AT World of Warcraft Thread (Cataclysm, Where do you play, General BS and all that)

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gimmewhitecastles

Golden Member
Mar 2, 2005
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Oh I do that all the time, as I have the targets bound to my F keys...but people still ignore them when I do AoE pulls for some reason. You'd think people would have common sense when I mark Skull, X, and so forth but alas, they do not...

Those are probably the same people that look at dps meters in a 5 man pug. Instead of going for a smooth run they just try to top dps meters. I once was healing in a group where a fire mage was doing his dps at melee range. He kept taking aoe dmg from the mobs so I asked him why he was doing that. He promptly told me to stfu because dragon breath adds to his overall dps and i shouldn't be telling him how to play his class. :\
 

RatboyX

Senior member
Oct 12, 2010
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Those are probably the same people that look at dps meters in a 5 man pug. Instead of going for a smooth run they just try to top dps meters. I once was healing in a group where a fire mage was doing his dps at melee range. He kept taking aoe dmg from the mobs so I asked him why he was doing that. He promptly told me to stfu because dragon breath adds to his overall dps and i shouldn't be telling him how to play his class. :\

Nope, that’s not how a DPS talks to a healer not if he wants to stay alive. The proper response to his STFU should have been, “I didn’t know that mages could heal themselves now, but it should be interesting to watch.”

Or perhaps even better don’t say anything and let him feel the full pain of his stupidity as he keeps falling over dead.
 

gimmewhitecastles

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Mar 2, 2005
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Nope, that’s not how a DPS talks to a healer not if he wants to stay alive. The proper response to his STFU should have been, “I didn’t know that mages could heal themselves now, but it should be interesting to watch.”

Or perhaps even better don’t say anything and let him feel the full pain of his stupidity as he keeps falling over dead.

Well i did tell him he won't be getting any heals the rest of the way. Soon after he just left the group. I told the group I was glad he left. But the tank was like "why? what was wrong with him?" /facepalm. I think I left the group just as fast.
 

Aikouka

Lifer
Nov 27, 2001
30,383
912
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just put those skull targets on mobs before pulls. it's universally understood that those should be put down first.

People don't always pay attention to marks.

I'm trying to gear up a shadowpriest for raids. Haven't played much since BC but i noticed a lot of mechanics have changed. What should be the optimal hit rating? should it be capped or can other stats take some space? personally i think priority should be int -> crit -> mastery -> haste but any advice will be appreciated.

Last I heard, hit capping wasn't that important on a Shadow Priest. I believe hit, haste and crit all had a fairly similar EP value and mastery was slightly worse.

Still don't know why people refuse to use the "assist" button...

I prefer if people assist off me, and I assist off tanks in heroics, but sometimes, the tanks will just switch their target randomly and I'll end up easily pulling the original target :\.
 

gimmewhitecastles

Golden Member
Mar 2, 2005
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People don't always pay attention to marks.



Last I heard, hit capping wasn't that important on a Shadow Priest. I believe hit, haste and crit all had a fairly similar EP value and mastery was slightly worse.



I prefer if people assist off me, and I assist off tanks in heroics, but sometimes, the tanks will just switch their target randomly and I'll end up easily pulling the original target :\.

Is haste as important as the rest for an spriest? If a mind flay will tick faster with haste I might see the advantage but other than an occasional mind blast spriests don't really cast as much as say a mage. Unless there are boss fights that removes dots on themselves where then you relegated to mindspike mindblast combos. But even then if you can stack crit close 30-35% you can get an almost guaranteed mind blast insta crit after 2 mind spikes instead of 3.
 

rivan

Diamond Member
Jul 8, 2003
9,677
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50% of PUGs pay no attention to marks.

Fixed for ya.

Drives me up a wall - and it makes things WAY worse when people then assist me while tanking, because I've got some alternate mob targeted to pull back aggro.

I swear, the {cross} dies last in half of the pulls in any given heroic.
 

Scotteq

Diamond Member
Apr 10, 2008
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I prefer if people assist off me, and I assist off tanks in heroics, but sometimes, the tanks will just switch their target randomly and I'll end up easily pulling the original target :\.



As a Warrior tank: My AoE Threat generation has always been the worst of all the tanking classes/specs. So out of long, long habit, I constantly tab through the mobs I'm working in order to give each a little personal attention. Kind of need to do that, at least a little. I do mark my Primary - both for the DDs and for me to find it again.


As a Deathknight Tank: I still switch around sometimes, but it's not necessary at all unless I have a DD who can't (or won't) assist and insists on single~target Molestifying a secondary mob.
 

