Barry Bonds = MVP. Bonds out Giants Lose.

[PlatinumGold]

is there any doubt? There is NO ONE single offensive player MORE valuable to his team than Barry Bonds is to the giants.

 

[murphy55d]

The voting should go:

Bonds
Pujols
Sheffield

 

[fr]

I lose 50% of my interest in a game when he's not in the lineup.

 

[PlatinumGold]

Originally posted by: murphy55d
The voting should go:

Bonds
Pujols
Sheffield

to be honest. i'm a braves fan and i wouldn't put sheff at #3. with Chipper, Andruw and Javy in that lineup WHO WOULDN'T look good?

no, shef as good as he is has too much help to be considered in the MVP running.

Pujols too also has a lot of help in St. Louis.

NO ONE is even close to contributing what bonds contributes to the Giants lineup.

 

[murphy55d]

I didn't say they were close. But they are the top 3 guys IMO. Who would you rank ahead of Pujols and Sheffield, besides Bonds obviously?

 

[PlatinumGold]

Originally posted by: murphy55d
I didn't say they were close. But they are the top 3 guys IMO. Who would you rank ahead of Pujols and Sheffield, besides Bonds obviously?

IF Javy had enough AB he would be up there with Sheff and Pujols and thats part of the problem for the 2 braves players.

but yes, your probably right, there is just such a big gap in my opinion between bonds and the rest of the field.

although Pujols is having an amazing year.

 

[Flash1969]

Pujols>Bonds

 

[PlatinumGold]

Originally posted by: Flash1969
Pujols>Bonds

you know we are talking MVP here and not POTY.

Sure, Pujols is a SHOE in for POTY but MVP, it's Bonds. Name ONE player on the giants anywhere NEAR as good as Rolen or Edmonds. of even Tino Martinez for petes sake. Pujols hits in an NL Lineup that may be 2nd ONLY to the braves.

Bonds has a mediocre lineup behind him at BEST.

 

[monto]

bonds does it again... 40HRs in 320ish ABs, A-rod 39HR in over 500, no doubt, 6th MVP, here we come

too bad in the playoffs he won't be given the chance to shine... Santiago and Alfonozo = ZERO protection

 

[PlatinumGold]

Originally posted by: monto
bonds does it again... 40HRs in 320ish ABs, A-rod 39HR in over 500, no doubt, 6th MVP, here we come

too bad in the playoffs he won't be given the chance to shine... Santiago and Alfonozo = ZERO protection

ya, pretty amazing.

he's hitting .330 or so,

which means of his 320 at bats, he has hit safely 110 times and 40 of those times for HRs.

that's an amazing number.

 

[RabidMongoose]

IMO, the MVP should be the POTY, too. I guess it's however you want to think it as. Most Valuable Player can take on different meanings. Some can say that it's the most valuable player to the team, but what the heck does that mean? To me, that means the most productive player, which is just the best player.

Oh yeah, and Bonds is POTY and MVP.

 

[PlatinumGold]

Originally posted by: RabidMongoose
IMO, the MVP should be the POTY, too. I guess it's however you want to think it as. Most Valuable Player can take on different meanings. Some can say that it's the most valuable player to the team, but what the heck does that mean? To me, that means the most productive player, which is just the best player.

Oh yeah, and Bonds is POTY and MVP.

well, i base it primarily on how they've voted in the past. they have almost always picked a player from a playoff team unless there was a HUGE performance by an EXCEPTIONAL player on a non competitive team.

 

[RabidMongoose]

I just think that it's ridiculous...they should rename it to something like 'Most Valuable Player on a Playoff Team' instead. Player production can be statistically equated to total runs, therefore the player with the most runs would obviously be the most valuable (in a production sense) player in baseball. Even if he's on a crappy team, it shouldn't matter because he would be creating more runs than any other player. Oh well, that's just my MVP rant.

