ATI 4xxx Series Thread

[JACKDRUID]

Originally posted by: Quiksilver

Originally posted by: JACKDRUID

Originally posted by: Quiksilver

Was just trying to say the reason for that was because they moved the launch date forward to beat the 3870 out of the gate.

lol oh got it

actually, not really.. 8800 was on shortage for about 3 month... nvidia still doesn't have its own plant?..

No idea, but I would of believed that if they stuck their original release date they shortages would be been reduced by at least a month lol.

? not likely.... they had some amount of time making these chips...release date has no effect on it...

 

[ronnn]

Originally posted by: bryanW1995

Originally posted by: Bateluer

Originally posted by: ronnn

Originally posted by: munky
If the release was May 20th, I think we'd hear some concrete info on the specs by now, and probably some leaked benches as well.

Yes!!!! Very strange, even if middle of June, I would have expected something by now. But no stories of needing a respin either? Makes me wonder if the 4800 even exists. Nvda suggesting they will release info about their new card before release, does support the idea of a fast amd card coming............... but?


edit: If May 20, 2008, I would expect pictures of boxes with nice girls on them by now.

AMD has done this before though. How much fan faire was there for the 3000 series, or the 9700 Pro? They came out of no where. When a company wants to, they can keep the lid on tight until the official launch.

yeah, remember that they used first silicon for 3870's launch. they caught nvidia with their pants down, forcing the paper launch and, later, the cooling issues of the stock hsf that plague 8800gt to this day.

1 week before release there was lots of 3870 stuff with pictures. Last week in June makes more sense. Wonder why date got pushed back? hOpe no respsin.

 

[Quiksilver]

Originally posted by: ronnn

Originally posted by: bryanW1995

Originally posted by: Bateluer

Originally posted by: ronnn

Originally posted by: munky
If the release was May 20th, I think we'd hear some concrete info on the specs by now, and probably some leaked benches as well.

Yes!!!! Very strange, even if middle of June, I would have expected something by now. But no stories of needing a respin either? Makes me wonder if the 4800 even exists. Nvda suggesting they will release info about their new card before release, does support the idea of a fast amd card coming............... but?


edit: If May 20, 2008, I would expect pictures of boxes with nice girls on them by now.

AMD has done this before though. How much fan faire was there for the 3000 series, or the 9700 Pro? They came out of no where. When a company wants to, they can keep the lid on tight until the official launch.

yeah, remember that they used first silicon for 3870's launch. they caught nvidia with their pants down, forcing the paper launch and, later, the cooling issues of the stock hsf that plague 8800gt to this day.

1 week before release there was lots of 3870 stuff with pictures. Last week in June makes more sense. Wonder why date got pushed back? hOpe no respsin.

4800 series does not appear to be a re-hash like the 9800 series cards.

 

[bryanW1995]

Originally posted by: JACKDRUID

Originally posted by: Quiksilver. I can't explain the ATI launch though other than they just felt the need to put something on the market.

ATI launched late because they were releasing 2 products at the same time... actually.. its a whole new generation that they were releasing, that is why they need more time to prepare.

Nvidia on the other hand, was only releasing a refresh.. so they can release it earlier.

Neither are paper launch. 8800 just sold more due to better performance per buck...

I think that MOST rational observers will agree that nvidia launched 8800gt sooner than they originally intended to. Nvidia also bumped up the clocks on 8800gt at the last minute, leaving potential users with loud/inadequate cooling for the final speed? Was that just because they felt like it, or can you at least admit that competitive issues necessitated this?

 

[JACKDRUID]

Originally posted by: bryanW1995

I think that MOST rational observers will agree that nvidia launched 8800gt sooner than they originally intended to. Nvidia also bumped up the clocks on 8800gt at the last minute, leaving potential users with loud/inadequate cooling for the final speed? Was that just because they felt like it, or can you at least admit that competitive issues necessitated this?

true if you and MOST of your friends base your rational on fud/rumors...

in reality:

1. Adjusting clock speed require update in both bios and box label. not something that can be done 'last minute'...
2. Nvidia mid-range cards NEVER get good coolings. ex: 7800gt, 7900gt
3. As stated earlier, you assumed 8800gt was released early accordiing to a rumor/fud.
4. competitive issue? performance? price? what competitive issue?

 

[bryanW1995]

um, I didn't quote any sources to you because something that is accepted as fact needs no source. Why don't we ask keysplayr or rollo to ask around about this. It's not a crime to accelerate your product launch, however, so I'm unclear about your purpose in challenging this widely-held belief.

The single slot cooler is another issue, however. I'll tell you, that was a major reason that I bought a 3870 instead. The 8800gt cooler is barely adequate for a stock system and inadequate for the numerous oc variants that abound. It doesn't matter WHY this is the case, so again I'm confused as to your motives? Are you an nvidia employee? A viral marketer? A blind fanboy? Or are you just so blinded by all the postive nvidia press that you can't see the warts underneath the surface?

 

[Janooo]

RV770 is 256mm2

 

[taltamir]

delete

 

[JPB]

AMD has confirmed the release date in China.

The release date will be June 11th. Are you ready?

 

[Quiksilver]

Originally posted by: Janooo
RV770 is 256mm2

Wow does that GPU-Z looks blatantly obvious.

 

[Janooo]

Some more news.

In terms of performance, we heard some interesting claims. A 4870 should perform on par with or better than a dual-chip 3870 X2.

 

[dv8silencer]

http://www.tomshardware.com/ne...-radeon-4800,5375.html

 

[Avalon]

Awww mid June

When is GT200 speculated to be launched?

