Atom X3/X5/X7 Windows device discussion thread

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Kaido

Elite Member & Kitchen Overlord
Feb 14, 2004
48,518
5,340
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Very cool. I'm eager to hear your thoughts on it.

You know, for a long time Toshiba was on my banned list. Had issues with everything they ever made. Then they came out with the cheap Celeron laptops that were pretty decent in the $249 range, then the 4K laptops that start at around a grand & have awesome specs, and now the Click 10. I have a dozen or two of the cheapo 15.6" laptops & they are just great for their intended purpose, no issues. Haven't gotten ahold of any 4K models yet, but the specs vs. price look amazing & they look extremely nice in the Youtube video reviews. So the click may be a good little machine for a lot of purposes, especially for $350-ish.
 

TeknoBug

Platinum Member
Oct 2, 2013
2,084
31
91
That Click10 looks interesting, wonder if they'll ever have a X7 Z8700 version? Or should I still wait for Surface 3 price to plummet.

PS- I'm reading that the X5 Z8300 has single channel memory while the Z8500 and Z8700 has dual channel memory, might be a deal breaker.

It does perform pretty good while gaming; however, the thermal throttling is real, and it does limit full performance. I also posted some gaming videos on the S3, just check the link above.
Yeah I've done some researching, I said light games not games like Diablo 3, Skyrim, Shadow of Mordor, or Thief. PES 205 and Civ V are playable on my Z3740 8" tablet although screen is pretty small (no HDMI out)... I have Trines 2, haven't tried that one on the tablet yet and I also have Ultimate Generals Gettysburg which is the perfect tablet game. Cities Skyline is OK, struggles framerate wise and runs in a borderless window (doesn't have fullscreen option).
 
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Kaido

Elite Member & Kitchen Overlord
Feb 14, 2004
48,518
5,340
136
Click10 quick review:

1. Looks & feels an awful lot like a 10" netbook. Like they recycled the keyboard & stuff. T100 has a better keyboard imo. It's not terrible but the keys do feel kind of thin & cheap. The machine itself OTOH is surprisingly sturdy for the price, feels very good.

2. Right off the bat, hinge tilt is annoying. It feels like barely tilts past 90 degrees (85 degrees according to the website). If I am sitting at a comfortable typing/viewing distance, it feels like I'm looking almost straight down, like I'm in the first row of a movie theater. Rolling my chair back to proper screen vs. angle viewing distance, the text gets too small & I'm too far away to really use it. It's hard to see how much it doesn't lean back in the video, but this review has some angle shots:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xnf0aUi7C1A

Like, this picture is really misleading because it seems to angle back further than it does IRL. Unless I'm just not tilting it properly (I don't want to break it), this is going to be a big annoyance to people who want to use this a lot as a laptop. In tablet mode, no problem, but as a laptop...I really wish it had double the degrees of tilt:

http://www.tabletblog.de/wp-content/uploads/2015/09/toshiba-satellite-click-10-hands-on.jpg

3. Having an HD screen this size is nice. The one thing I hated about netbooks was the standard 1024x600 resolution. The screen is bright, clear, and a good resolution for the size. I am not disappointed by the brightness either, which is great, because a lot of times the devices can be a bit dim. I'm in a well-lit room & the screen is very good.

4. Feels just like an iPad when I detach it. Very nice design. Feels good in the hands. Touchscreen is very responsive, doesn't feel a tad laggy like the T100 did. I have yet another defective T100 on my desk I'm comparing it to. The hinge is really easy to latch & unlatch to pop the screen off, zero usability issues there. It does have some bounce when docked, but nothing horrible like some of the other models I've used that are super flimsy back & forth while typing. It's hard to believe an entire good computer is inside just the screen when you're holding it...silent, cool to the touch, not heavy, good design.

5. The charger is surprisingly large. Palm-sized & over an inch thick, sort of a mini wall-wart. Has a Micro USB charging plug, which I don't like, but it is reinforced & has fairly thick plastic around the plug, so at least it doesn't feel like it's going to break on day one. I've had bad experiences with all of the micro USB plugs falling apart, bending, and breaking over time, but it is pretty cool that it can charge off just a USB connector.

