ATI 4xxx Series Thread

[Rusin]

Originally posted by: taltamir


exactly, and we also know it is their biggest chip in a long time, which also means it will be louder and hotter and more power hungry.

But at the end of the day, you pick the gun with the max amount of damage (sorry, just finished Mass Effect )

Sorry..didn't notice that you were being sarcastic

 

[Bateluer]

Originally posted by: AshPhoenix
Radeon 4850 scores 5K in 3Dmark Vantage

Computex 08: On a Phenom system

A Radeon HD 4850 card on a Phenom 9850 system clocked at 2.5GHz can score slightly over 5000 in 3Dmark Vantage.

We had a chance to see the card, but we were asked not to take pictures of them; but we managed to see the score and touch the card.

Radeon HD 4850, aka RV770PRO card, is a single slot card with single 6-pin power connector that looks incredibly similar to Radeon 3850.

We had a chance to touch the back of the card and we can tell you that it feels quite hot, but at the same time runs stable.

The card is real and it works well, at least with this benchmark, but we still don?t know how it actually runs other games.

I'm not too familiar with 3Dmark Vantage because its free version is one time use only, how does a score of 5000 stack up?

 

[Nemesis 1]

This is a little off topic . But because NV keeps insisting the cpu chipset have little importance in games . I thought I would show what just a chipset can do .

http://www.pcinpact.com/a-332-5-P45_Intel.htm Nice gains very nice.

 

[Klinky1984]

Originally posted by: Bateluer
I'm not too familiar with 3Dmark Vantage because its free version is one time use only, how does a score of 5000 stack up?

Check http://forums.anandtech.com/me...=2182221&enterthread=y out. Seems like a bad benchmark to go off of.

Someones 8800GTS got 5400, so hopefully the benchmark is wrong .

 

[Rusin]

How much did Nvidia's scores change? Would that proof anything else than that HD3850 desperately would need PCIe 2.0 board? Since HD3870 loses against 9600 GT on PCIe 2.0 board then buying ATi HD3850 and HD3870 cards for PCIe 1.1 board would be even more pointless ..

 

[taltamir]

Originally posted by: Nemesis 1
This is a little off topic . But because NV keeps insisting the cpu chipset have little importance in games . I thought I would show what just a chipset can do .

http://www.pcinpact.com/a-332-5-P45_Intel.htm Nice gains very nice.

notice the only noticeable change was in crossfire. The difference between a single card was negligible. And that is probably because the bandwidth available to each individual card remains/is higher with the P45 then with the P35.

A P35 can either do a 16x + 4x PCIe 1.1 configuration. OR if they put in a splitter chip (an extra cost) it can do two 8x PCIe 1.1 (or it can do a single card at 16x).

What happens in that comparison is that the single cards are all on 16x PCIe... but they go down a lot on the P35 on crossfire.

http://www.bit-tech.net/hardwa...intel_x38_versus_p35/2

Anyways, the article shows a ton of anomolous results, even when using the same chipset, they attribute it to bios. (and since firmware is just software dedicated to a piece of hardware, then that means different software from different mobos)

 

[Nemesis 1]

Originally posted by: Klinky1984

Originally posted by: Bateluer
I'm not too familiar with 3Dmark Vantage because its free version is one time use only, how does a score of 5000 stack up?

Check http://forums.anandtech.com/me...=2182221&enterthread=y out. Seems like a bad benchmark to go off of.

Someones 8800GTS got 5400, so hopefully the benchmark is wrong .

Well sure it does it requires Vista SP1. So your goingto get alot of people saying this and that its normal . But its the benchmark for this time . Period.

3dmark agvantage

9800gtx 5442 =35
5471=45

Xfire 5181=35
5596=45

Crysis
GTX=48.55
GTX=48.70

Xfire 20.42 = 35
36.38= 45

Now weather Advantage is good bad or ugly doesn't mean shit. The improvements from 35 chipset to 45 chipset in Xfire is pretty dam good. Thats all this is showing nothing more nothing less.

Since I use Intel ATI exclusively I really don't care what NV does . They can build whatever means nothing to me unless its all that . To be honest since the R700 was released I haven't seen anything exciting from NV or ATI . Small very small improvements from 1 gen to the next. Just throwing $$ away.

Of course its the PCI-2 . That is included with the 45 chipset. None the less . it looks to me you can upgrade to the 45chipset if running Xfire/sli .
Also if you buy a 290 nv. the 45chipset will be a must have or x38/48. So if you have a 35 chipset and you buy NV 280 or 4870x2 . You will need to upgrade your chipst. The numbers don't lie.

 

[Rusin]

Still that only proves that there is something wrong with ATi performance with PCIe 1 boards. R700 haven't been released yet.

 

[Janooo]

4850 for 156 Euro.

