Athlon 64 X2 4400+ vs 4800+

[NightShadeKW]

I'm down to the final part for my computer. I'm getting:

Asus A8N32-SLI Deluxe Motherboard
Corsair XMS PC3200 2GB Memory
Western Digital 400GB WD4000KD Hard Drive
Antec P180 Case
eVGA 7800 GTX Video Card
SeaSonic 600W Power Supply
X-Fi XtremeMusic Sound Card
NEC ND3550A DVD Burner
Samsung Floppy Drive

Now all I need to do is pick a processor. I'm down to the 4800+ or the 4400+. I guess the question is whether or not the boost the 4800+ offers is worth the extra money. I Probably won't be overclocking (much anyway), and I likely will use the stock heatsink. If it doesn't produce too much heat I might OC the 4400+ to 4800+ speeds. Does anybody have any thoughts on these processors?

 

[biostud]

4400+

The price tag is definately not worth the extra cost IMO.

and a 10% o/c is almost certain.

 

[Zebo]

Originally posted by: biostud
4400+

The price tag is definately not worth the extra cost IMO.

.

Yeah no kidding.. You're talking about 10% performance here for 100% more money. That's like buying a K&N filter for your mustang for $27,000.

 

[lopri]

It'd be extremely easy to OC a 4400+ to a 4800+. Should be achieved with stock VCore. And with a 4800+, I'd say 2.64GHz should be considered given. (at or near stock VCore) So what it boils down to is the price. Some might say a 4800+ is not worth extra money compared to a 4400+, but others could say that a 4400+ is not worth extra money compared to a 3800+. (a 4400+ is not cheap)

Check eBay. I've seen a brand new 4800+ being sold for $670 the other day. (Although shipping was $30 ) At that price, I'd say 4800+ is a better deal than a 4400+ for over $500. Alternatively you can get an Opteron 170 or 175 and OC it. Opteron 170 OEM goes for as low as $365 and I think there is a very good chance it'll hit 2.4GHz. Potentially a much better deal than 4800+/4400+.

 

[Zebo]

Lopri has the right idea - 170 to 4800+ for $370.

All you do here is simple- set bus up to 240 and ram still runs stock if you use divider. Don't even have to bump voltage.

 

[NightShadeKW]

If I do get the 4400+ and overclock it, would it be difficult to do? I've never overclocked anything before. I know that it voids the warranty, are there any other adverse consequences, particularly for a small boost (like to 4800+ speeds). How would I do it, change the speed setting in the BIOS?

 

[Slider821]

OCing with Asus BIOS is easier then ever. Just go into the bios and Im pretty sure its under 'CPU and Voltage configuration" or something of the like, and change the Overclock setting from Auto to 10% and bam, you got 2.42 ghz. Watch temps though. On my 4400 I run non-ODed at 32 degrees C using Thermaltake Blue Orb II and OCed to 2.42 ghz I run at 38 degrees C.

 

[NightShadeKW]

Is that dangerous? I thought it was only a problem at temperatures that were like twice that.

 

[NightShadeKW]

So is it agreed that I could safely and easily overclock the 4400+ to 4800+ speeds with little trouble / danger with the components I listed?

SOMEBODY REASSURE ME PLEASE!

 

[nealh]

Originally posted by: NightShadeKW
So is it agreed that I could safely and easily overclock the 4400+ to 4800+ speeds with little trouble / danger with the components I listed?

SOMEBODY REASSURE ME PLEASE!

yes...4400 should easily hit 4800 speeds...but why pay for a 4400 when an Opteron 170 oem at monarch computers is $375 shipped..2.0GHZ dual core with 1MB L2 cache..I have no seem one not hit 2.4 ghz..many are hitting 2.7 GHZ at low vcores....

 

[NightShadeKW]

I was under the impression that overclocking a lot would produce a lot of heat and so forth. I really know very little about overclocking, but I wasn't planning on getting liquid cooling or anything, and really wasn't looking to get any fans other than the 3 that come with the case and the stock heatsink.

 

[Skott]

All the X2's and 165 and up Optys will overclock to 2.4 (4800 X2)without a big fuss. Its pretty much a unofficial gurantee. How far you can go beyond the 2.4 is the unknown. Some will get 2.7 and some will only get 2.5. Some will get something in between. It comes down to luck of the draw. Granted system components used also has alot to do with it. Overclocking expertise plays a role too I believe in some ways. Beyond 2.4 there really is no gurantee.

Overclocking does produce more heat and strain and use extra power. Thats why you should plan ahead if you do want to overclock. Get the right components that will help make it possible. If overclocking is something you are not comfortable with then you have to resort to the old method of simply buying as much cpu power as you can afford. Right now the current top end X2 is the 4800. Pricey? Yes. But unless you plan to overclock a lower end chip you dont have a choice but to buy the 4800 if you want its power. And for those who choose not to overclock, dont let people talk you into something you dont feel comfortable with. Nothing wrong with buying a higher end chip if you have the money to do so just as there is nothing wrong with overclocking a chip if its something you want to do/try. Just be sure to plan it out in advance.

