Attention Canon Printer Owners

[batmanuel]

Originally posted by: Macro2
RE:"I'm actually partial to the HP 50 and 90 series cartridges, mainly because the yield is decent (around 500 page or so for a 56 black cart that costs me at most $20 - usually lower when I find a deal)"

The same with a Canon costs me about 50 C E N T S.

Yeah, I noticed USA Brand inks are way cheaper on their Canon and Epson refills than HP/Lexmark. Oddly enough, the USA Brand refills for the HP 56 are $17.50 - which is actually more expensive than getting an OEM HP cart from CostCo ($45 for a three pack at the Aurora Village warehouse in North Seattle, last time I bought some). With prices that low for refills, I definitely see why the Canon printers are so popular around these boards (that, and the excellent photo quality).

I wonder how this is affecting the bottom line for Canon's inkjet division, though? They are selling a crapload of cheap printers at a loss, but then losing the replacement cart sales to places like Tylermartin.com while their competitors are not being affected as much because there is not as much of a price differential between their OEM carts and the remanufactured ones. I kind of like the Canon products, so I hope this kind of thing doesn't hurt them in the long run.

 

[T2urtle]

Originally posted by: Zepper
Canon, Epson and some high-end HP units use ink tanks. All other carts have an integrated print head (Lexmark, most HP). Canon = lowest cost ink + lowest cost to replace print head + high output quality = the inkjet printer for most people...
.bh.

:moon:

so your saying no matter which canon printer i get. the ink pack wont have a head in it. and it will be in the areas for 5-8$ each? Or possibly even cheaper?

 

[Macro2]

RE:"Yeah, I noticed USA Brand inks are way cheaper on their Canon and Epson refills than HP/Lexmark. Oddly enough, the USA Brand refills for the HP 56 are $17.50"


That's because the HP and Lexmark carts include a printhead. This not easily cloned so all HP and Lexmark carts are either brand new or refilled/remanufactured carts originally made by HP or Lexmark. This is hit or miss by itself.

Canon carts are all plastic as the printhead is seperate and stays in the machine. They have been duplicated by a second party. So the USA-Nectron-rainbow brand carts you get cheap are new...not just refilled old Canon carts. I've refilled the knock off carts as well as the original canon carts in excess of 100 times per cart.

Another great thing about Canon carts is that the 3 and 6 series are clear so you can see how much ink you have. Also they use a mirror to measure how full they are and require no chip adjustment to reset the softwares gauge like the HPs and Epsons.

HP will tell you its low when you have as much as 40% of the ink left in the cart. So you get ripped by buying a new cart (ouch) too early.

As for Canons profits...they do get a little more for their printers and still make a ton on their ink carts. No printhead...Costs them pennies.

If you look a the corporate profits for HP the ONLY things that make a good profit on is Ink and toners...that's for the whole corporation. That ought to tell you something.

 

[Kwad Guy]

All you laser printer gurus:

What's the story on 3rd party replacement toner kits? Are the differences between OEM toner and 3rd party toner for laser printers as large as for inks with inkjets?

The price of the replacement toner kits are about 1/3 the price of buying new toner cartridges (I'm looking at the toner cartridges for the Minolta 2300W).

Kwad

 

[MDE]

Another reason for the insane prices on ink is that printer manufacturers sell the printers dirt cheap and then make money off of the consumables (ink, photo paper, etc.). Some people just don't realize that these companies need to make money somehow and the easiest way is to lure you in with cheap hardware and bleed you dry with expensive ink.

 

[0roo0roo]

well and plus that is the only way you can garrantee perfect photo prints. to use the combo of their inks+paper. and only way u know it will last for any period before fading.

 

[ronnn]

Originally posted by: SickBeast

Originally posted by: episodic
I print a ton - the standard canon cartridges would eat me up. I know about places that sale them as cheap as 4 dollars for a black cartridge. Looking for a cheap one that has been proven to be a quality choice.

Go to Costco and buy a refill kit. Mine was $23CDN and has lasted me for countless refills. If you know what you're doing you'll be fine. The Canon cartridges are very easily refilled.

Does this ink at costco have a name. I need to get my brother to buy it and if there is a choice he will get the wrong one.

 

[wseyller]

Macro2 quote: That's because the HP and Lexmark carts include a printhead. This not easily cloned so all HP and Lexmark carts are either brand new or refilled/remanufactured carts originally made by HP or Lexmark. This is hit or miss by itself.

Aftermarket companies have the ability to produce new HP empties. They are not in the market because of they are waiting on the patents to expire.







Kwad Guy quote: All you laser printer gurus:

What's the story on 3rd party replacement toner kits? Are the differences between OEM toner and 3rd party toner for laser printers as large as for inks with inkjets?

The price of the replacement toner kits are about 1/3 the price of buying new toner cartridges (I'm looking at the toner cartridges for the Minolta 2300W).

