The best part about all of this is that steel core ammo offers no advantage to sportsmen over lead core ammo, making the whole flap just a demonstration of gun freak paranoia.
On top of that, steel core 5.56 ammo hasn't been banned at all.
Yeh, yeh, I know- "But they wanna do it!"
So what if they did? Enthusiasts would still be able to buy all the lead core 5.56 ammo that their hearts desire.
Must be one of those "Freedumb!" things.
he part that really bothers me is that excuse doesn't work when dealing with the government. I can guarantee you if we were to omit or make a mistake on part of our paperwork obligations to the government saying 'Yawn. Life isn't perfect' is NOT going to get the fees\penalties removed.
The uproar wasn't necessarily about banning this specific ammo. It was the ATFs reasoning. That this ammo can penetrate soft body armor from a handgun. Banning green tip ammo because of that reason opens up the door to ban all .223 and 5.56. Because they can all penetrate soft body armor.
When I was in Alaska in the Army I remember seeing this odd looking shotgun called a "Street Sweeper". It is an odd looking shotgun with a drum capable of loading and firing 12 each 12 guage shotgun shells. It was not that great of a weapon, but the ATF did not like it. The ATF had the gun classified as a destructive device with no sporting application. That means you had to have a special permit just to own one. The ATF can pretty much do whatever it wants.
http://www.atf.gov/regulations-rulings/rulings/atf-rulings/atf-ruling-2001-1.html
The uproar wasn't necessarily about banning this specific ammo. It was the ATFs reasoning. That this ammo can penetrate soft body armor from a handgun. Banning green tip ammo because of that reason opens up the door to ban all .223 and 5.56. Because they can all penetrate soft body armor.
The best part about all of this is that steel core ammo offers no advantage to sportsmen over lead core ammo, making the whole flap just a demonstration of gun freak paranoia.
On top of that, steel core 5.56 ammo hasn't been banned at all.
Yeh, yeh, I know- "But they wanna do it!"
So what if they did? Enthusiasts would still be able to buy all the lead core 5.56 ammo that their hearts desire.
Must be one of those "Freedumb!" things.
So, Bush's ATF was bad, then, because that's when that ban was put into place.....2001. If the ban was wrong, couldn't the then current administration have just put a stop to the ban? And why wasn't it stopped?
Speculative fear mongering - par for the course, I'm afraid.
That isn't speculative fear mongering. It is a logical end game if that is the stated reason for banning green tipped ammo.
Ammo that never was banned in the first place, but, uhh, never mind, right?
You invoke the slippery slope fallacy w/o the first step being taken.
Are you intentionally being slow? Before they claimed it was a typo the reasoning why this ammo type was going to be banned was because it could penetrate soft armor. So can other .223 and 5.56 ammo types. I know you are a troll. But it is worth pointing out the worry created by this typo was not unfounded for the others reading this thread.
I'm intentionally being logical. No reasonable source has asserted that "it was going to be banned". While the BATFE may well have put the idea under consideration, that's all that happened, a whole lot of nothing. The "going to be banned" determination was never made.
Add a clerical error & the usual ravers are howling at the moon. Like I offered, don't act so fucking paranoid. It scares people, convinces 'em that you're nuttier than in real life.
So order up 1000 rounds, see if you can burn up your barrel at the range.
Which merely affirms what I said. The BATFE never arrived at the conclusion that this ammo "was going to be banned". The Whitehouse thought it might be a good idea. The BATFE didn't agree. It's smart of the chief executive to use the expertise of the various departments, right?
If they ever do, which seems doubtful, there's still the slippery slope fallacy you're leaning on in the usual conspiracy theorist fashion, ya know?
Like I said, buy 1000 rounds, go blow off some steam at the range. You think too much-
in circles, that is.
Which merely affirms what I said. The BATFE never arrived at the conclusion that this ammo "was going to be banned". The Whitehouse thought it might be a good idea. The BATFE didn't agree. It's smart of the chief executive to use the expertise of the various departments, right?
If they ever do, which seems doubtful, there's still the slippery slope fallacy you're leaning on in the usual conspiracy theorist fashion, ya know?
Like I said, buy 1000 rounds, go blow off some steam at the range. You think too much-
in circles, that is.
What do mean "the BATFE didn't agree?" BATFE is the very group that proposed banning the ammunition, and has explicitly stated that it intends to "withdraw the exemptions for 5.56 mm 'green tip' ammunition, including both the SS109 and M855 cartridge." The decision hasn't been finalized and is currently in a public comment period, but BAFTE absolutely wants to ban the ammunition.
After that document was released, the White House derailed the argument with its silly "save cops' lives" rhetoric. I don't really agree with the ATF's new "sporting purpose" framework (it allows ammunition used almost exclusively for recreational shooting to be classified as "non-sporting"), but I can at least follow the reasoning behind it. The White House's comments are just embarrassingly ignorant and intellectually lazy.
ATF recognizes that there will be some cartridges currently manufactured using non-restricted materials (e.g.lead or brass) that have been used by hunters and target shooters for sporting purposes, that if manufactured from listed materials, will not be eligible for exemption under the framework.These cartridges will remain available in the non-restricted materials, as they are today.
ATF recognizes that this ammunition is widely available to the public. Because it is legally permissible to possess armor piercing ammunition under current law, withdrawing the exemption will not place individuals in criminal possession of armor piercing ammunition.
Yes, weapons that kill countless people in minutes.
Or a missed typo and I usually gloss over moonbeam's blather.Funny, and funnier, the OP missed this....flew right over his head.
Guess the OP is seeing rouge about the rogue individual.
Please, these guns are able to be belted with countless bullets. They are handheld, and can fire continuously 10+ bullets a second. They are modern handheld gatling gun.
Streetsweepers are really shitty guns but you make a valid point, the banned a shitty gun for shitty reasons on their own accord. Ironically after it was declared a destructive device all of the current owners were allowed to cut the barrel down to 12" since it was already classified a destructive device.
There are brand new detachable magazine fed shotguns (streetsweeper has an attached magazine that works similar to a revolver and the loading/unloading process is slow as hell and a pita) on the market as well as a few old ones, I almost bought a Saiga 12 at the last gun show I went to. Really fun gun but it already costs me a ton to go shooting at the range, I didn't really want to add a dozen boxes of 12ga shells to the shopping list.
Edit: Damn, I didn't realize that Obama had banned importing Saiga's recently due to the Crimea takeover. I'll have to look and see if he banned importing most Russian shit or just stuff he didn't like, for now I'm going to give him the benefit of the doubt.
Please, these guns are able to be belted with countless bullets. They are handheld, and can fire continuously 10+ bullets a second. They are modern handheld gatling gun.
Please, these guns are able to be belted with countless bullets. They are handheld, and can fire continuously 10+ bullets a second. They are modern handheld gatling gun.
Either side seems to get their panties equally in a wad over their given cause.