silver state a thermal conductivity of 8.4 W/mK. The manufacturers specifications of generic white thermal greases have a thermal conductivity range of 0.4 to 0.9 W/mK. Ten times the thermal conductivity is an accurate claim for Artic Silver over generic white thermal compounds.

Conductivity of Artic Silver when compressed by a HS is not an issue. After all, the HS it?s self is conductive and in contact with the chip.

I am new here at the AnandTech Forums. Thompson is my last name. I use it here and at the Hard OCP Forums because my first name is already in use by someone else. I also post at Overclockers Forums under my first name.

Colin Thompson
 

Richardito

Golden Member
Feb 24, 2001
1,411
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&quot;More speculation and no empirical data. I suppose this is how &quot;chemical engineers&quot; work.&quot;

---You have no data either, whoever you are... You just copy the numbers from another web site. Are you jealous that I'm a ChE? What about the memory leaks?

&quot;Silver has a thermal conductivity of 427.77 k/W m-1K-1. Zinc oxide, the primary component in the generic thermal compounds has a thermal conductivity of 27.196 k/W m-1K-1.&quot;

---FYI thermal conductivity is dependent of temperature. Thermal conductivities @300 Kelvin^^ (W/m-K) are: Aluminum-273, Copper-398, Silver-424, Zinc-120. As you can see your numbers and your units are wrong. Now the copper compounds don't look so bad, do they!

&quot;Ten times the thermal conductivity is an accurate claim for Artic Silver over generic white thermal compounds.&quot;

---No, it is not as shown above. Claims are worth nothing without factual proof. Let me see ASTM tests performed in an independent lab...

&quot;Conductivity of Artic Silver when compressed by a HS is not an issue. After all, the HS it?s self is conductive and in contact with the chip.&quot;

---Well, it's conductivity is an issue. That's why it can destroy CPUs and Video Cards. With regular thermal compound the HS is electrically insulated from the chip. The HS mounted with an electrically conductive compound will zap the CPU if it encounters static electricity.

&quot;I am new here at the AnandTech Forums. Thompson is my last name.&quot;

---Nice to meet you. Next time get your facts straight before you just copy data and try to establish a scientific discussion.

^^ Data taken from Perry's Chemical Engineers' Handbook, Sixth Edition, page 3-261.
 

JCobra14

Senior member
May 14, 2001
249
0
0
I must say... ive used artic silver 2, and have had a good experience with the product so far... i splattered a little bit on the CPU due to the POC tube... and its on my video card/sound card (lol dont ask about the sound card) and have had no trouble...
 

Nevin

Senior member
Oct 29, 1999
292
0
0
Quoting zinc as having thermal conductivity of 120W/mK is a bit misleading since thermal compounds are made with zinc oxide, not zinc. Zinc oxide's thermal conductivity is much lower at approximately 27W/mK. Zinc itself is electrically conductive like silver so a compound made with zinc would also be capacitive like Arctic Silver.

Nevin House
Arctic Silver LLC
 

MrThompson

Senior member
Jun 24, 2001
820
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0


<< &quot;More speculation and no empirical data. I suppose this is how &quot;chemical engineers&quot; work.&quot;

---You have no data either, whoever you are... You just copy the numbers from another web site. Are you jealous that I'm a ChE? What about the memory leaks?

&quot;Silver has a thermal conductivity of 427.77 k/W m-1K-1. Zinc oxide, the primary component in the generic thermal compounds has a thermal conductivity of 27.196 k/W m-1K-1.&quot;

---FYI thermal conductivity is dependent of temperature. Thermal conductivities @300 Kelvin^^ (W/m-K) are: Aluminum-273, Copper-398, Silver-424, Zinc-120. As you can see your numbers and your units are wrong. Now the copper compounds don't look so bad, do they!

&quot;Ten times the thermal conductivity is an accurate claim for Artic Silver over generic white thermal compounds.&quot;

---No, it is not as shown above. Claims are worth nothing without factual proof. Let me see ASTM tests performed in an independent lab...

