Originally posted by: darkhorror
All that really matters for AMD on Phenom is how much they will be able to clock it. As it's not going to be much better if any better clock for clock than what intel will have. If they max out at 3ghz again they are going to be in trouble.
Originally posted by: Arkaign
Originally posted by: Pederv
Originally posted by: keysplayr2003
Originally posted by: Pederv
I'll probably get a Phenom, sometime next year or so.
Am I a fanboi? I don't consider myself one.
I do have name brands that I usually purchase, whether it's my Darigold milk, my Ford car or my AMD CPU. Do I stop buying Darigold because I get a bad gallon? No I just buy another gallon of milk.
I don't think I've ever bought a CPU that was past it's expiration date.
Good one Keys.
My wife didn't look at the expiration date on products until she saw me making a point to do so. As a result, the bad gallons are few and far between.
Just as my auto maker of choice went from AMC to Ford, when AMC went out of buisiness. My CPU manufacturer of choice will change if AMD goes out of buisiness, no biggie. Until that happens the CPU I'll purchase is what AMD has that I can afford, when I can afford it. It's not like AMD is going to charge me twice the price for the same performance as Intel would. I just won't have the fastest system on the planet, again no biggie.
That goes beyond idiotic, to purchase based on brand in the computer world. It would have meant that you were using the crap K5 when the Pentium was kicking it's butt. Or using a PMMX when K6-2 was walking all over it. Or a K6-3 when The Celeron 300a@450 made it look like a 386, or perhaps worse.
The *only* logical choice is to pick the best deal at the time that you buy. Buying by brand just makes you a brainless lemming, no offense intended.
Originally posted by: keysplayr2003
Well, I suppose what is really important is that AMD is showing signs of actual activity. A product was released. They are doing something. And the product is not half bad. 15% better than K8 clock for clock isn't bad at all. Consider how good the K8 was/is. Don't look at Intel for the moment. A 15+/- improvement over a previous gen is quite good.
And you can't really go by P4 to C2D because P4 was in big trouble compared to K8's. For all the hardships AMD is going through right now, I have to give them props for even getting that 15%. I was anticipating a flop to be honest. But this wasn't a flop, even though it's not spectacular either.
Originally posted by: Arkaign
That goes beyond idiotic, to purchase based on brand in the computer world.....
Originally posted by: Idontcare
Originally posted by: darkhorror
All that really matters for AMD on Phenom is how much they will be able to clock it. As it's not going to be much better if any better clock for clock than what intel will have. If they max out at 3ghz again they are going to be in trouble.
Well that has always been true, even for their current desktop offerings...the K8.
The heat from 90nm Prescotts got Intel's 90nm process labeled "broken".
When will the disasterously low clock speeds generated by AMD's 65nm process get it labeled as "broken"?
Originally posted by: fishmonger12
Someone may have already said this, but on the desktop side, few people really NEED the power of a core 2 duo cpu. I would say gamers and other enthusiasts are the only ones that actually take advantage of a chip like that, and they make up what, like 10% of the market? I just bought my girlfriend a laptop with a 1.9 ghz turion x2 and 1 gig of ram, and it plows right through vista, multitasking, movies, etc. Which is what most of the market uses a pc for.
So I don't think this as big of a disappointment as people paint it to be, nor will it have a large effect on the business side of amd in the desktop space. It will matter in the server space, and guess what, it's actually competitive there.
Originally posted by: TekDemon
you poor thing. you actually think modern consumerist culture cares about what's needed. Most Americans don't need a full size SUV with a 5.8liter v8, but that doesn't stop people from buying it.
ever read a car review where they recommended an otherwise comparable car with less power?
Seriously, the whole reason to even buy a new pc is to have more than enough power so it won't be obsolete for a while. So overkill is the name of the game.
And if overkilling it with a quad core intel is only an extra 80 bucks...