Kwad

Let's see if I can explain this without writing a book. You have remanufacters that do it right. They typical are certified in standardized testing produces that include ASTM F 1856 (Toner Usage) and ASTM F 2036 (Density and Background). As long as they follow these testing procedures correctly they should be able to consistantly produce quality cartridges with low percentage of defects. Then you have Drill & Fill people. Some are actual companies that remanufacter. Some are consumers that refill toner cartridges theirselves. This means that they drill a hole in the cartridge, and fill the toner hopper with God knows what toner. The problem with that is you have many other important components in a laser cartridge. This includes an OPC drum that has photosensitive properties. This drum wears due to friction from toner, wiperblade and paper. A primary charge roller (PCR) that charges the drums wears. A magnetic roller that its coating wears. Once these components wear you introduce many many possible problems. A good toner remanufacter normally will replace all components with new or they will renew used components. Even if you were able to get all new components it doesn't mean its going to work though. Components have to be compatible with each other. Toner has to be compatible with the magnetic roller. You have to pick out a drum that doesn't run to hot or cold which effects density. This is the reasoning for the standardized test procedures. This allows us to see how components work together. This allows us to finds components that give us the density and yield that we want and to also give as the quality that we want. Not all toner with work with every machine. Toner has flow agents in it that helps it flow throught the cartridge easier. Different toners have different melting points. This is a real big problem to the printer itself. If you can possibly destroy the fuser unit in your machine if you use bad toner. This is especially bad with some of the new printer's that use polyurethane toner like the HP4200 and most of the new Lexmark machines.

 

[Zepper]

T2urtle,
. All recent model Canon printers use ink tanks - no integrated head. On my i450 I got a set of 12 USA tanks (BCI-24 equivalents) (6blk, 6tricolor) for $24. shipped... You have to go back quite a ways to find Canon carts w/ integrated heads.
. Canon still sells plenty of OEM ink carts - as plenty of people are totally oblivious as to their options and plenty of others are just risk-averse. The group here and on other techie sites is highly atypical as to knowledge of options and risk tolerance. And as was mentioned above, the profit margin on the ink tanks (even canon's) is extreme. So I wouldn't worry about Canon's bottom line...
.bh.

 

[Chadder007]

Originally posted by: SickBeast

Originally posted by: T2urtle
i still dont understand what do they screw you on? what you buy the printer w/o ink. or the the ink packs are quick in use. whats going on with them. if ink is 3-6$ a pack and it does what a normal pack does. hell i'll buy a canon just for that. my lexmark runs me 30$ for a black one.

Yes, you would be well advised to trash your Lexmark and go with a Canon.

Thats exactly what I plan to do myself....Goodbye expensive Lexmark. Hello Canon.

Does Canon make a good all in one unit also???

 

[Zepper]

Yes Canon has fine all-in-ones - they make great printers and very good scanners so why wouldn't they?
. They just came out with a couple of models in the new Pixma line and some of the previous generation are still holding top spots on PC World's charts.
.bh.

 

[V00D00]

I paid 30 bucks for like 4 of each color from shop4tech.com a while back. I went through most of them without a problem. We'll see how it works in the future.

 

[ronnn]

For Canadians - anyone with experience with these guys? ebay link

 

[T2urtle]

Hey does the canon tanks print out the same amount as other tanks. They look smaller then most tanks. How pages do you normally get out of a black 26 tank

 

[KarenMarie]

Ok, I have owned Canon printers for years...

The company I use for all my printer inks is Abacus. I also buy ink for everyone else I know... HP, Lexmark... whatever kind of printers they have.

This company has the best ink I have ever used. It is their own stuff, but I swear (and so do they) that the quality is better than the original manufacturers. Their prices are awesome and their customer service is unrivaled.



edit: they also sell on Ebay. here is the link.

 

[BHeemsoth]

Originally posted by: episodic
I print a ton - the standard canon cartridges would eat me up. I know about places that sale them as cheap as 4 dollars for a black cartridge. Looking for a cheap one that has been proven to be a quality choice.

If you print so much go for a laser.

I picked up my used xerox laser on craigslist and it has saved me countless dollars on ink cartridges/

 

[Erasmus-X]

This is an age-old argument.

Yes, you can refill your cartridges or buy remanufactured ones and save lots of $$$, but there's other factors to consider:

1) Independent lab tests have shown when printing photos, manafucturer's inks and papers always produce the most color-accurate results. In addition to this, the prints last much longer. Every manufacturer has patents on their ink technologies. The knock-off companies have to try to replicate the qualities of these inks as closely as possible and that's not always easy.

2) Most manufacturers will void the warranty on your printer if it was damaged as a result of using non-OEM ink. Of course if your printer is out of warranty, it doesn't really matter at that point.

3) Not all aftermarket inks are created equal. Do some experimenting to find out which ink suits your needs best.

 

[Penth]

Yeah, I'd like to get black ink for my Canon i560. Especially if my printer would print black. I've tried everything to get this thing working. I've tried print head cleaner and authentic canon ink. I've seen a message board with lots of people who have this problem. None had an answer that worked however. Any ideas?

 

[Macro2]

The problem is that the printer won't print black? Make sure you have a good cart, snapped in.. The do a couple deep cleans on the black.

If that doesn't work, let me know...i can help.

 

[Zepper]

It's possible you could have burned out the black side of the print head if you let it run dry... Luckily replacement print heads aren't too expensive and are user installable (yet another reason to buy Canon) .
.bh.

:moon:

 

[Erasmus-X]

Like mentioned before, it is very possible that air bubbles got trapped into your black printhead. If deep cleaning with a properly installed cartridge doesn't help you likely have to replace that printhead. Look on eBay. Canon charges an arm and a leg if you buy it directly from them.

UPDATE:

There is one seller on eBay offering a printhead for the i960. It's $52.95 (ouch).