&quot;Conductivity of Artic Silver when compressed by a HS is not an issue. After all, the HS it?s self is conductive and in contact with the chip.&quot;

---Well, it's conductivity is an issue. That's why it can destroy CPUs and Video Cards. With regular thermal compound the HS is electrically insulated from the chip. The HS mounted with an electrically conductive compound will zap the CPU if it encounters static electricity.

&quot;I am new here at the AnandTech Forums. Thompson is my last name.&quot;

---Nice to meet you. Next time get your facts straight before you just copy data and try to establish a scientific discussion.

^^ Data taken from Perry's Chemical Engineers' Handbook, Sixth Edition, page 3-261.
>>



I don?t understand your preoccupation with who I am or your condescending attitude. So much for &quot;Nice to meet you.&quot;

The units I quoted are fine. I would think a ?chemical engineer? would understand this.

While it? true Zinc has thermal conductivity of about 120w/mK, zinc is not used in thermal compounds. Zinc oxide is used in thermal compounds. I don?t not have your Perry's Chemical Engineers' Handbook. My reference shows zinc at 111.71 W/mK or k/W /m-1K-1.

I have searched for a ASTM test for thermal greases. Can you please provide the ASTM number?


 

Richardito

Golden Member
Feb 24, 2001
1,411
0
0
&quot;I don?t understand your preoccupation with who I am or your condescending attitude. So much for &quot;Nice to meet you.&quot;&quot;

---You are the one with the attitude, I just defend myself. I also hate when people talk about things they really don't know about.

&quot;The units I quoted are fine.&quot;

---Those units doesn't make sense. Explain them to me if you can.

&quot;I would think a ?chemical engineer? would understand this.&quot;

---See, you have the attitude, not me. Why do you keep reminding me I'm a ChE?

&quot;While it? true Zinc has thermal conductivity of about 120w/mK, zinc is not used in thermal compounds. Zinc oxide is used in thermal compounds. I don?t not have your Perry's Chemical Engineers' Handbook. My reference shows zinc at 111.71 W/mK or k/W /m-1K-1.&quot;

---What is your reference? You never say what your source is... I'm using the best-known reference book there is and I even quote the page number. Now you got it right, 'W/mK' is the correct unit for thermal conducticity. What you used on your other message (and also here), 'k/W m-1K-1', is incorrect.

&quot;I have searched for a ASTM test for thermal greases. Can you please provide the ASTM number?&quot;

---I don't think there is one, but I'm sure there is a thermal conductivity test.
 

Richardito

Golden Member
Feb 24, 2001
1,411
0
0


<< Quoting zinc as having thermal conductivity of 120W/mK is a bit misleading since thermal compounds are made with zinc oxide, not zinc. Zinc oxide's thermal conductivity is much lower at approximately 27W/mK. Zinc itself is electrically conductive like silver so a compound made with zinc would also be capacitive like Arctic Silver. >>



I've never said that a ZnO based thermal compound will have better performance than AS. What is the source of your data? Regular ZnO based thermal compounds doesn't conduct electricity. The numbers also show that a thermal compound made with copper will have basically the same thermal conductivity as one made with silver. Copper is a lot cheaper too.
 

WarCon

Diamond Member
Feb 27, 2001
3,920
0
0
All I can say for people that need idiot proof thermal compounds, well they must be......um, well you guess.

For all the rest of us, we can all make mistakes when we mod or try to improve using &quot;risky&quot; methods and blow up video cards or processors or anything in the system, although most of the video cards I have seen were repairable simply by removing the capacitive link (dried epoxy with silver in it) between data channels that is causing &quot;memory leak&quot; or more appropriately termed data corruption. Although I consider using Arctic Silver pretty risk free once you clue in to &quot;reading the instructions&quot;. I am sure the honest people would tell you the truth, that the mistake was made because &quot;like me&quot; they get in a hurry and fail to follow common sense instructions and heed warnings made by the manufacturer in the proper and right use for the product.
 

MrThompson

Senior member
Jun 24, 2001
820
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0


<< &quot;I don?t understand your preoccupation with who I am or your condescending attitude. So much for &quot;Nice to meet you.&quot;&quot;

---You are the one with the attitude, I just defend myself. I also hate when people talk about things they really don't know about.