 

[prvteye2003]

don't know, I'm a Rangers fan myself. And, A.Rod is tied with Bonds for homeruns for the season at 39

 

[PlatinumGold]

Originally posted by: RabidMongoose
I just think that it's ridiculous...they should rename it to something like 'Most Valuable Player on a Playoff Team' instead. Player production can be statistically equated to total runs, therefore the player with the most runs would obviously be the most valuable (in a production sense) player in baseball. Even if he's on a crappy team, it shouldn't matter because he would be creating more runs than any other player. Oh well, that's just my MVP rant.

Runs should have almost NO bearing on MVP. Runs are a function of the TEAM not the INDIVIDUAL. MVP's or POTY should be based on INDIVIDUALS EFFORT OR CONTRIBUTION.

Runs are the summation of a TEAMS effort EXCEPT for with the Home Run.

BA, OBP, OPS these are all better measures of an INDIVIDUAL Players contribution. RUNS are a TERRIBLE measure.

 

[RabidMongoose]

Originally posted by: PlatinumGold

Originally posted by: RabidMongoose
I just think that it's ridiculous...they should rename it to something like 'Most Valuable Player on a Playoff Team' instead. Player production can be statistically equated to total runs, therefore the player with the most runs would obviously be the most valuable (in a production sense) player in baseball. Even if he's on a crappy team, it shouldn't matter because he would be creating more runs than any other player. Oh well, that's just my MVP rant.

Runs should have almost NO bearing on MVP. Runs are a function of the TEAM not the INDIVIDUAL. MVP's or POTY should be based on INDIVIDUALS EFFORT OR CONTRIBUTION.

Runs are the summation of a TEAMS effort EXCEPT for with the Home Run.

BA, OBP, OPS these are all better measures of an INDIVIDUAL Players contribution. RUNS are a TERRIBLE measure.

No sh!t. I am not talking about some junk like runs or RBI's - I'm talking about the statistical amount of runs that a player CREATES with his production. As in the total production of the player - the number of total runs he statistically contributes. A more advanced statistic. Something like RARP or VORP (but these reward players in offensive-thin positions).

OPS, OBP, SLG are OK, too. BA isn't that great if there's something just as easily and readily available that is better (OBP).

 

[PlatinumGold]

Originally posted by: RabidMongoose

Originally posted by: PlatinumGold

Originally posted by: RabidMongoose
I just think that it's ridiculous...they should rename it to something like 'Most Valuable Player on a Playoff Team' instead. Player production can be statistically equated to total runs, therefore the player with the most runs would obviously be the most valuable (in a production sense) player in baseball. Even if he's on a crappy team, it shouldn't matter because he would be creating more runs than any other player. Oh well, that's just my MVP rant.

Runs should have almost NO bearing on MVP. Runs are a function of the TEAM not the INDIVIDUAL. MVP's or POTY should be based on INDIVIDUALS EFFORT OR CONTRIBUTION.

Runs are the summation of a TEAMS effort EXCEPT for with the Home Run.

BA, OBP, OPS these are all better measures of an INDIVIDUAL Players contribution. RUNS are a TERRIBLE measure.

No sh!t. I am not talking about some junk like runs or RBI's - I'm talking about the statistical amount of runs that a player CREATES with his production. As in the total production of the player - the number of total runs he statistically contributes. A more advanced statistic. Something like RARP or VORP (but these reward players in offensive-thin positions).

OPS, OBP, SLG are OK, too. BA isn't that great if there's something just as easily and readily available that is better (OBP).

those types of statistics like "run shares" are also controversial.

basically, the way it has been done is about as good as it's going to get. it's a subjective judgement.

btw, we did a whole discussion on ATOT earlier about "runs" and that's why i probably overreacted. OTOH, you did just say "runs".

 

[RabidMongoose]

I like the more advanced statistics like VORP, EQA, etc. However, OPS is a nice & quick stat. The problems is that it doesn't really reward OBP enough and doesn't park/league adjust the numbers.

I remember that runs thread, I was in it, too.