ASRock Conroe865PE

[CrispySilicon]

Originally posted by: tcsenter

Originally posted by: CrispySilicon
So did anyone ever pick one of these up and test it?

ASRock 775Dual-VSTA is superior in every respect, except for max. memory support (2GB v. 4GB) but you get PCI Express in return.

Unfortunately no, it is not better in every respect I know because I'm using one right now. And it freezes quite often because it's not compatible with my wireless card just like several other VIA chipsets (others have been having the same problem, freezing that goes away when wireless pci card is replaced with usb). Yay for VIA (can't switch adapters, using a 400mW card to broadcast to whole building.)

 

[Xvys]

According to the Annandtech review the 775i65g was superior to the Dual-Vsta in almost every benchmark (even with their ram running at ddr355). The Conroe865PE would perform almost identically to the 775i65g, with the same Intel chipset and bios but with a 4 ram dimms and 5 pci slots. The Dual-Vsta adds PCI-E, DDR2 and Raid support, but if you were going to buy DDR2/PCIE is that the board you would want for your CD2? The 775i65g is rock-solid @ 300FSB and is not plagued by many of the compatibility and freezing issues witnessed with the Via Dual-Vsta.

 

[muddocktor]

I'm presently testing the 775i65G right now with an E6300 I had sitting around, using this as an upgrade to an older P4 system as a dedicated folding rig. So far it's overall a winner for a $50 board but it's no overclocking champion for sure. Presently my max stable overclock with it is in the 290 fsb region, which shouldn't be limited by either the lack of vcore adjustments or the lack of decently high vdimm adjustments. I've noticed by monitoring with both Speedfan and CPU-Z that the vcore seems to be very variable; maybe this is due to poor regulation on Asrock's part or maybe it's just the apps not reading correctly. Speedfan shows a vcore variation from 1.275 to 1.32 volts, which seems excessive. I also had problems trying to run my OCZ EL Plat rev 2 PC3200 ram at 2-2-2-5 timings and had to swap it out with another folding rig that had some Plat Elite 4800's that were stable at the low vdimm of this board at 2-2-2-5 timings. I did see quite a difference in folding points/day with tightening up the ram timings to 2-2-2-5 from 2-3-3-6 though. I might try to paint a higher vcore on the proc and see if that will help with overclocking on this board. But I think the main proble with this board and present Conroe processors is the stock 266 fsb the Conroes run on. The old i865G chipset was only designed for 200 fsb operation originally and I think it's showing it's age as it gets close to 300 fsb. But this board would make a good platform for the upcoming e4300 Allendales that Intel will be selling after the first of the year. I also plan to do a little experimenting and see if there is any apps that work with this board to change divisors and timings in Windows.

 

[tcsenter]

Unfortunately no, it is not better in every respect I know because I'm using one right now.

I've encountered WLAN cards that did not work in motherboards with VIA VT8237 Southbridge, but found other WLAN cards that worked perfectly. A driver update for the WLAN card solved the problem in a couple instances, or using a different PCI slot, but driver updates for some WLAN cards are difficult to come by. Atheros, Broadcom, and Texas Instruments don't release driver updates to the public, and most peripheral companies fail to update their drivers beyond the 'initial release' version. I've had to find newer drivers from a completely different OEM or brand.

e.g. I'm using Broadcom WLAN drivers released by Hewlett Packard with a WLAN PCI card branded by US Robotics. The HP driver is more than one year newer than the 'latest' available from US Robotics. Using the newer HP drivers solved major problems I encountered in a motherboard with VT8237 Southbridge (crashing and connectivity issues). When I informed US Robotics tech support about my experience, they completely ignored that the newer drivers (from HP) were working flawlessly and blamed the problem on VIA's chipset.

According to the Annandtech review the 775i65g was superior to the Dual-Vsta in almost every benchmark (even with their ram running at ddr355).

By less than 5% (typically 2 ~ 3 fps max difference), which is discernable only with benchmarks and not meaningful to real world use, as the Anandtech review points out at least once.

The PT880 has always scored significantly less than Intel 865 and 875 in synthetic memory bandwidth tests, but this translates into a 5% real world penalty against the fastest PAT-enabled Intel 865PE and 875P enthusiast motherboards on the market (as I've proven a few times in older discussions). In addition, the review stated:

"Our results showed that while there were differences in memory performance between each chipset and speed setting, it mattered little in the overall performance of our system. This was mainly due to our selection of mid-range components that likely would be used when upgrading to our motherboard and processor choice."