&quot;The units I quoted are fine.&quot;

---Those units doesn't make sense. Explain them to me if you can.

&quot;I would think a ?chemical engineer? would understand this.&quot;

---See, you have the attitude, not me. Why do you keep reminding me I'm a ChE?

&quot;While it? true Zinc has thermal conductivity of about 120w/mK, zinc is not used in thermal compounds. Zinc oxide is used in thermal compounds. I don?t not have your Perry's Chemical Engineers' Handbook. My reference shows zinc at 111.71 W/mK or k/W /m-1K-1.&quot;

---What is your reference? You never say what your source is... I'm using the best-known reference book there is and I even quote the page number. Now you got it right, 'W/mK' is the correct unit for thermal conducticity. What you used on your other message (and also here), 'k/W m-1K-1', is incorrect.

&quot;I have searched for a ASTM test for thermal greases. Can you please provide the ASTM number?&quot;

---I don't think there is one, but I'm sure there is a thermal conductivity test.
>>



The units are fine. The difference is in the placement of the decimal point. Read your post and the quote you made of my post again. The ?1 should be in superscript but I do not know how to do this using this boards code. The numbers both you and Nevin quoted are a different than mine by a few units but the proportions from one material to the other remain the same. They tell the same story. Silver has well over 10 times the thermal conductivity of zinc oxide.

I am not worried about defending myself. I know who I am, what my background is and my level of technical expertise. I am only interested in the facts. Nor am I concerned about whether your are a chemical engineer or not, although based on your posts in this thread there are some doubts in my mind about your credentials. Note that I did not put ?Chemical Engineer? in my signature and then make a lot of claims based on hearsay rather than facts. Asking for an ASTM test when you don?t think there is one is a good example. Why the games? What is your agenda? What are you afraid of?
 

MrThompson

Senior member
Jun 24, 2001
820
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0
Regarding copper thermal compounds, I have tested only one. It was worse than Radio Shack grease by 2C.
 

Richardito

Golden Member
Feb 24, 2001
1,411
0
0
&quot;The units are fine.&quot;

---It seems that you cannot explain the units... For the last time, no they are not correct.

&quot;The difference is in the placement of the decimal point.&quot;

---Again, you are showing your ignorance. You say the difference is a decimal point, but you used the two units as if they were interchangable (the same absolute value). 'k/W m-1K-1' is not a valid unit and makes no sense. Do you even know what this stands for? I doubt it.

&quot;I am not worried about defending myself. I know who I am, what my background is and my level of technical expertise. I am only interested in the facts. Nor am I concerned about whether your are a chemical engineer or not, although based on your posts in this thread there are some doubts in my mind about your credentials.&quot;

---Why are you so focused on me being a ChE? I've never given information on my industrial experinece. If we add up the time you spend in the subject it seems you are concerned that I'm a ChE. I'm not at all concerned about your 'mind', grow up and get over it.

&quot;Note that I did not put ?Chemical Engineer? in my signature&quot;

---And I do because I am one, and your point is?

&quot;and then make a lot of claims based on hearsay rather than facts. Asking for an ASTM test when you don?t think there is one is a good example. Why the games? What is your agenda? What are you afraid of?&quot;

---You are reapeating what I stated to you and/or Nevin on other ocassions. Don't you realize how transparent you are? You are either an alias of Nevin or a really good friend of his. You are the one making claims without references. I never said there was an ASTM exactly for thermal compounds, you added that. I only wrote 'Let me see ASTM tests performed in an independent lab'. But I do know there's one for thermal conductivity. And this is what we are interested in, is it not? Couldn't you figure that one out? There aren't ASTM methods for products (like thermal compounds). ASTM methods are in place to test specific properties only (ike thermal conductivity, viscosity, etc.). It is obvious your level of 'knowledge' or 'expertise' doesn't amount to much.

Unless you can reference your numbers/claims and explain your units stop wasting our time with your nonsense.

***&quot;It isn't worth fighting a battle of wits with an unarmed man...&quot;***
 

Carlton

Member
Jun 24, 2001
69
0
0
So what copper compound did you test? Did you base your data on one test? What was your testing method?
 