Aikouka

Lifer
Nov 27, 2001
30,383
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As a Warrior tank

I usually switch more often on my warrior tank, but not much on my Paladin. It only takes a few HotRs and I've got enough threat to ensure the healer won't pull.

The annoyance that I run into is that people don't realize that I'm not doing much until the pull is done, which is usually when the mobs are all crowded around me. Sometimes this takes awhile with a large spaced-out pull like the one before the second boss in VP.

Is haste as important as the rest for an spriest? If a mind flay will tick faster with haste I might see the advantage but other than an occasional mind blast spriests don't really cast as much as say a mage. Unless there are boss fights that removes dots on themselves where then you relegated to mindspike mindblast combos. But even then if you can stack crit close 30-35% you can get an almost guaranteed mind blast insta crit after 2 mind spikes instead of 3.

You might be better off checking shadowpriest.com ... it's been awhile since I've kept up with the stats and opinions may have changed.
 

RatboyX

Senior member
Oct 12, 2010
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Those that do know are key players of the guild, i just have no paitence to deal with a PMSing foul at this time lol

It would have been a funnier Typo if you had said a “PMSing Fowl.” Then I would have suspected a Moonkin.
 

redrider4life4

Senior member
Jan 23, 2009
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I think I feel different from most people, in the rare chance I do an actual random without guildies I'd rather have higher dps pulling aggro than low dps attacking the correct targets.

When I'm healing a weak tank with low dps I constantly run out of mana, but if I have high dps I have to pay attention more, but stuff dies so much quicker and the instance is still overall faster which is what I care about when it comes down to it.

A lot of classes have great cleave dmg that some tanks just don't have the skill to hold aggro because of their bad targeting skills. Obviously targeting the wrong mob entirely is not cool, but what I'm saying is if you have a mage they should be living bomb 3 targets to maximize dps and if a tank can't hold aggro over some cleave dmg and a living bomb then that is the tanks fault not the DPS.

-Mike
 

Scotteq

Diamond Member
Apr 10, 2008
5,276
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The annoyance that I run into is that people don't realize that I'm not doing much until the pull is done, which is usually when the mobs are all crowded around me. Sometimes this takes awhile with a large spaced-out pull like the one before the second boss in VP..



/agreed


Though that is an area where Warriors have a small advantage: We can run ahead - Charge and/or Heroic Leap into the mobs, and gain a few seconds before the DDs can get themselves in range. A Pally or Death Knight is no faster than anyone else.

In guild, I'll often charge off to the next pull just before the current mobs die.
 

Anubis

No Lifer
Aug 31, 2001
78,716
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tbqhwy.com
I swear, the {cross} dies last in half of the pulls in any given heroic.

unless an order is specified after Skull the rest up for grabs, simply because everyone does shit differently, back when i still played and we still marked targets we did Skull - circle - triangle-.... pretty sure X was close to the end
 

rivan

Diamond Member
Jul 8, 2003
9,677
3
81
unless an order is specified after Skull the rest up for grabs, simply because everyone does shit differently, back when i still played and we still marked targets we did Skull - circle - triangle-.... pretty sure X was close to the end

Huh, I knew some servers treated the CC differently, but thought skull then X was pretty universal.

I've been thinking about making a macro outlining marks and kill order for heroics. Guess I should get off my ass and do it.
 

Garou24

Member
Oct 21, 2008
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Me and my friends normally use the skull for the first target and cross for second. green triangle is for hex, blue square for frost trap and moon for sheep. Seems to work well enough and most the people I play with use that setup.
 

zokudu

Diamond Member
Nov 11, 2009
4,364
1
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As a Warrior tank: My AoE Threat generation has always been the worst of all the tanking classes/specs. So out of long, long habit, I constantly tab through the mobs I'm working in order to give each a little personal attention. Kind of need to do that, at least a little. I do mark my Primary - both for the DDs and for me to find it again.


As a Deathknight Tank: I still switch around sometimes, but it's not necessary at all unless I have a DD who can't (or won't) assist and insists on single~target Molestifying a secondary mob.

Play a bear tank. I dare you.
 

Scotteq

Diamond Member
Apr 10, 2008
5,276
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Play a bear tank. I dare you.


I have a Druid, he is Feral, and I do tank on him at times. I haven't leveled him from 80 yet, though, and therefore have not expressed any judgment about how they work in the current expansion. The Warrior (Prot/Arms) is my Main, the DK (Blood/UH) Second, and my Priest (Dis/Sha) is my 3rd 85. My Warlock (Dem/Aff) is 83, and is the next in line. Plus with that many toons to gear and rep, leveling time is pretty limited. So my overgrown War~Possum won't see 85 for another month or two.