6. Separately from the device, Windows 10 is actually pretty nice. It's not terrible on a desktop, but in conjunction with a touchscreen, it actually works really well. I've found myself using both the keyboard & screen for different commands & functions, depending on where my hands are, especially due to the smaller 10" screen size - it's very accessible as a touchscreen device. There is a tiny bit of lag, like when doing searches in the Start Menu, but nothing killer. It's quite zippy overall.

TL;DR: Really neat machine for the price. Hinge issue is driving me bananas (next to zero screen tilt). Windows 10 is great with a touchscreen.
 

TeknoBug

Platinum Member
Oct 2, 2013
2,084
31
91
That Click10 review looks a bit disappionting, anyways I already have an eye on an Acer Switch 11 which has an i3 4012Y CPU, somewhat better than the Cherry Trail and costs the same as the Surface 3 Z8700.
 

Kaido

Elite Member & Kitchen Overlord
Feb 14, 2004
48,518
5,340
136
Really interesting newcomer, Kangaroo PC:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16883722001

Includes the "dock", which has an HDMI port & a pair of USB ports. $99 with a battery that lasts 4 hours of 'casual use'. Pretty awesome...a full, fanless computer for under a hundred bucks that has a built-in UPS! This would also be neat for outdoor movie parties with a projector. I have one on backorder, so I'll see how it goes when it arrives. Comes with Windows 10. This would be awesome to slap on a TV or replace a mom/grandma-puter with. I think the only catch is that the onboard audio is digital only (via HDMI), so if you want analog audio, you'll need a USB adapter. I typically use this $8 model: (commentors say it does work with Windows 10)

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16812186035

Anyway, $99 is pretty insane for a decently usable computer - Atom X5, 2 gigs of RAM, 32gb SSD, HDMI, USB, etc. PLUS battery. Definitely interested to see how it pans out IRL!
 

Kaido

Elite Member & Kitchen Overlord
Feb 14, 2004
48,518
5,340
136
One of the things I'm holding out for is the X7 lineup, which is currently only available on the Surface. Telcast has a neat dual-boot up for pre-order:

http://liliputing.com/2015/11/teclast-x16-dual-os-tablet-has-8gb-ram-atom-x7-cpu.html

* $425
* 11.6" 1080p screen
* Atom X7
* 8GB RAM
* 64gb SSD
* Dual-boot (Windows 10 + Android 5.1)
* Also: 802.11n, Bluetooth 4.0, MicroSD (up to 64gb), 5mp rear camera, 2mp front camera, USB 3.0 port, Micro USB port, Micro HDMI port, headset jack, docking connector for keyboard, optional pen

The other thing I'm holding out for is a 64-gig model on the desktop boxes. 32 gigs is just really rough to live in. I've got a Baytrail MINIX on my workebench right now...17.7 gigs free out of 24.7 gigs after updating to 8.1, and down to 17.1 gigs after upgrading to 8.1 Pro. I'll see how it fares with Windows 10 & Office 2013! Anyway, I heard MINIX will have a 64-gig model out in the future, so I'll keep my eye out for that. I have a Tronsmart X5 on the way for my testbench as well, so at least I can play with the X5 for now. Curious to see how much of an improvement the X7 & integrated GPU is.
 

DaveSimmons

Elite Member
Aug 12, 2001
40,730
670
126
Really interesting newcomer, Kangaroo PC:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16883722001

Includes the "dock", which has an HDMI port & a pair of USB ports. $99 with a battery that lasts 4 hours of 'casual use'. Pretty awesome...a full, fanless computer for under a hundred bucks that has a built-in UPS! This would also be neat for outdoor movie parties with a projector. I have one on backorder, so I'll see how it goes when it arrives. Comes with Windows 10. This would be awesome to slap on a TV or replace a mom/grandma-puter with. I think the only catch is that the onboard audio is digital only (via HDMI), so if you want analog audio, you'll need a USB adapter. I typically use this $8 model: (commentors say it does work with Windows 10)

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16812186035

Anyway, $99 is pretty insane for a decently usable computer - Atom X5, 2 gigs of RAM, 32gb SSD, HDMI, USB, etc. PLUS battery. Definitely interested to see how it pans out IRL!