 

[manko]

AMD delays Radeon 4850 launch to June 23

In the latest round of rumors from Computex 2008, we learned that AMD managed to upset the majority of its partners by delaying the Radeon 4850 512MB GDDR3, code-named Makedon.

However, add-in-board companies have the cards available right now or can receive them within 24 hours of time. Given the current market climate, some companies believe AMD should have launched the cards at Computex.

We were told that there are ?tens of thousands of boards just sitting there? and AMD?s partners are not too thrilled.

The GDDR5 equipped 4870 will now launch at the same time as the 4850 512MB GDDR3, but it is unclear whether there are enough GDDR5 chips to enable AMD to ship the 4870 in volume right off the bat.

 

[Nemesis 1]

Originally posted by: Rusin
Still that only proves that there is something wrong with ATi performance with PCIe 1 boards. R700 haven't been released yet.

Its been so long what was the ATI gpu that knocked the 4200nv all to hell. I thought the 700 pro. . It proves this . My friend . If you buy a NV 280 or ATI 4870 and have a 35 chipset this upgrade is going to be expensive. IF you have to upgrade your M/B . If u don't the bench shows your throughing your $$ away.
People should be aware of this . same with sli /xfire. 35 chipset sucks for these.

 

[Wreckem]

Originally posted by: Nemesis 1

Originally posted by: Rusin
Still that only proves that there is something wrong with ATi performance with PCIe 1 boards. R700 haven't been released yet.

Its been so long what was the ATI gpu that knocked the 4200nv all to hell. I thought the 700 pro. . It proves this . My friend . If you buy a NV 280 or ATI 4870 and have a 35 chipset this upgrade is going to be expensive. IF you have to upgrade your M/B . If u don't the bench shows your throughing your $$ away.
People should be aware of this . same with sli /xfire. 35 chipset sucks for these.

Uh, you act like this is new information. Its not, and it has nothing to really do with PCI-e 2.0 being on the P45 chipset. It has everything to do with 8x & 8x for crossfire on P35, instead of 16x and 16x. The only real issue on ATI cards and crippled cross fire on the P35 platform which has been known since P35 came out.

I dont know why you bash Nvidia.

 

[dv8silencer]

Originally posted by: manko
AMD delays Radeon 4850 launch to June 23

In the latest round of rumors from Computex 2008, we learned that AMD managed to upset the majority of its partners by delaying the Radeon 4850 512MB GDDR3, code-named Makedon.

However, add-in-board companies have the cards available right now or can receive them within 24 hours of time. Given the current market climate, some companies believe AMD should have launched the cards at Computex.

We were told that there are ?tens of thousands of boards just sitting there? and AMD?s partners are not too thrilled.

The GDDR5 equipped 4870 will now launch at the same time as the 4850 512MB GDDR3, but it is unclear whether there are enough GDDR5 chips to enable AMD to ship the 4870 in volume right off the bat.

Interesting

 

[nonameo]

Originally posted by: dv8silencer

Originally posted by: manko
AMD delays Radeon 4850 launch to June 23

In the latest round of rumors from Computex 2008, we learned that AMD managed to upset the majority of its partners by delaying the Radeon 4850 512MB GDDR3, code-named Makedon.

However, add-in-board companies have the cards available right now or can receive them within 24 hours of time. Given the current market climate, some companies believe AMD should have launched the cards at Computex.

We were told that there are ?tens of thousands of boards just sitting there? and AMD?s partners are not too thrilled.

The GDDR5 equipped 4870 will now launch at the same time as the 4850 512MB GDDR3, but it is unclear whether there are enough GDDR5 chips to enable AMD to ship the 4870 in volume right off the bat.

Interesting

I think they are waiting because they don't want the 4850 to cannibalize sales of the 4870.

 

[SlowSpyder]

I didn't see this posted yet, so here it is. Fudzilla has a video of a tech demo, nothing to get excited about, but it looks like what is being rendered is pretty nice.

http://www.fudzilla.com/index....=view&id=7707&Itemid=1

 

[Rusin]

Originally posted by: nonameo

I think they are waiting because they don't want the 4850 to cannibalize sales of the 4870.

Well since those HD4870 cards will flood the markets at August..HD4850 will still cannibalize HD4870..

 

[nonameo]

Originally posted by: Rusin

Originally posted by: nonameo

I think they are waiting because they don't want the 4850 to cannibalize sales of the 4870.

Well since those HD4870 cards will flood the markets at August..HD4850 will still cannibalize HD4870..

Yeah, but if they wait too long NV will pick up the sales.

 

[Bateluer]

Originally posted by: Rusin

Originally posted by: nonameo

I think they are waiting because they don't want the 4850 to cannibalize sales of the 4870.

Well since those HD4870 cards will flood the markets at August..HD4850 will still cannibalize HD4870..

Wait, when did the 4870 get pushed back to August? I'm still hearing end of June for both the 4870 and now the 4850 as well.