Originally posted by: TekDemon
Originally posted by: fishmonger12
Someone may have already said this, but on the desktop side, few people really NEED the power of a core 2 duo cpu. I would say gamers and other enthusiasts are the only ones that actually take advantage of a chip like that, and they make up what, like 10% of the market? I just bought my girlfriend a laptop with a 1.9 ghz turion x2 and 1 gig of ram, and it plows right through vista, multitasking, movies, etc. Which is what most of the market uses a pc for.
So I don't think this as big of a disappointment as people paint it to be, nor will it have a large effect on the business side of amd in the desktop space. It will matter in the server space, and guess what, it's actually competitive there.
you poor thing. you actually think modern consumerist culture cares about what's needed. Most Americans don't need a full size SUV with a 5.8liter v8, but that doesn't stop people from buying it.
ever read a car review where they recommended an otherwise comparable car with less power?
Seriously, the whole reason to even buy a new pc is to have more than enough power so it won't be obsolete for a while. So overkill is the name of the game.
And if overkilling it with a quad core intel is only an extra 80 bucks...
Originally posted by: Pederv
Originally posted by: Arkaign
Originally posted by: Pederv
Originally posted by: keysplayr2003
Originally posted by: Pederv
I'll probably get a Phenom, sometime next year or so.
Am I a fanboi? I don't consider myself one.
I do have name brands that I usually purchase, whether it's my Darigold milk, my Ford car or my AMD CPU. Do I stop buying Darigold because I get a bad gallon? No I just buy another gallon of milk.
I don't think I've ever bought a CPU that was past it's expiration date.
Good one Keys.
My wife didn't look at the expiration date on products until she saw me making a point to do so. As a result, the bad gallons are few and far between.
Just as my auto maker of choice went from AMC to Ford, when AMC went out of buisiness. My CPU manufacturer of choice will change if AMD goes out of buisiness, no biggie. Until that happens the CPU I'll purchase is what AMD has that I can afford, when I can afford it. It's not like AMD is going to charge me twice the price for the same performance as Intel would. I just won't have the fastest system on the planet, again no biggie.
That goes beyond idiotic, to purchase based on brand in the computer world. It would have meant that you were using the crap K5 when the Pentium was kicking it's butt. Or using a PMMX when K6-2 was walking all over it. Or a K6-3 when The Celeron 300a@450 made it look like a 386, or perhaps worse.
The *only* logical choice is to pick the best deal at the time that you buy. Buying by brand just makes you a brainless lemming, no offense intended.
Arkaign:
Purchasing by brand isn't any different in the computer world than it is in the clothing world or the automotive world or the food world. Sometimes you get the quality that you're looking for, sometimes all you get is a pretty package.
Yes I did have a K5-166, yes I did have a K6-3-450 because at the time I bought them they were the best bang for the buck, without overclocking. My old systems are spread throughout my family, so they have to last. The K6-3-450 came back to me after I upgraded my mom to a 2000XP system. The K6-3-450 runs Win2K and I use it for software that has a 30 trial period. I just reimage the system when the trial period expires.
Overclocking to me is something to play with, not a way of life. So I don't base my CPU purchases on how far it will overclock, just as I don't choose my car by how fast it will go when floored.
Originally posted by: Pederv
Originally posted by: Arkaign
Originally posted by: Pederv
Originally posted by: keysplayr2003
Originally posted by: Pederv
I'll probably get a Phenom, sometime next year or so.
Am I a fanboi? I don't consider myself one.
I do have name brands that I usually purchase, whether it's my Darigold milk, my Ford car or my AMD CPU. Do I stop buying Darigold because I get a bad gallon? No I just buy another gallon of milk.
I don't think I've ever bought a CPU that was past it's expiration date.
Good one Keys.
My wife didn't look at the expiration date on products until she saw me making a point to do so. As a result, the bad gallons are few and far between.