Opinions about Druid tanking so far: Not enough buttons to press, his ass is too big, and fleas are an ongoing problem, despite regular baths. :awe: Feral tanking is kind of boring, IMHO.

***********

A follow on question - Does anyone have experience with Arms Warriors (PvE) on the test realms? I got a second epic weapon last night, and was considering flipping to TG~Fury for the improvement in personal DPS. It's not my main spec, though, and we don't raid with a Feral. So on the few fights I do DPS on Arms brings the Trauma debuff, which our Fury Warrior, Hunter, and (a little lesser) Enh Shammy can benefit from.

The patch notes look decent, but I was looking for an opinion on the extent of the increase. If the difference in PvE output is closer on the test realm, I may stay Arms for the debuff.
 
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Aikouka

Lifer
Nov 27, 2001
30,383
912
126
Me and my friends normally use the skull for the first target and cross for second. green triangle is for hex, blue square for frost trap and moon for sheep. Seems to work well enough and most the people I play with use that setup.

That sounds about right. Diamond is also usually reserved for Warlocks Banish/Fear or sometimes for my Shaman's Bind Elemental (sometimes we can do two CCs in a pull).

Play a bear tank. I dare you.

Why would I want to be a wanna-be warrior?
 

1ceHacka

Senior member
Mar 3, 2006
565
1
0
You might be better off checking shadowpriest.com ... it's been awhile since I've kept up with the stats and opinions may have changed.

Haste affects dots/hots ticks. I find it hard to believe that hit isn't the highest weighted stat for shadowpriests as well. Who cares if you can get an 80k mindblast if you aren't hit capped.
 

Garou24

Member
Oct 21, 2008
96
0
66
Haste affects dots/hots ticks. I find it hard to believe that hit isn't the highest weighted stat for shadowpriests as well. Who cares if you can get an 80k mindblast if you aren't hit capped.

Doesn't Spirit add to a Shadowpriest's hit? The + hit gained form spirit allows other stats to move up in the priority since its easy to have enough hit.
 

RatboyX

Senior member
Oct 12, 2010
233
0
0
Me and my friends normally use the skull for the first target and cross for second. green triangle is for hex, blue square for frost trap and moon for sheep. Seems to work well enough and most the people I play with use that setup.

We use the exact same markings.

Had a PUG run in Stone core last night. Two guild members and myself with two random people. The Tank was one of the random people and right from the start we knew he was good. First thing he did was mark the first pull and said Trap is Blue Square and Hex is Green triangle. There was almost no need for talking from that point on as everyone knew exactly what to do and when to do it.

It was one of the fastest runs I’ve ever had in Heroic Stone Core. A good tank in there makes that run EASY. I actually had FUN in a PUG for a change.
 

polarmystery

Diamond Member
Aug 21, 2005
3,907
8
81
From how it's been for me, I'm used to following:

Skull = 1st target
Red X = 2nd target (3rd target on is assessed before pull)
Blue square = Frost trap
Moon = Sheep
Purple Diamond = MC or Fear or Banish
Star = SAP
Green Triangle = Hex
Orange Circle = ? (Maybe Hibernate?)

I think I feel different from most people, in the rare chance I do an actual random without guildies I'd rather have higher dps pulling aggro than low dps attacking the correct targets.

When I'm healing a weak tank with low dps I constantly run out of mana, but if I have high dps I have to pay attention more, but stuff dies so much quicker and the instance is still overall faster which is what I care about when it comes down to it.

A lot of classes have great cleave dmg that some tanks just don't have the skill to hold aggro because of their bad targeting skills. Obviously targeting the wrong mob entirely is not cool, but what I'm saying is if you have a mage they should be living bomb 3 targets to maximize dps and if a tank can't hold aggro over some cleave dmg and a living bomb then that is the tanks fault not the DPS.

-Mike

Not of they are AoE tanking and that mob which is targeted by that DPS player is not the tanks current focus. IE: If I'm tanking 5 mobs, my Blood and Thunder talent will only do rend damage (and the initial Thunderclap damage), and my cleave damage (Glyphed) will only hit a maximum of three targets. If you are targeting any of the two not getting hit by cleave damage, then my only way to maintain threat on those targets from you is only rend + Shockwave (Which has a fairly long CD) thus easily pulling aggro away.
 
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1ceHacka

Senior member
Mar 3, 2006
565
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Doesn't Spirit add to a Shadowpriest's hit? The + hit gained form spirit allows other stats to move up in the priority since its easy to have enough hit.

Yes, but ultimately its still hit. As a rule of thumb, hit far outweighs other stats until you are capped as a caster. I'm a resto druid though...I just make the bars green.
 
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