Very nice on paper. Please do post about it once it arrives. Hopefully it doesn't throttle badly after a few minutes of HTPC use or light gaming (something like Torchlight 1).
 

Kaido

Elite Member & Kitchen Overlord
Feb 14, 2004
48,518
5,340
136
The other thing I'm holding out for is a 64-gig model on the desktop boxes. 32 gigs is just really rough to live in. I've got a Baytrail MINIX on my workebench right now...17.7 gigs free out of 24.7 gigs after updating to 8.1, and down to 17.1 gigs after upgrading to 8.1 Pro. I'll see how it fares with Windows 10 & Office 2013!

Just for FYI - on the Baytrail MINIX, I was able to do a free Win10 upgrade via MCT: (not all my units had the Windows 10 upgrade icon available immediately after running 8.1 updates)

http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/software-download/windows10

I also upgraded the MINIX to 8.1 Pro, which translated over to free Windows 10 Pro successfully. Oddly enough, after a clean install with Windows 10 & updates (no user files kept), it says 17.5 gigs free out of 28.8 gigs (versus 17.1 gigs free out of 24.7 gigs available under 8.1 Pro). With Office 2013 & updates, I get 15.6 gigs free out of 28.8 available. So it went:

17.7 out of 24.7 (8.1 with updates)
17.1 out of 24.7 (8.1 Pro with updates = adds 600 megs)
17.5 out of 28.8 (10 Pro with updates = views size differently)
15.6 out of 28.8 (10 Pro with Office 2013 & all updates = adds 1.9 gigs)

There's apparently some interesting things going on with Windows 10 storage:

http://www.theverge.com/2015/3/16/8226797/windows-10-storage-space-increases

15 gigs is decently usable for a small office machine where most stuff is stored on the network. Otherwise just use a big USB stick (128 gigs go on sale for $29 these days) or a 2TB bus-powered drive ($89) if you need a lot of local storage.
 

Kaido

Elite Member & Kitchen Overlord
Feb 14, 2004
48,518
5,340
136
Very nice on paper. Please do post about it once it arrives. Hopefully it doesn't throttle badly after a few minutes of HTPC use or light gaming (something like Torchlight 1).

Yeah, I'm anxious to test out some Atom X5 stuff in-person because the fanless Baytrail MINIX has been excellent, but my other Baytrail stuff has not (the HDMI sticks throttle bad & a lot of the other ones get pretty hot and toasty and some aren't sealed - I like the sealed aspect of the MINIX). So I'm definitely curious about the newer Atoms. Really hoping to see an X7 with a 64-gig SSD available soon, so many neat applications for those. And those HP Stream Minis are working well too, which is nice - I have several running dual monitor with a bit more RAM & extra SSD space and they are doing pretty well.

I've put out maybe 20 or 30 MINIX boxes at this point with no issues, which is awesome. The one I'm working on today will be a very lightweight desktop (upgraded to Windows 10 Pro to join a domain & added Office 2013 for basic email & docs) with just a single monitor & whatnot, so that's pretty slick ($160 MINIX + $100 8.1 Pro + $190 Office 2013 for Business = $450 for a fanless, sealed mini PC ready to party on a business network). The great thing is, I can just keep spares handy (pre-updated) and if one does fry or get a virus or whatever, it's an effortless switch...takes more time to setup their profile again than to do the hardware swapout, haha!
 

Face2Face

Diamond Member
Jun 6, 2001
4,100
215
106
I apologize if this has already been posted, but it looks like Intel is revamping their ATOM line.

http://liliputing.com/2015/11/intels-new-cherry-trail-chips-are-a-little-faster.html

x5-Z8300: 1.44 GHz chip with 1.84 GHz burst and Intel HD 400 graphics
x5-Z8350: 1.44 GHz chip with 1.92 GHz burst and Intel HD 400 graphics
x5-Z8500: 1.44 GHz chip with 2.24 GHz burst and Intel HD 400 graphics
x5-Z8550: 1.44 GHz chip with 2.4 GHz burst and Intel HD 400 graphics
x7-Z8700: 1.6 GHz chip with 2.4 GHz burst and Intel HD 405 graphics
x7-Z8750: 1.6 GHz chip with 2.56 GHz burst and Intel HD 405 graphics
 