Just as my auto maker of choice went from AMC to Ford, when AMC went out of buisiness. My CPU manufacturer of choice will change if AMD goes out of buisiness, no biggie. Until that happens the CPU I'll purchase is what AMD has that I can afford, when I can afford it. It's not like AMD is going to charge me twice the price for the same performance as Intel would. I just won't have the fastest system on the planet, again no biggie.
That goes beyond idiotic, to purchase based on brand in the computer world. It would have meant that you were using the crap K5 when the Pentium was kicking it's butt. Or using a PMMX when K6-2 was walking all over it. Or a K6-3 when The Celeron 300a@450 made it look like a 386, or perhaps worse.
The *only* logical choice is to pick the best deal at the time that you buy. Buying by brand just makes you a brainless lemming, no offense intended.
Arkaign:
Purchasing by brand isn't any different in the computer world than it is in the clothing world or the automotive world or the food world. Sometimes you get the quality that you're looking for, sometimes all you get is a pretty package.
The P4 is the *only* CPU I remember that had a lower IPC than anything that came before it.Originally posted by: keysplayr2003
Well, I suppose what is really important is that AMD is showing signs of actual activity. A product was released. They are doing something. And the product is not half bad. 15% better than K8 clock for clock isn't bad at all. Consider how good the K8 was/is. Don't look at Intel for the moment. A 15+/- improvement over a previous gen is quite good.
And you can't really go by P4 to C2D because P4 was in big trouble compared to K8's. For all the hardships AMD is going through right now, I have to give them props for even getting that 15%. I was anticipating a flop to be honest. But this wasn't a flop, even though it's not spectacular either.
Originally posted by: SickBeast
The P4 is the *only* CPU I remember that had a lower IPC than anything that came before it.Originally posted by: keysplayr2003
Well, I suppose what is really important is that AMD is showing signs of actual activity. A product was released. They are doing something. And the product is not half bad. 15% better than K8 clock for clock isn't bad at all. Consider how good the K8 was/is. Don't look at Intel for the moment. A 15+/- improvement over a previous gen is quite good.
And you can't really go by P4 to C2D because P4 was in big trouble compared to K8's. For all the hardships AMD is going through right now, I have to give them props for even getting that 15%. I was anticipating a flop to be honest. But this wasn't a flop, even though it's not spectacular either.
I say that 15% is a huge disappointment simply because it took an enormous team of engineers several years to reach that goal. I'll bet they would have made more gains by having those people research manufacturing and chipset design.
I suppose one could make the argument that the fastest P3s were faster than some of the P4s at launch, but really, I don't see the P4 as much of an engineering success...
The one saving grace for AMD may be higher memory clocks. I'm pretty sure Gary Key stated that the chips like high bandwidth memory. Maybe some of you with C2Ds can let us know what kind of hit you take by running at DDR667 speeds. :light:
I say that 15% is a huge disappointment simply because it took an enormous team of engineers several years to reach that goal. I'll bet they would have made more gains by having those people research manufacturing and chipset design.
Someone may have already said this, but on the desktop side, few people really NEED the power of a core 2 duo cpu. I would say gamers and other enthusiasts are the only ones that actually take advantage of a chip like that, and they make up what, like 10% of the market? I just bought my girlfriend a laptop with a 1.9 ghz turion x2 and 1 gig of ram, and it plows right through vista, multitasking, movies, etc. Which is what most of the market uses a pc for.
It's not unlikely to think that Phenom scores will improve by at least 10%. Memory gains from using higher speed non server DDR2 667 RAM should be somewhere around 5%. Mature chipset drivers catered specifically for desktop apps should yield another 5% as well. These preliminary scores are very promising in the server arena, but if AMD wants to regain lost share in the desktop arena they better pray they can get those clockspeeds up.
Originally posted by: covert24
Originally posted by: Pederv
Originally posted by: Arkaign
Originally posted by: Pederv
Originally posted by: keysplayr2003
Originally posted by: Pederv
I'll probably get a Phenom, sometime next year or so.