In addition, Conroe865PE uses an even more dated Southbridge than 775Dual-VSTA's VT8237A and connects to the Northbridge through 266MB/sec interconnect compared to VIA's 1GB/sec Ultra V-Link. Conroe865PE uses AC97 audio, 775Dual-VSTA has HD audio, to name some of the numerous advantages.

But technically I was incorrect - ASRock 775Dual-VSTA is not superior in every respect. Other than having superior specifications and features across the board, with the lone exception of max. memory support, the 775Dual-VSTA does benchmark ever-so-slightly less than Conroe865PE in some benchmarks (which nobody cares about except for the benchmark zealots).

The Dual-Vsta adds PCI-E, DDR2 and Raid support, but if you were going to buy DDR2/PCIE is that the board you would want for your CD2?

The market for 775Dual-VSTA is to retain AGP and DDR, with DDR2 and PCI-E as a later upgrade path option, not to purchase for DDR2 and PCI-E out of the gate.

But since you raise the question, I don't see why one couldn't buy the 775Dual-VSTA with PCI-E and DDR2 in mind, since 775Dual-VSTA performs fairly well against chipsets designed for PCI-E x16, SATA-300, and DDR2 even when 775Dual-VSTA is hindered by x4 PCI-E and SATA-150:


ASrock 775Dual-VSTA Review @ OCWorkbench

Application Performance: 775Dual-VSTA, Intel 945G/P, 965P, 975X, NV570

Gaming Performance: 775Dual-VSTA, Intel 945G/P, 965P, 975X, NV570

 

[CrispySilicon]

I've tried various atheros drivers going all the way back to 4.1.1.6 and still has issues. No luck unfortunately. For now I'm using the ethernet to bridge to a linux running AP, but it doesn't have near the range the pci card has, but it's better then freezing. I'd actually like to keep the VSTA if possible, just for the ALC888.

 

[tcsenter]

Open a support ticket with both ASRock and the manufacturer of your WLAN card.

 

[Xvys]

muddocktor wrote:
I've noticed by monitoring with both Speedfan and CPU-Z that the vcore seems to be very variable; maybe this is due to poor regulation on Asrock's part or maybe it's just the apps not reading correctly. Speedfan shows a vcore variation from 1.275 to 1.32 volts, which seems excessive.

yep, I've noticed that the fluctuation of vcore also, I thought it perhaps was the Speedstep throtteling, as mine goes down to 1.14 then up to 1.32. I tried Cas 2 ram timing and it would not boot, just stopped working. Turned out my fancy Cas 2.5 Samsung ram stopped working, burned out I guess, but my other Cas 3 stick was ok and runs fine at the default Cas 2.5 setting. My system overclocked to the max 300FSB on the first try and has not had a hiccup since (other than my Cas 2 foray). I would be interested in reading more about your testing (I don't think many people know about this board) and apps that could aid in o/c. I am thrilled with my new system that is 50% faster than my previous P800SE/2.4 system, is way quieter and was very cost effective. Newegg has this 775i65G board for $42 now and it would be a killer with the E4300/800FSB cpu.

 

[VirtualLarry]

So, anyone order the Conroe865PE board from .au yet?

I'm thinking that I just might have to do that. Got my four 1GB DDR DIMMs and an ATI X850 Pro waiting for it.

As for the 775-DualVSTA, I think that an Intel chipset is greater than a Via chipset anyday. The 865 is like the new 440BX IMHO.

 

[Nekoashide]

Old thread i know. If anyone is still interested i have one backordered from Ozdirect, Seems as though they are ordering it on an as needed basis. My ship date is Nov 29 and by airmail i will hopefully have it early next month.

 

[Nekoashide]

Just an update for those wondering.

I ordered it Nov 15 The board was shipped Nov 26 and i recieved it Dec 6. Via Airmail

The motherboard box arrived double wrapped in black plastic bubblewrap and was in pretty good condition. Although the motherboard box looked a little crushed on one end and kinda caved on the top. Nothing was damaged of course.