Kaido

Elite Member & Kitchen Overlord
Feb 14, 2004
48,518
5,340
136
I apologize if this has already been posted, but it looks like Intel is revamping their ATOM line.

http://liliputing.com/2015/11/intels-new-cherry-trail-chips-are-a-little-faster.html

x5-Z8300: 1.44 GHz chip with 1.84 GHz burst and Intel HD 400 graphics
x5-Z8350: 1.44 GHz chip with 1.92 GHz burst and Intel HD 400 graphics
x5-Z8500: 1.44 GHz chip with 2.24 GHz burst and Intel HD 400 graphics
x5-Z8550: 1.44 GHz chip with 2.4 GHz burst and Intel HD 400 graphics
x7-Z8700: 1.6 GHz chip with 2.4 GHz burst and Intel HD 405 graphics
x7-Z8750: 1.6 GHz chip with 2.56 GHz burst and Intel HD 405 graphics

Wow that's weird...we don't even have the first-gen X7 stuff readily available yet (outside of the new Surface).
 

Kaido

Elite Member & Kitchen Overlord
Feb 14, 2004
48,518
5,340
136
Final production must have been better than expected.

I've been reading that a lot of the first-gen stuff suffers from overheating, possibly due to faulty manufacturer design. I know that is the case for some of the Baytrail-T desktops...some are great (good cooling system) & some are terrible (get REALLY hot).
 

jaydee

Diamond Member
May 6, 2000
4,500
3
81
Really interesting newcomer, Kangaroo PC:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16883722001

Includes the "dock", which has an HDMI port & a pair of USB ports. $99 with a battery that lasts 4 hours of 'casual use'. Pretty awesome...a full, fanless computer for under a hundred bucks that has a built-in UPS! This would also be neat for outdoor movie parties with a projector. I have one on backorder, so I'll see how it goes when it arrives. Comes with Windows 10. This would be awesome to slap on a TV or replace a mom/grandma-puter with. I think the only catch is that the onboard audio is digital only (via HDMI), so if you want analog audio, you'll need a USB adapter. I typically use this $8 model: (commentors say it does work with Windows 10)

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16812186035

Anyway, $99 is pretty insane for a decently usable computer - Atom X5, 2 gigs of RAM, 32gb SSD, HDMI, USB, etc. PLUS battery. Definitely interested to see how it pans out IRL!

My co-worker has one of these. It's pretty slick. Good build quality, Windows 10 runs ok, as long as you don't ask much from it, but geez, for $99. I might get one and slap Linux on it...
 

Kaido

Elite Member & Kitchen Overlord
Feb 14, 2004
48,518
5,340
136
My co-worker has one of these. It's pretty slick. Good build quality, Windows 10 runs ok, as long as you don't ask much from it, but geez, for $99. I might get one and slap Linux on it...

I'm still waiting for my Kangaroo, but I got the Tronsmart X5 in. A bit bigger than the MINIX Z64 & has some vents on the bottom, so it's not totally sealed like the MINIX. It came already booted up to Win10 (had some test files in the recent documents linked to what was probably a USB drive), so I'm restoring it now, excited to play with it! Only weird thing so far is the box stunk. Not to get overly graphic, but...stale farts I don't know if it was outgassing from cheap plastic wrapping inside or what haha.
 

Kaido

Elite Member & Kitchen Overlord
Feb 14, 2004
48,518
5,340
136
Tried to do a restore on the Tronsmart X5, borked it. Just looping at the boot logo now, not looking good! It was weird that it was already booted into Windows with an account; you would think that they would reset it after doing testing so it's a "fresh" install for you to setup...
 

sm625

Diamond Member
May 6, 2011
8,172
137
106
Whoa, that could be perfect for a mom / grandma PC.

