Baby Boomer Suicide Rates Up Sharply

[demiro]

The article lists a number of possible reasons but offers no definitive conclusions. You guys can speculate all you want that it's the national debt or what some POTUS or other did or didn't do, whatever is ideologically convenient for you. However, the reality is we just do not know.

Good point, and leads to the point that blaming a politician or political party is ridiculous. They are all on the payroll of special interest groups. Until that changes we are stuck in the mud.

We've got to stop taking sides and picking fights and realize that we need to help each other.

Jumping down off soapbox now...

 

[Doppel]

If we're going to posit uneven wealth distribution as a reason for depression/suicide then we need to know the actual living standards. Wealth distribution becoming more uneven could mean that everyone's standard of living improved but the wealthy improved more than the rest. In which case it's a poor explanation for depression/suicides.

Bottom line is people may commit suicide because they're not doing well but no one is going to commit suicide over a macro-economic statistic like what is pictured in that link.

Admittedly that link is a bit of an ulterior motive as far as this thread is concerned.

However--and I do think overall living standards have increased, even for the dirt poor--humans in general measure themselves against others, and always will. Imagine if I came to your house and gave you $50k. You'd be thrilled. Imagine now I then went to every one of your neighbors and gave them $10M. You'd feel mainly bitter and pissed off about why you didn't get the $10M (at least I would, and I think most people would). Picture it seriously, all your neighbors outside congratulating each other on their good fortune and how they are now going to move to a nicer neighborhood and here you are with a measly $50k.

 

[boomerang]

The article lists a number of possible reasons but offers no definitive conclusions. You guys can speculate all you want that it's the national debt or what some POTUS or other did or didn't do, whatever is ideologically convenient for you. However, the reality is we just do not know.

You are correct. The article is little more than filler. However, it has served as a conduit for a generation of malcontents to vent their anger and resentment towards those they were taught are to blame for their own shortcomings.

Putting baby boomer in a thread title attracts cannibalistic, boomer eating sharks.

 

[boomerang]

Good point, and leads to the point that blaming a politician or political party is ridiculous. They are all on the payroll of special interest groups. Until that changes we are stuck in the mud.

We've got to stop taking sides and picking fights and realize that we need to help each other.

Jumping down off soapbox now...

You're both right and wrong. Yes, there are no politicians on the side of the people they represent. The system has been corrupted nearly beyond comprehension. Actually, it's probably beyond comprehension because I'm sure there is a shit-ton we don't know about.

But there is a fight that needs to be picked. One that brave people in our past fought that freed them from tyranny. We will not change the way the system works at the ballot box.

Talk like this gets the pro-government sympathizers pretty skittish. They like the status quo because they get a great degree of comfort from it without realizing it's not sustainable and a great degree of discomfort is inevitable.

Yes, we need to work together because we have a common enemy.

 

[Farang]

I speculate the causes are cultural. Most places in the world you are essentially married to your family. You may live with them or at least near them, and coming back home is normal.

In the U.S. social isolation is becoming the norm. You're expected to be independent while in your teens (18) and it is common to be completely on your own. This isn't how humans have lived historically.

In my own experience, living with some type of social support system, even with people you don't like, has a sort of numbing effect that keeps you going along. The group has a life of its own and you're just a cog. Being completely on your own, thoughts and feelings are free to veer in all sorts of directions and you have nothing to stabilize. Part of it has to do with nothing providing an identity but what is inside your head at a certain moment.

This is why we get the crazy lone wolves, the suicides, etc. I don't think wealth has much to do with it.. the psychological effects are present whether you're in a comfortable apartment in Colorado or a tin hut in Africa.

 

[glenn1]

You are correct. The article is little more than filler. However, it has served as a conduit for a generation of malcontents to vent their anger and resentment towards those they were taught are to blame for their own shortcomings.

Putting baby boomer in a thread title attracts cannibalistic, boomer eating sharks.

The Boomers don't do themselves any favors either. Here's one comment from one, notice the self-regard bordering on narcissism that's a common thread in many baby boomers. Quite simply, for some Boomers it's not them who's the problem, it's a world that doesn't measure up to what they feel entitled to. Note that I'm not saying this universally applies to Boomers (or even to a greater extent than other generations, although that's debatable), but the sheer numbers of them means the people with this mindset can still be a huge number.

I'm a highly educated professional and spent my entire career serving the under-served instead of focusing on money and the future, my future. This I have in common with many of my fellow Boomers; we were the marchers and fighters for social justice, and in many cases our vision of our own future was equally utopian.

.

 

[Moonbeam]

The Boomers don't do themselves any favors either. Here's one comment from one, notice the self-regard bordering on narcissism that's a common thread in many baby boomers. Quite simply, for some Boomers it's not them who's the problem, it's a world that doesn't measure up to what they feel entitled to. Note that I'm not saying this universally applies to Boomers (or even to a greater extent than other generations, although that's debatable), but the sheer numbers of them means the people with this mindset can still be a huge number.

.