Am I a fanboi? I don't consider myself one.
I do have name brands that I usually purchase, whether it's my Darigold milk, my Ford car or my AMD CPU. Do I stop buying Darigold because I get a bad gallon? No I just buy another gallon of milk.
I don't think I've ever bought a CPU that was past it's expiration date.
Good one Keys.
My wife didn't look at the expiration date on products until she saw me making a point to do so. As a result, the bad gallons are few and far between.
Just as my auto maker of choice went from AMC to Ford, when AMC went out of buisiness. My CPU manufacturer of choice will change if AMD goes out of buisiness, no biggie. Until that happens the CPU I'll purchase is what AMD has that I can afford, when I can afford it. It's not like AMD is going to charge me twice the price for the same performance as Intel would. I just won't have the fastest system on the planet, again no biggie.
That goes beyond idiotic, to purchase based on brand in the computer world. It would have meant that you were using the crap K5 when the Pentium was kicking it's butt. Or using a PMMX when K6-2 was walking all over it. Or a K6-3 when The Celeron 300a@450 made it look like a 386, or perhaps worse.
The *only* logical choice is to pick the best deal at the time that you buy. Buying by brand just makes you a brainless lemming, no offense intended.
Arkaign:
Purchasing by brand isn't any different in the computer world than it is in the clothing world or the automotive world or the food world. Sometimes you get the quality that you're looking for, sometimes all you get is a pretty package.
if we are talking in regards to processors than it is extremely different than in life. In life you have all different brands making different things in different ways. in the processor world you have two main companies that both produce great processors. and like arkain said if both of the 2 are equal in price but one is better performance wise than the other, whats the sense in buying the other one?
Originally posted by: Pederv
Originally posted by: covert24
Originally posted by: Pederv
Originally posted by: Arkaign
Originally posted by: Pederv
Originally posted by: keysplayr2003
Originally posted by: Pederv
I'll probably get a Phenom, sometime next year or so.
Am I a fanboi? I don't consider myself one.
I do have name brands that I usually purchase, whether it's my Darigold milk, my Ford car or my AMD CPU. Do I stop buying Darigold because I get a bad gallon? No I just buy another gallon of milk.
I don't think I've ever bought a CPU that was past it's expiration date.
Good one Keys.
My wife didn't look at the expiration date on products until she saw me making a point to do so. As a result, the bad gallons are few and far between.
Just as my auto maker of choice went from AMC to Ford, when AMC went out of buisiness. My CPU manufacturer of choice will change if AMD goes out of buisiness, no biggie. Until that happens the CPU I'll purchase is what AMD has that I can afford, when I can afford it. It's not like AMD is going to charge me twice the price for the same performance as Intel would. I just won't have the fastest system on the planet, again no biggie.
That goes beyond idiotic, to purchase based on brand in the computer world. It would have meant that you were using the crap K5 when the Pentium was kicking it's butt. Or using a PMMX when K6-2 was walking all over it. Or a K6-3 when The Celeron 300a@450 made it look like a 386, or perhaps worse.
The *only* logical choice is to pick the best deal at the time that you buy. Buying by brand just makes you a brainless lemming, no offense intended.
Arkaign:
Purchasing by brand isn't any different in the computer world than it is in the clothing world or the automotive world or the food world. Sometimes you get the quality that you're looking for, sometimes all you get is a pretty package.
if we are talking in regards to processors than it is extremely different than in life. In life you have all different brands making different things in different ways. in the processor world you have two main companies that both produce great processors. and like arkain said if both of the 2 are equal in price but one is better performance wise than the other, whats the sense in buying the other one?
Isn't there one major national or international company that sells espresso? I will hunt for a mom-and-pop espresso stand before I buy from Starbucks. Ever since Starbucks started using those automated espresso machines their coffee tastes like something you would find on the floor in a barn. On top of that they are over priced, a mom-and-pop stand can cost you buck or two less for a better cup of coffee.