My old motherboard was a DFI 865PE-TAG and amazingly windows started normally aside from the sound which needed drivers. Network drivers were already on my system and reinstalled. The USB drivers were detected and installed as well.

My only issue is that since I'm using cheap ram it only runs CAS 3 at 200fsb. Upon first run the bios will not allow 3 CAS with a Core 2 installed and the bios forces 2.5 which my RAM will not run at. I had to take all but one stick out to get the system to post and now i'm running 180 fsb for the RAM and it's stable.

This is not what i had expected. Even in the manual it "Recomends" Cas 2.5 RAM when running a core 2 at 1066. But makes no mention of a requirment. I have emailed ASrock support to see if they might have a beta bios. But most likely somone will have to mod them. Other than that the board runs great.

This is my invoice for anyone wondering. It's in AUD but with the exchange rate at the time my order was 117.16 USD

Sub-Total: $84.69AUD
AusPOST International Parcel Post - AIR 10 days Estimated Delivery Time*1 boxes 1.2kg(s) (incl $25 handling $12 insurance) ): $49.27AUD
Low Order Fee of $10.00 applicable to all orders under $100.00: $9.09AUD
Payment Type Surcharge: $6.19AUD
Total: $149.24AUD

 

[eplebnista]

Originally posted by: Nekoashide
Just an update for those wondering.

I ordered it Nov 15 The board was shipped Nov 26 and i recieved it Dec 6. Via Airmail

The motherboard box arrived double wrapped in black plastic bubblewrap and was in pretty good condition. Although the motherboard box looked a little crushed on one end and kinda caved on the top. Nothing was damaged of course.

My old motherboard was a DFI 865PE-TAG and amazingly windows started normally aside from the sound which needed drivers. Network drivers were already on my system and reinstalled. The USB drivers were detected and installed as well.

My only issue is that since I'm using cheap ram it only runs CAS 3 at 200fsb. Upon first run the bios will not allow 3 CAS with a Core 2 installed and the bios forces 2.5 which my RAM will not run at. I had to take all but one stick out to get the system to post and now i'm running 180 fsb for the RAM and it's stable.

This is not what i had expected. Even in the manual it "Recomends" Cas 2.5 RAM when running a core 2 at 1066. But makes no mention of a requirment. I have emailed ASrock support to see if they might have a beta bios. But most likely somone will have to mod them. Other than that the board runs great.

This is my invoice for anyone wondering. It's in AUD but with the exchange rate at the time my order was 117.16 USD

Sub-Total: $84.69AUD
AusPOST International Parcel Post - AIR 10 days Estimated Delivery Time*1 boxes 1.2kg(s) (incl $25 handling $12 insurance) ): $49.27AUD
Low Order Fee of $10.00 applicable to all orders under $100.00: $9.09AUD
Payment Type Surcharge: $6.19AUD
Total: $149.24AUD

:thumbsup: Thanks for the info! :beer:

 

[dlxmax]

I'm considering this board as well, and in my research have found some links to modified bioses that allow 1:1 and 5:4 memory timings:

1:1 mod bios: http://www.pc-treiber.net/datei_download_546.html
5:4 mod bios: http://www.pc-treiber.net/datei_download_545.html

These bioses were released on page 2 of this thread: http://forums.vr-zone.com/showthread.php?t=104679

 

[VirtualLarry]

Gah, really bad news! TechBuy is showing "Discontinued", and OZDirect is showing "product not found", using the links off of here.

And yet, I still don't have one! Anyone else that wants to sell their board, at a decent profit, please get in touch with me. Or anyone from .au that wants to help me obtain one, since very few of those shops direct-ships to USA.

I NEED this board. Please God, someone help me.

(Why oh why did these board become discontinued, just when the E4300 appears. Such a killer combination for a cheap OC w/AGP and DDR.)

 

[vailr]

There are several other Intel socket775/865G chipset boards:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductLi...8+107171070&Submit=ENE&SubCategory=280
Only one 865 non-G board listed on Newegg:
Foxconn 865PE7MC-S LGA 775 Intel 865PE Micro ATX Intel Motherboard
OOS @ Newegg:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16813186065
Every board listed uses the ICH5 (non-Raid) South Bridge.
Of these boards, only one is specifically stated to support C2Duo CPU's:
ASUS P5PE-VM LGA 775 Intel 865G Micro ATX Intel Motherboard
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16813131029

 

[tcsenter]

Just grab a 775Dual-VSTA. You might like it!