They would be wise to get these cards on the market soon to beat Nvidia's GT200 lineup. We already know they won't out perform Nvidia's high end, but if someone buys a 4850 or 4870 in June, most people aren't going to run out and buy a GTX 280 or 260 a month later.

 

[chewietobbacca]

They pushed the 4850 to June 23 to release w/ the 4870 so its not a big deal

BTW that street rendering is amazing! Looks life-like!

 

[taltamir]

Originally posted by: Nemesis 1

Originally posted by: Klinky1984

Originally posted by: Bateluer
I'm not too familiar with 3Dmark Vantage because its free version is one time use only, how does a score of 5000 stack up?

Check http://forums.anandtech.com/me...=2182221&enterthread=y out. Seems like a bad benchmark to go off of.

Someones 8800GTS got 5400, so hopefully the benchmark is wrong .

Well sure it does it requires Vista SP1. So your goingto get alot of people saying this and that its normal . But its the benchmark for this time . Period.

3dmark agvantage

9800gtx 5442 =35
5471=45

Xfire 5181=35
5596=45

Crysis
GTX=48.55
GTX=48.70

Xfire 20.42 = 35
36.38= 45

Now weather Advantage is good bad or ugly doesn't mean shit. The improvements from 35 chipset to 45 chipset in Xfire is pretty dam good. Thats all this is showing nothing more nothing less.

Since I use Intel ATI exclusively I really don't care what NV does . They can build whatever means nothing to me unless its all that . To be honest since the R700 was released I haven't seen anything exciting from NV or ATI . Small very small improvements from 1 gen to the next. Just throwing $$ away.

Of course its the PCI-2 . That is included with the 45 chipset. None the less . it looks to me you can upgrade to the 45chipset if running Xfire/sli .
Also if you buy a 290 nv. the 45chipset will be a must have or x38/48. So if you have a 35 chipset and you buy NV 280 or 4870x2 . You will need to upgrade your chipst. The numbers don't lie.

because the P35 uses a 16x + 4x PCIe v1 setup... if the mobo maker opted for a 3rd party PCI splitter they can split the 16x into two 8x v1 lanes. Which is still better then an unbalanced setup.
So yes, there will be great improvement in crossfire. But the single card scores are identical (since single card will run at 16x on a P35 and the P45)

 

[Wreckem]

Originally posted by: Bateluer

Originally posted by: Rusin

Originally posted by: nonameo

I think they are waiting because they don't want the 4850 to cannibalize sales of the 4870.

Well since those HD4870 cards will flood the markets at August..HD4850 will still cannibalize HD4870..

Wait, when did the 4870 get pushed back to August? I'm still hearing end of June for both the 4870 and now the 4850 as well.

They would be wise to get these cards on the market soon to beat Nvidia's GT200 lineup. We already know they won't out perform Nvidia's high end, but if someone buys a 4850 or 4870 in June, most people aren't going to run out and buy a GTX 280 or 260 a month later.

ATI wont be shipping the 4870 in volume until late July. GDDR5 is in limited supply right now.

 

[Bateluer]

Originally posted by: Wreckem

Originally posted by: Bateluer

Originally posted by: Rusin

Originally posted by: nonameo

I think they are waiting because they don't want the 4850 to cannibalize sales of the 4870.

Well since those HD4870 cards will flood the markets at August..HD4850 will still cannibalize HD4870..

Wait, when did the 4870 get pushed back to August? I'm still hearing end of June for both the 4870 and now the 4850 as well.

They would be wise to get these cards on the market soon to beat Nvidia's GT200 lineup. We already know they won't out perform Nvidia's high end, but if someone buys a 4850 or 4870 in June, most people aren't going to run out and buy a GTX 280 or 260 a month later.

ATI wont be shipping the 4870 in volume until late July. GDDR5 is in limited supply right now.

But it will be available in some quantities at the end of June?

 

[gigahertz20]

AMD Delays Radeon 4800 Launch To June 23

http://www.tomshardware.com/ne...eon-computex,5587.html


Two updated dates for your calendar are: June 17: Nvidia launches GeForce GTX 200 series. June 23: AMD launches Radeon 4800 series.

 

[Drayvn]

Well if AMD/ATI are pushing back the date to coincide with another product instead of pushing forward the date, does that mean that AMD/ATI know something we don't, like possibly they know they probably won't beat NV at the performance area, but definitly will beat them in the performance/price area?

 

[semisonic9]

Yeah. I'm really surprised by the delay, to be honest.

I saw them coming out with their chips a month or so earlier than NVs as a pretty good chance to pick up some market share. My only guess is that, since they figurer the NV faithfull are probably locked in by upgrade-programs and mobo choices, they said "eff it" and decided to just tie NV in release times and stock up on DDR5.

Doesn't really make a lot of sense to me, but then, the heads of ATI do seem to be lacking that "killer instinct" that they could really use, at this point.

~Semi