Hehehe, what you call narcissism I would call a factual self-assessment. I see no narcissism and no self pity at all. It's just a statement of what happened to many reformers who were here in the 60's. Where do you see that had the person a chance to do it over they would change a single thing? What you think you see is yourself, the self contempt you would feel if you put anybody before number 1, yourself.

 

[Moonbeam]

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/05/03/health/suicide-rate-rises-sharply-in-us.html?_r=0

Some of the comments to the article are just heartbreaking.

I don't know what the answer is, I don't know if there are any answers, but it just seems like being smart and wiling to work hard just isn't enough anymore in many cases.

I worry about all my cousins in their mid 20s with no jobs and tons of college debt.

It always amuses me that folk say suicide is a mystery nobody can explain. Of course it is, and for a very simple reason. Nobody wants to know the reason which is very simple. People kill themselves because they hate themselves and feel they deserve death, and nobody will face this feeling. We would rather die than feel it and do all the time. People kill themselves because they are ignorant of the fact that they hate themselves because they were put down and made to feel that way as children. We kill ourselves because we suffer from a pain we have deeply repressed and can't consciously face. And nobody tells us the truth, well maybe except me, and how much can I do? Not one of you advanced technical thinkers out there can take a single word I say as fact. So just keep it in the back of your mind, in case you are one day tempted to take your own life, you will do so only because you believe in lies. There is nothing wrong with anybody except he or she believes there to be. There is only love and it is what we were meant to be.

 

[spittledip]

It is what happens when people care more about money and less about people.

This is a big part of it. People have no real reason to live. You have to create purpose for your life. Most people can't lie to themselves like that b/c obviously purpose that you "create" is not purpose at all. So, they cover it up with meaningless things like titles, pride about work, and gathering up possessions. They also distract themselves with pleasure. When these things are removed, not much else to turn to. People still have relationships usually, but with relationships being watered down through social media and cell phones and constant need for distraction/entertainment, the value of relationships is lost somewhat. I agree that devaluing people/relationships is a big part of the problem.

 

[Engineer]

Actually, Clinton did the least damage of the above, spending wise.

But he sure fucked them (and us) with lots of so called free trade agreements opening the floodgates for jobs, especially those of the boomer generation, to be shipped out leaving them with little opportunity and no time to retrain for anything else.

 

[waggy]

IF you going to blame wealth equality for Baby boomers higher suicide rates then fuck my kids generation is totally fucked.

I for one don't blame it on that totally. far to many reasons it could be.

 

[OverVolt]

The worse since the 1920's.

Usually precedes economic turmoil.

 

[1prophet]

Perhaps, but the reason could be as simple and stupid as more deadly prescription drugs being available means more people commit suicide on impulse. Or maybe it's a combination of things. Maybe it's related in some way to the policies of this or that elected official or maybe not. Who knows.

read the comments, they give a better perspective about the situation.

 

[OverVolt]

I'm not surprised all the 40-somethings are tapping their foot and licking their lips wanting the jobs that the baby boomers currently have because the economy is cut throat. Just waiting for them to kick it or retire, but most boomers can't retire now and are looking at the prospect of working till you drop which might be something they say they will do jokingly, but in reality is a horrible existence.

 

[MustISO]

Eh, as long as they're not taking anyone else with them I'm fine with it. I say make it legal and bring back assisted suicide for the old and sick. Allow them to make the choice.

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

It always amuses me that folk say suicide is a mystery nobody can explain. Of course it is, and for a very simple reason. Nobody wants to know the reason which is very simple. People kill themselves because they hate themselves and feel they deserve death, and nobody will face this feeling. We would rather die than feel it and do all the time. People kill themselves because they are ignorant of the fact that they hate themselves because they were put down and made to feel that way as children. We kill ourselves because we suffer from a pain we have deeply repressed and can't consciously face. And nobody tells us the truth, well maybe except me, and how much can I do? Not one of you advanced technical thinkers out there can take a single word I say as fact. So just keep it in the back of your mind, in case you are one day tempted to take your own life, you will do so only because you believe in lies. There is nothing wrong with anybody except he or she believes there to be. There is only love and it is what we were meant to be.

A liberal nutjob troll that actually understands a bit or two about how ignorant suicide "victims" are. A post I can actually agree with.

In particular, I quote your part where you said "We kill ourselves because we suffer from a pain we have deeply repressed and can't consciously face." -

This sums it up 101. Everyone who commits suicide will always say "You will never understand". Ohhh yes, we will NEVER understand your horrible situation. NO ONE else in this planet of 7 billion has EVER experienced such horrible tragedies as you It really boils down to the inability to face reality problems - a common flaw amongst liberals. Instead of saying "This is a problem. I need to fix it." They shut it off as much as they can without facing reality. When someone can't find a job - it's the economy. It's the people. It's this. It's that. It's NEVER that you live in a horrible city that isn't hiring your skills (or lack of). Nope nope nope.

 

[MrsBugi]

Reading this article and all the comments made me cry.

It made me think of my father.

He is 65 now and took an early retirement from GM in order to try and start his own software development company. It did well and he was happy until the tech bubble burst...