 

[VirtualLarry]

I've recently read of a number of problems with the 775Dual-VSTA, notably issues with the video shutting off when booting Vista, with an AGP card. That disturbs me, otherwise I was considering it. (Rather, the newer revision, the 4Core-VSTA, with the PT880Ultra, not the Pro.) But I've lived the last three years with the lackluster performance and esoteric compatibility issues of a Via chipset (the KT400/8235), and I really don't want to go through that mess again. Plus, I really want Win98se support for the chipset, and the 865 would give me that, plus the rock-solid compatibility and performance than an Intel chipset provides.

I have a multi-boot with Win98se, W2K, and XP, and at this juncture, I'm wondering if I should strive for "native" compatibilty, or to move on to some non-Win9x-compatible hardware, and run my older installs under VM software. The Conroe865PE would have been absolutely ideal in all respects for what I'm looking for. I never thought that it's lifespan would be so short, or that it wouldn't have even been released over here. ASRock does some really cool things technically with their motherboards, but their marketing is F-ed up. It's impossible to find the 939Dual-VSTA mobo too, although I suspect foul play by Nvidia ever since they absorbed ULi. Perhaps a chipset shortage in both cases is what killed two of the most unique and interesting mobos in existance.

The reason I don't want any of the newer mobos for a Conroe, is because of so many changes to the chipset standard - the JMicron add-on PATA controller chipset apparently is horrible (look up issues with it an Linux for examples), and dropping standard ports and whatnot doesn't appeal to me.

Maybe I'll just run my Athlon XP2000+ / KT400 board for ever and ever.

 

[vailr]

See my previous post for other boards using the same 865 chipset.
This German site seems willing to ship to a U.S. address:
http://www.boah-krass.de/hardware/mainb...leron/conroe865pe-motherboard-atx.html

 

[tcsenter]

The 775Dual-VSTA is merely a major PCB revision of the 775Dual-880Pro and the latter supports Win9X, the VSTA model should support 9X (it supports W2K). The PT880 chipset is a few years old. 98SE driver support for PT880 and VT8237 is available from VIA. The Realtek HD audio isn't supported under W9X, easily enough solved with an inexpensive PCI sound card (e.g. CMI8768).

Has anyone tried installing 98SE on 775Dual-VSTA?

VirtualLarry,

Give the 775Dual-VSTA a shot and if you don't like it, I'll buy it from you for what you paid for it (Newegg currently has it for $65 shipped). At worst you'll lose six or seven bucks.

 

[VirtualLarry]

Well, I'm not entirely sure about the Win9x support, the newest Hyperion Pro drivers only list W2K/XP. Hopefully the AGP driver from the older 4-in-1s will work on the 775Dual. It looks like it's kind of iffy on the overclocking too, see http://forums.anandtech.com/messageview...atid=29&threadid=1971478&enterthread=y . You have to hard-mod your CPU in order to get it to OC in this board, and the board doesn't offer Vcore adjustments. So it's doable, just a bit of work. I appreciate the glowing endorsement, Tcsenter, but I'm still going to wait for the 4CoreDual board, if I end up picking that one up, just to ensure official 1066 FSB support. (Which will be useless in six months, once Intel releases CPUs with 1333 FSBs, so perhaps it's better to hold off still? Does Via have a 1333FSB-capable chipset in the works?)

Vailr, if you're willing to order that board (and able to speak german, which I am not), I'll pay you a reasonable bounty on top of your costs if you can obtain that board for me.

Edit: I just double-checked, and it seems that Hyperion Pro driver 5.11A supports Win98se! Good news. Does anyone know if their SATA drivers fix the 48-bit LBA issues, since Win9x never had an official MS patch for 48-bit LBA support? Looks like I might be getting this board after all.
Edit: Via PATA/SATA driver: "Notes on legacy operating systems: This driver does not supported VIA SATA controllers for Windows NT4.0, Windows 98SE" , "Users with legacy operating systems (Windows NT4.0, Windows 98SE, Windows ME ) need to set their SATA controller to RAID mode in their BIOS and then use VIA V-RAID driver package." So it looks like no native SATA support in Win9se, but some workaround using their RAID driver. Hopefully that doesn't mean that I have to setup a RAID array just to use SATA.