Not if it is slower than grandma's 7 year old penryn PC. The problem with this atom garbage is that it is slower than the warehouses upon warehouses full of perfectly functional used Core 2 systems just waiting to be bought for under $100.
 

Kaido

Elite Member & Kitchen Overlord
Feb 14, 2004
48,518
5,340
136
Not if it is slower than grandma's 7 year old penryn PC. The problem with this atom garbage is that it is slower than the warehouses upon warehouses full of perfectly functional used Core 2 systems just waiting to be bought for under $100.

Sort of...

1. The Atom-based systems boot a ton faster because they have built-in SSD chips, as well as launch programs faster. So +$75 for an SSD in the C2D system.

2. The graphics, while not high-end, are modern & designed to play stuff like 1080p Youtube, which is something a lot of older computers struggle with, especially those without dedicated GPU's. So at least +$30 for a semi-decent PCI/e/AGP GPU in a C2D system.

3. Power & size issue too - they typically use something like 11 watts, vs. 300+ watts in your average PC tower. And also tiny. Only catch is not as many ports & no built-in optical drive ($29 for a USB-powered version).

But the C2D system is a lot more expandable, so there's that, and I'd imagine the chips are still zippier than the Atoms. But the Atoms are making pretty good headway...I have one customer who has switched out entirely to using them, along with a few BRIX for people who needed dual or triple monitors.
 

Kaido

Elite Member & Kitchen Overlord
Feb 14, 2004
48,518
5,340
136
Re: Ara X5

Recap: Bought it, oddly came with a user account already setup, did a Windows factory reset so I could go through the initial account setup process myself, and it borked. Poked around on their website, discovered they have a forum:

http://forum.tronsmart.com/forum/tronsmart-ara-x5

Turns out it's BIOS-activated, so all you have to do is the Windows 10 Media Creation Tool & an 8GB+ USB stick to copy over the 64-bit Win10 installer:

https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/software-download/windows10

Drivers & BIOS update (with instructions) available here:

http://www.tronsmart.com/?p=4200

You can boot into BIOS by hitting ESC & then set the USB stick to be the first boot driver. Just finished installing 64b Win10, running updates now, then drivers & BIOS. Only catch I've read in the reviews is that the internal SSD is pretty slow: (like HDD-slow...90 MB/s...)

http://www.cnx-software.com/2015/08...dows-10-mini-pc-with-intel-atom-x5-processor/
 

Kaido

Elite Member & Kitchen Overlord
Feb 14, 2004
48,518
5,340
136
Thanks! Do you have the Kangaroo yet? Newegg lists it as in stock now.

Yes, it's pretty neat! Wish it had built-in Ethernet, but with USB 3.0 you can get decent speeds out of an adapter. I don't understand the purpose of the "dock" (it comes off easily), but if they come out with a desktop dock that has more USB ports & an Ethernet port, I'll be happy & having dock options will make more sense. Graphics are mediocre...Minecraft on Fast Graphics still stutters at 1080p. Battery works well, it's like having a built-in UPS, which is neat. Nice that it comes with a fully-licensed version of Windows 10. It's basically the size of a Galaxy Note phone, extremely compact.

It does seem a bit slow. Like slower than my Baytrail-T stuff like the MINIX. I haven't done a speed test, but if it's anything like the Tronsmart X5, then it's got a slow SSD built-in, which helps to explain the $99 price. I would definitely pay more for an X7 with a faster & larger 64-gig SSD and 4 gigs of RAM...that would be a very usable machine imo. Not sure how the graphics would stack up...would love to get one for home for a cheap Minecraft box:

http://www.notebookcheck.net/Intel-HD-Graphics-Cherry-Trail-Benchmarks.140902.0.html

Personally, I am holding out for an X7 desktop for home. Although based on performance reviews, I may just go with an MSI Cubi instead:

http://www.notebookcheck.net/Intel-Core-i7-5500U-Notebook-Processor.127806.0.html

On the i7 version, it has 5500 graphics (24 EU's @ 300-950Mhz), which is a pretty big jump over even the X7's graphics. Really I just want a tiny box to throw some emulators, Minecraft, and other family-friendly stuff on the TV without having to have a whole gaming rig plugged in.
 
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