GM slashed benefits for retirees and it has been a struggle since. He's been out of the workforce for so long, and now he is frequently sad and depressed. He lives with my mom and they don't have many friends... He's been out of the work force nearly 15 years now and it would be hard for him to find a job even though he's a brilliant programmer.

Last week, he wanted to eat ice cream (which he hasn't done in many years since he has adult onset diabetes). My mom wouldn't let him because of the diabetes, and he yelled at her, "I have nothing to live for anymore, no job, no income, so why can't I just enjoy ice cream before I die?"

I'm tearing up again thinking about it... I want to help him because I know that a huge measure of his self-worth is having some sort of income. Feeling productive, feeling like he contributes to society/his family, and feeling like he is "good for something." I love him as my daddy no matter what, but that just doesn't seem like it is enough for him.

I don't know what to do or how to help him. Sometimes I fear the worst... I hope he never gives up. If anyone has any suggestions, I welcome them. Feel free to PM if you'd like.

 

[WhipperSnapper]

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/05/03/health/suicide-rate-rises-sharply-in-us.html?_r=0

Some of the comments to the article are just heartbreaking.

I don't know what the answer is, I don't know if there are any answers, but it just seems like being smart and wiling to work hard just isn't enough anymore in many cases.

I worry about all my cousins in their mid 20s with no jobs and tons of college debt.

It's part of the process of our nation's transforming into a third world country--our economic policies (Global Labor Arbitrage, give all the money to the rich, retarded health care system) just cannot sustain having a solid, secure middle class.

I don't blame people if they want to commit suicide for economic reasons when they no longer have any enjoyment in life. For some people, that's a better option than working low wage jobs and living in a life of poverty; it's like a reverse Atlas Shrugged where the poor no longer want to work to support the rich, so they "go on strike" by committing suicide.

 

[WhipperSnapper]

A lot of them grew up with the intentions of manufactuering. Obviously they were not keeping with the times, because that skill is no longer much of a skill. It slowly weened off - and has since become the equivalency to McDonalds.

Very simple in this world: Adapt or Die. Many have chosen the die route since they refuse to accept that they can learn other skills that have grown.

You make it sound as though solid middle class jobs are widely available for those "with the right skills". If everyone trained for the "right skills" would enough solid middle class jobs magically materialize to accommodate them or would we merely have tons of people with the "right skills" who are unemployed or underemployed? Question your free market dogma.

 

[marincounty]

Sit on the toilet with an iPad while getting a BJ from your interns as the President and you could look good during the Dot com era. derp derp.

I knew Clinton was powerful, but using an iPad ten years before they were invented, that's superhero stuff.

 

[WhipperSnapper]

Last week, he wanted to eat ice cream (which he hasn't done in many years since he has adult onset diabetes). My mom wouldn't let him because of the diabetes, and he yelled at her, "I have nothing to live for anymore, no job, no income, so why can't I just enjoy ice cream before I die?"

That is so sad. I've always been touched when someone does something that they enjoy but know is very harmful for their health but do it anyway simply because they have lost all desire to continue living. They want to squeeze out as much enjoyment as they can before they go. It's like someone who plans to commit suicide and goes on one last vacation beforehand to consume the last of his savings. It reminds me a little bit of the movie, "The Wrestler".

 

[Anarchist420]

I think it's not good that society looks down on suicide so much especially to the point where legislation keeps people from dying comfortably and without worry.

Suicide is more of a virtue than a vice IMO... those who do it don't have low self control, and they put off "easy sex, money, and revenge" forever.

 

[boochi]

More widowed cougars on the market.

 

[Oldgamer]

I think it is many factors, and I do believe that financial crisis and unemployment factors are the biggest ones. The comments about pain pills being more available are bunk though as I believe that people who become depressed will find a way, when they are that depressed, anyway, to kill themselves. I know that I have had a close relative of mine who suffered from serious chronic pain for a very long time who was under treated for their pain who finally became so depressed and could not function, they finally did kill themself and left a suicide note that they could no longer deal with the pain. But I have also witnessed friends who are in their late 60's who have become disconnected from people and lonely, without jobs,retired and they are not very techno savvy. They barely know how to navigate around a computer, and if they do, their only friends are online and they live 24/7 on a computer, and they are very lonely. Some are very depressed. Some are struggling to get by on social security, to just get by to pay for basic living expenses.

People are very cruel these days toward people who are poor or who are ill, or disabled now. So it's not surprising to see suicide rates go up.

 

[Oldgamer]

I think it's not good that society looks down on suicide so much especially to the point where legislation keeps people from dying comfortably and without worry.

Suicide is more of a virtue than a vice IMO... those who do it don't have low self control, and they put off "easy sex, money, and revenge" forever.

Well, I agree, there are several scientific articles that say the brain actually becomes physically altered, and a person is not capable of rational thought or reasoning when they are severely depressed. In other words, if someone is severely depressed and becomes suicidal people should take it seriously and not become angry or upset with that individual, they need to get them help. They should understand they cannot think logically or rationally, they aren't capable. On the other hand, if someone is so very ill, or say in the case of a dying cancer patient, or someone who is critically ill, I don't understand why we can't just allow legal euthenasia. Give that person dignity and a peaceful way out.