 

[Extelleron]

Originally posted by: Avalon
Awww mid June

When is GT200 speculated to be launched?

I guess the latest is that it will launch sometime in June.

It's going to be an interesting next few months. Hopefully we will see some real competition again and some true high end performance. G92 and RV670 have been great for bringing G80/R600 performance to the mainstream, but they have not met the need for a much faster graphics solution for people who want to spend more.

 

[bryanW1995]

that seems crazy to have 3870x2-type performance, aka better than 8800 ultra, but be 199-249... I'd heard previously that 4870 would be more like 349-369 at launch.

 

[LittleNemoNES]

With my mobo I hope that ATI does a great job this coming gen with Crossfire...
Unfortunately, there aren't that many good games out now...at least most of them are now old. Crysis (IIRC) was out in late November as well as COD4, etc
I love hardware but I can't justify any upgrades without new games. My 8800GT truely is the sweet spot.

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: bryanW1995
that seems crazy to have 3870x2-type performance, aka better than 8800 ultra, but be 199-249... I'd heard previously that 4870 would be more like 349-369 at launch.

When I read this, I thought:

1. ATi knows about some new NVIDIA budget card I don't.

OR

2. ATi just wants some marketshare back so bad they're going to give away their new cards to keep themselves in the enthusiast market.

OR (hopefully)

3. That is what that level of performance is worth in 2008, which would be good for all.

 

[allies]

Originally posted by: nRollo

Originally posted by: bryanW1995
that seems crazy to have 3870x2-type performance, aka better than 8800 ultra, but be 199-249... I'd heard previously that 4870 would be more like 349-369 at launch.

When I read this, I thought:

1. ATi knows about some new NVIDIA budget card I don't.

OR

2. ATi just wants some marketshare back so bad they're going to give away their new cards to keep themselves in the enthusiast market.

OR (hopefully)

3. That is what that level of performance is worth in 2008, which would be good for all.

Or maybe since they're supposedly having great yields on their chips @ 55um they can afford to price it where they'll dominate price/performance.

EDIT: The following breakdown for pricing makes sense to me:

4850 256mb - $125
4850 512mb - $150
4870 512mb - $225
4870X2 - $450

That would seriously shake up the market.

 

[Cookie Monster]

That seems abit too low if you ask me. Even on 55nm, the RV770 is not your RV670 or G71. By that i mean that its going to be bigger in terms of die size, and have more transistors (800~900 million according to current rumours) than the RV670 (for reference it has 666million transistors).

So perhaps an MSRP of $~299 for HD4870. If they use GDDR5, then it could be priced slightly (~$349) higher seeing as its relatively new i.e expensive. Then the HD4850 would sit around $199~249, and the 4850 256mb fills the $149~199 market segment. Unlike RV670, i think AMD can price these new parts more aggressively seeing as the HD4870 could potentially perform around a 3870X2 making it faster than the 9800GTX.

Plus, AMD can't afford to lose more money just to maintain marketshare. The prices you listed seems to shout "NO MARGINS". AMD needs all the money it can get, so hopefully these parts will do them good.

 

[Avalon]

I was figuring $179 for HD4850 256MB, $219 HD4850 512MB, $279 HD4870 512MB.

 

[Bateluer]

Good news on the pricing, its been pretty much assumed that Nvidia's GT200 chips will debut at 500+ USD, like all their previous chips. By pricing at half that, ATI doesn't need to equal it in performance, just come moderately close. And with ATI's superior drivers, the 4000 series is shaping up to be an excellent product.

The downside, I have to wait until mid june.

 

[Munky]

I must have missed the memo on the gt200 launching before rv770, because, quite frankly, I find it hard to believe.

 

[bryanW1995]

before apoppin pulled his disappear-arooskie, he was predicting gt200 very close to rv770. He thought that rv770 would debut in late april/early may, too, so he must have been thinking june for gt200. He never gave me his source for the gt200 info, but I'm pretty confident that it was somebody in the know Sadly, I don't think that he had ANY sources in the ati camp, even though he was their biggest fan. We need some canuks to go snoop around ati hq and see what's cookin...

 

[allies]

Originally posted by: Cookie Monster
That seems abit too low if you ask me. Even on 55nm, the RV770 is not your RV670 or G71. By that i mean that its going to be bigger in terms of die size, and have more transistors (800~900 million according to current rumours) than the RV670 (for reference it has 666million transistors).

So perhaps an MSRP of $~299 for HD4870. If they use GDDR5, then it could be priced slightly (~$349) higher seeing as its relatively new i.e expensive. Then the HD4850 would sit around $199~249, and the 4850 256mb fills the $149~199 market segment. Unlike RV670, i think AMD can price these new parts more aggressively seeing as the HD4870 could potentially perform around a 3870X2 making it faster than the 9800GTX.

Plus, AMD can't afford to lose more money just to maintain marketshare. The prices you listed seems to shout "NO MARGINS". AMD needs all the money it can get, so hopefully these parts will do them good.

From what I last heard, AMD was getting a 70%+ yield on their GPUs. I'd be mightily surprised if the 4870 512MB is $350...

 

[Rusin]

Originally posted by: munky
I must have missed the memo on the gt200 launching before rv770, because, quite frankly, I find it hard to believe.

Why? There was already news of GT200 hitting 'taped out'-status at early March and that they had working GT200 prototype-cards already early April.

..but yes it's hard to believe that GT200 would launch before RV770..I mean if there would be signigicant difference? Latest rumours have predicted mid June launch for both of them.