 

[CraigSlice]

Originally posted by: Skott
Yes. But unless you plan to overclock a lower end chip you dont have a choice but to buy the 4800 if you want its power. And for those who choose not to overclock, dont let people talk you into something you dont feel comfortable with. Nothing wrong with buying a higher end chip if you have the money to do so just as there is nothing wrong with overclocking a chip if its something you want to do/try. Just be sure to plan it out in advance.

Best advice i've read here so far.

 

[allies]

My 4400+ hit 2.4 GHz at stock voltage, which read 1.31 volts (MSI board undervolts). With 1.4 volts I'm up to 2.52 ghz, hardly any sweat. I think I may be able to get her up to 2.6 GHz without much more of a problem, but we'll see if the increased volts/temp is worth it.

 

[NightShadeKW]

Originally posted by: Skott
All the X2's and 165 and up Optys will overclock to 2.4 (4800 X2)without a big fuss. Its pretty much a unofficial gurantee. How far you can go beyond the 2.4 is the unknown. Some will get 2.7 and some will only get 2.5. Some will get something in between. It comes down to luck of the draw. Granted system components used also has alot to do with it. Overclocking expertise plays a role too I believe in some ways. Beyond 2.4 there really is no gurantee.

Overclocking does produce more heat and strain and use extra power. Thats why you should plan ahead if you do want to overclock. Get the right components that will help make it possible. If overclocking is something you are not comfortable with then you have to resort to the old method of simply buying as much cpu power as you can afford. Right now the current top end X2 is the 4800. Pricey? Yes. But unless you plan to overclock a lower end chip you dont have a choice but to buy the 4800 if you want its power. And for those who choose not to overclock, dont let people talk you into something you dont feel comfortable with. Nothing wrong with buying a higher end chip if you have the money to do so just as there is nothing wrong with overclocking a chip if its something you want to do/try. Just be sure to plan it out in advance.

Well, I have a 600W power supply, and the rest of the components, as far as I can tell, support the option of overclocking. As for the the heat, would that be a problem with the stock heatsink? From what I'm hearing, it's safe and easy to overclock considering the system I am setting up, so even though I've never done it, it seems to me that that would probably be the best way to go.

As it stands right now I think I'm going to get a 4400+, and then overclock it (though probably not right away, maybe down the road when/if I need the extra speed).

 

[Skott]

If I understand the clock speeds on the chips correctly the 4400 is 2.2 and the 4800 is 2.4. So you are only making a small overclock jump of .2. From the parts listed in your original post that system should handle that small overclock just fine. The only possible weak link is the hsf but from what I have heard of the 4400 retail fan it should be sufficient to do it. Now if you think you will go over that 2.4 I would highly suggest a third party hsf. Wether you get a third party hsf now (at build) or later is entirely up to you.

Are you building the rig yourself or having it built for you? If you are having it built for you some companies will install a third party hsf for you as part of the build. Your limited to what hsf they offer though. If you do it yourself you can add whatever size hsf you want.

 

[zoz123]

I was in the same boat and got the 4800 X2, I have no overclocking experience and so, I didn't feel comfortable about overclocking, I could fry something if I don't know what I am doing.

Plus I paid alot for my system and the X2 4800 prices dropped alot since their launch, so I decided on it. Add to this that I won't upgrade for at least 2-3 years and so I will be covered with warranty, heard that overcocking could shorten the life of components as they operate under different voltage ..etc.

 

[NightShadeKW]

I'm building it myself

Zoz: I'm really in the exact same boat, but I didn't know I could fry anything or decrease the life of the processor. I didn't know there were really serious consequences aside from voiding the warranty. Can any overclockers confirm or deny this?

 

[NightShadeKW]

Thoughts? anybody?

 

[Markfw]

Originally posted by: CraigSlice

Originally posted by: Skott
Yes. But unless you plan to overclock a lower end chip you dont have a choice but to buy the 4800 if you want its power. And for those who choose not to overclock, dont let people talk you into something you dont feel comfortable with. Nothing wrong with buying a higher end chip if you have the money to do so just as there is nothing wrong with overclocking a chip if its something you want to do/try. Just be sure to plan it out in advance.

Best advice i've read here so far.

If you don't change vcore, there is no risk.

 

[Regalk]

I am not going to repeat what some one said before. Asus allows 10% overclocking in BIOS for rookies and lots more for the hardcore.
Start with theri modest overclocking and see what your system can handle.
BTW 4400+ is plenty fast not sure why you want to get to 4800+unless if you are into video en/decoding etc

I copied and paste this from my post elsewhere in this same forum
""As long as you can stay less than 10% (7% is optimal for me) increase in core volt increase your cpu will be around for a long time (unless if you did a poor job at installing the HS). I have overclocked everything under the sun since the 300A (and still have it but with no MB) and never killed anything yet (that would be well over 7 years now). All o/c cpus are still alive and kicking as far as I know.
Now running
AMD64 3000+ at 320 X 8.5 as noted in sig (that would be 900 over spec)
TWO XPM2400 at 3200+ (> 2years)
Intel 2.533B at 3300 (3 years)""

 

[mrkun]

Opteron 165 (currently $280 at Monarch) is the only option.