MrThompson

Senior member
Jun 24, 2001
820
0
0
Vantech's Iced Copper. Nothing special for testing techniques. My tests were initially with a KT7-R and a PEP66. I tried the compounds several times and then repeated the tests with the FOP-32 I now use on my bench. Given the socket thermistors known compression, I would suspect the actual temperature differences were larger than I observed.

My temps dropped 4C over the Radio Shack goop when I finally tried Artic Silver with the FOP-32 and another 2C after lapping the HSF. The big kicker was doing the final 2000 grit lap on the and Fop-32 with Artic Silver as the lubricant. Another 2C temp drop.

All of my heat sinks and water blocks get lapped with 2000 grit and Artic Silver as the final lube. I have even lapped a few Birds this way with good results.
 

MrThompson

Senior member
Jun 24, 2001
820
0
0


<< &quot;The units are fine.&quot;

---It seems that you cannot explain the units... For the last time, no they are not correct.

&quot;The difference is in the placement of the decimal point.&quot;

---Again, you are showing your ignorance. You say the difference is a decimal point, but you used the two units as if they were interchangable (the same absolute value). 'k/W m-1K-1' is not a valid unit and makes no sense. Do you even know what this stands for? I doubt it.

&quot;I am not worried about defending myself. I know who I am, what my background is and my level of technical expertise. I am only interested in the facts. Nor am I concerned about whether your are a chemical engineer or not, although based on your posts in this thread there are some doubts in my mind about your credentials.&quot;

---Why are you so focused on me being a ChE? I've never given information on my industrial experinece. If we add up the time you spend in the subject it seems you are concerned that I'm a ChE. I'm not at all concerned about your 'mind', grow up and get over it.

&quot;Note that I did not put ?Chemical Engineer? in my signature&quot;

---And I do because I am one, and your point is?

&quot;and then make a lot of claims based on hearsay rather than facts. Asking for an ASTM test when you don?t think there is one is a good example. Why the games? What is your agenda? What are you afraid of?&quot;

---You are reapeating what I stated to you and/or Nevin on other ocassions. Don't you realize how transparent you are? You are either an alias of Nevin or a really good friend of his. You are the one making claims without references. I never said there was an ASTM exactly for thermal compounds, you added that. I only wrote 'Let me see ASTM tests performed in an independent lab'. But I do know there's one for thermal conductivity. And this is what we are interested in, is it not? Couldn't you figure that one out? There aren't ASTM methods for products (like thermal compounds). ASTM methods are in place to test specific properties only (ike thermal conductivity, viscosity, etc.). It is obvious your level of 'knowledge' or 'expertise' doesn't amount to much.

Unless you can reference your numbers/claims and explain your units stop wasting our time with your nonsense.

***&quot;It isn't worth fighting a battle of wits with an unarmed man...&quot;***
>>



Perhaps the reason it seems that Nevin and I may have similar ideas is that we may know a bit more about what is really going on than you care to admit. Attacking a product and claming it?s dangerous without adding the disclaimer that it?s when people don?t follow instructions is irresponsible and or reeks of a personal agenda ?---The product is plain dangerous because you can fry your video card with it and that's a fact.? Not only is this irresponsible it borders on a being a libelous statement.

Forgive me for my typing skills, kW/ m-1K-1 is K(1000) watts divided by (meters * 10 to the -1 power) * (degrees Kelvin * 10 to the -1 power) is off by a factor of 10 compared to W/mK. It?s been 20 years since I had to deal with units at this level. At first glance they appeared correct. I should have quoted them as W/mK as the obviously are. I am not a practicing engineer. It has been over 20 years since I went to school to become one and upon leaving school, I pursued a more financially rewarding career in sales, management and manufacturing. Unit booboos aside, this does not change the facts. The thermal conductivity numbers I quoted are still within a few insignificant points of those that both you and Nevin quoted. The proportions and conclusions are still the same. Silver has more than 10 times the thermal conductivity of zinc oxide. Look it up in your Perry's Chemical Engineers' Handbook and post the numbers.

Also please note that I have not tried to twist the facts by suggesting standardized tests that don?t exist be run to resolve the question at hand.


 
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