Edit: Just remembered about http://www.theinquirer.net/default.aspx?article=24910 , Via 8237 SATA controllers incompatible with SATA-II HDs. I may just use a PCI SATA controller to deal with both issues, as I already have one.

 

[VirtualLarry]

http://www.boah-krass.de/test/shopping_cart.php
------------------------------^^^
Why does that site have "test" in the URL? Is it a shopping-cart demo site or something? It makes me wonder.

 

[tcsenter]

So it looks like no native SATA support in Win9se, but some workaround using their RAID driver. Hopefully that doesn't mean that I have to setup a RAID array just to use SATA.

No RAID array is necessary to run or install Win9x, the SATA controller need only be set to RAID mode for the SATA driver from the V-RAID package to support operating under Win9x.

The VIA AGP driver for Win98_ME has actually been updated more often than the AGP driver for XP/2000, the most recent being V4.9.0.3460 dated 06/29/2006, and is included in the Hyperion package.

 

[vailr]

Originally posted by: VirtualLarry
I'm still going to wait for the 4CoreDual board, if I end up picking that one up, just to ensure official 1066 FSB support. (Which will be useless in six months, once Intel releases CPUs with 1333 FSBs, so perhaps it's better to hold off still? Does Via have a 1333FSB-capable chipset in the works?)

See "New Intel Chipsets from VIA Unveiled"
http://www.dailytech.com/article.aspx?newsid=6064

 

[vailr]

I received a reply from the German ASRock re-seller: "boah-krass.de".
E-mail address: support@boah-krass.de
They do have the board in stock. Price is 58.49 ? + 35? postage; 93.49 ? total.
The exchange rate calculator on http://www.x-rates.com/calculator.html#
shows as: 1.30240. Which, in U.S. dollars = $121.76.
93.49 x 1.30240 = 121.76

Use Babelfish translator:
http://babelfish.altavista.digital.com/translate.dyn

copy of their email reply:
Dear customer.
This main board is still for selling. (vorhanden)
The price is:58.49 ?
The shipping to usa I think it is possible. It coat: 35?
When you have intress please register youself in our shop and order it.
Please choose " against prepayment" for the payment.
If You have any questions else, so please contact us.
Thanks.
ZKV-Marketing GmbH

 

[VirtualLarry]

I have two Conroe865PE boards on order thanks to vailr, but I thought that I would mention another board that I found, that is an 865G and supports Core2Duo cpus. It's a Gigabyte 8I865GME-775-RH, Rev 2.0. It's a micro-ATX, but has an AGP slot, 3 PCI slots, 2 SATA1.5, and only 2 DIMM slots (not 4), plus optional onboard 32MB graphics. Found it at my local CompUSA during their closing clearance sale, originally marked $79.99. Note that prior to rev 2.0, there is no Core2Duo support.

Apparently this is a fairly new board, as the first and only BIOS release is dated 2006/12/27. No CPU support for quad-core, nor Pentium Extreme Edition CPUs.

FSB speed, according to the BIOS section of the manual, goes up to 355Mhz. Combined with an E4400 with a 10x multi, that would equate to 3.55Ghz at maximum. DRAM and AGP/PCI speeds are independent. Curiously, there appeared to be no DRAM settings (CAS latency, etc.), and therefore I assume it only runs using "SPD AUTO". I have no idea if it does the same thing that the Asrock board does - when running a 1066FSB CPU, it sets CAS latency to 2.5.

mainboard link
newegg link

Edit: according to some NewEgg reviews, it offers no overclocking/no FSB adjustements, but there is clearly an FSB setting in the BIOS section of the manual. (?)

Edit: Another 865G with Core2Duo support is the ASUS P5PE-VM, complete with gigabit LAN.
newegg link

 

[tcsenter]

ASRock 4CoreDual-VSTA is in stock @ the Egg:

http://www.newegg.com/product/product.asp?Item=N82E16813157107

VirtualLarry,

My offer is amended to 4CoreDual-VSTA and still stands. Try out the 4CoreDual-VSTA and if you don't like it, I'll buy it from you for $66.13 (current price with shipping). I'll even pay your sales tax if applicable to your location, since Newegg would charge me sales tax based on my CA residence. At worst, you'll lose six or seven bucks (the cost of shipping to me).