The real world isn't different than the computer world. One just needs to know what their priorities are.
Originally posted by: Arkaign
Originally posted by: Pederv
Originally posted by: covert24
Originally posted by: Pederv
Originally posted by: Arkaign
Originally posted by: Pederv
Originally posted by: keysplayr2003
Originally posted by: Pederv
I'll probably get a Phenom, sometime next year or so.
Am I a fanboi? I don't consider myself one.
I do have name brands that I usually purchase, whether it's my Darigold milk, my Ford car or my AMD CPU. Do I stop buying Darigold because I get a bad gallon? No I just buy another gallon of milk.
I don't think I've ever bought a CPU that was past it's expiration date.
Good one Keys.
My wife didn't look at the expiration date on products until she saw me making a point to do so. As a result, the bad gallons are few and far between.
Just as my auto maker of choice went from AMC to Ford, when AMC went out of buisiness. My CPU manufacturer of choice will change if AMD goes out of buisiness, no biggie. Until that happens the CPU I'll purchase is what AMD has that I can afford, when I can afford it. It's not like AMD is going to charge me twice the price for the same performance as Intel would. I just won't have the fastest system on the planet, again no biggie.
That goes beyond idiotic, to purchase based on brand in the computer world. It would have meant that you were using the crap K5 when the Pentium was kicking it's butt. Or using a PMMX when K6-2 was walking all over it. Or a K6-3 when The Celeron 300a@450 made it look like a 386, or perhaps worse.
The *only* logical choice is to pick the best deal at the time that you buy. Buying by brand just makes you a brainless lemming, no offense intended.
Arkaign:
Purchasing by brand isn't any different in the computer world than it is in the clothing world or the automotive world or the food world. Sometimes you get the quality that you're looking for, sometimes all you get is a pretty package.
if we are talking in regards to processors than it is extremely different than in life. In life you have all different brands making different things in different ways. in the processor world you have two main companies that both produce great processors. and like arkain said if both of the 2 are equal in price but one is better performance wise than the other, whats the sense in buying the other one?
Isn't there one major national or international company that sells espresso? I will hunt for a mom-and-pop espresso stand before I buy from Starbucks. Ever since Starbucks started using those automated espresso machines their coffee tastes like something you would find on the floor in a barn. On top of that they are over priced, a mom-and-pop stand can cost you buck or two less for a better cup of coffee.
The real world isn't different than the computer world. One just needs to know what their priorities are.
Agreed on Starbucks vs. Mom & Pop coffee houses. Honestly, that analogy contradicts your logic in buying Cpus. With your coffee, you're willing to analyze cost/taste/etc to make a qualified decision. With your cpus, you buy because of the name on the box. Big difference.
Originally posted by: SolMiester
Hi all, I'm just wondering, I mean I could be wrong, but everyone appears to be comparing Barca with a C2D, now I thought the Phemon was supposed to be 4 cores (native), wont the comparative Intel be the Q6600?
Originally posted by: soonerproud
Originally posted by: SolMiester
Hi all, I'm just wondering, I mean I could be wrong, but everyone appears to be comparing Barca with a C2D, now I thought the Phemon was supposed to be 4 cores (native), wont the comparative Intel be the Q6600?
A Q6600 is a C2D processor. The 2 in the C2D does not represent the number of cores. It means it is the second architecture in the core family line up.
Originally posted by: cmdrdredd
Originally posted by: soonerproud
Originally posted by: SolMiester
Hi all, I'm just wondering, I mean I could be wrong, but everyone appears to be comparing Barca with a C2D, now I thought the Phemon was supposed to be 4 cores (native), wont the comparative Intel be the Q6600?
A Q6600 is a C2D processor. The 2 in the C2D does not represent the number of cores. It means it is the second architecture in the core family line up.
Core2 you mean. There's Core2Duo and Core2Quad