Barton overclocking

Slickone

Diamond Member
Dec 31, 1999
6,120
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Someone mentioned that the average overclock for mobile Bartons is to about 2.4GHz's. Assuming that since they run cooler than desktop Bartons, will they overclock higher than desktop chips with the same modest cooling on both?

And if they will, what speed desktop Barton would you have to buy to be able to overclock to 2.4Ghz with modest cooling?

Why are there two different wattages? ie. Newegg has a $77 45watt mobile 2400+, and an $87 35watt mobile 2400+.
 

JeffreyY

Member
Oct 28, 2001
134
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They do overclock higher than desktop bartons in general because they are unlocked. This means you can change the multiplier as well as the FSB. Plus they also run cooler. To sum it up, if you want to overclock, you should get a mobile. I think it's rather unlikely for you to get a desktop Barton that will overclock to 2.4Ghz easily. There was a time when desktop bartons had unlocked multipliers, but if you bought one now it would most likely be locked.

I don't know too much about the 35watt mobile, but I believe it overclocks better than the 45watt. I think the 35watt runs cooler => overclocks better.

I went with a 2600+ mobile and I am now overclocked to 2.5Ghz (217x11.5).
 

AWhackWhiteBoy

Golden Member
Mar 3, 2004
1,807
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they don't run cooler if your OCing. the mobile bartons run cooler because at stock speeds they use less voltage. if your going to just jack of the voltage to stock desktop speeds your going to create the exact same amount of heat. the only advantage a mobile barton has is its unlocked multiplier, and also people pay more attention to stepping. you can buy a mobile processor based on certain stepping. stepping denotes its ability to OC, better the stepping,the farther you can push it(completely depends on your setup and cooling though).
 

Avalon

Diamond Member
Jul 16, 2001
7,567
156
106
Yes, the mobiles will consistently overclock higher than their desktop counterparts, although I have seen some pretty clockable desktop chips. Roughly 2.4ghz is the average, and a chip that can do 2.6ghz on air is generally regarded as a pretty good chip. If you can get one to do 2.7ghz on air, you've got a golden chip right there. The two different wattage models are just there to cater to people who wish to have low power chips and not overclock. Generally, the 35w 2400+ is as good or slightly better than the 45w 2600+, and after those two the 45w 2500+. The 45w 2400+ mobiles sometimes have a hard time reaching 2.4ghz. I'm not quite sure where to place the 35w 2200+ or the 45w 3000+. Price and performance wise, I tend to feel that the 35w 2400+ is the best to get.
 

oldman420

Platinum Member
May 22, 2004
2,179
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correct me if i am wrong but the sweetest chips in and batch all are mobiles the lower the power requirement the more work the cpu can do with less energy less energy = less heat so after they weed out the sweet chips they go for the next wattage say 65 or so and see wat will go fastest xp 3200= and then some are slower and at max vcore will only do xp2500= then of course they go on down from there i am sure they must throw away a lot of bad cpus that dont meet min wattage requirements. so any desktop cpu is from the second or third sifting and will require more energy more energy= more heat to get the same work done.
there is a cool freware tool called cpuheat that tells you how may watts your cpu is disapating
 

Slickone

Diamond Member
Dec 31, 1999
6,120
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So the mobile 2400+ to 2600+ all o'c to the same speeds (2400Ghz)?
I'm still wondering what speed desktop XP's o'c to mobile o'c speeds. For example most 2400+ mobiles o'c to 2400Ghz. What desktop XP's normally o'c to 2400Ghz?

oldman420, you're post is too hard to read.
 

trexpesto

Golden Member
Jun 3, 2004
1,237
0
0
So the mobile 2400+ to 2600+ all o'c to the same speeds (2400Ghz)?
Roughly.
I have seen some say they think the 2600+ are the best now. Better silicon? Tested higher?
I hate to take my chip up to higher voltages like 1.9 or 2.0 because stock is 1.35, and it is way fast enough for me. Maybe later.
 

blazerazor

Golden Member
Aug 28, 2003
1,480
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?But the desktop bartons seem to have a higher FSB speed. ie the 3200/3000 bartons have 400mhz fsb. Are they better chips?? or does the fsb matter less since the multiplier is unlocked??

also, does the color of the chip mean anything? green or brown??
 

Fern

Elite Member
Sep 30, 2003
26,907
173
106
"?But the desktop bartons seem to have a higher FSB speed. ie the 3200/3000 bartons have 400mhz fsb. Are they better chips?? or does the fsb matter less since the multiplier is unlocked??"

No they are not better chips, the mobiles will reach 400 FSB and higher (see my sig). Yeah, FSB matters (more bandwidth is better), many will drop their multi on the mobile chips to attain higher FSB. Which you can't do now with the desktop chips (of two cpu's running at the same speed, the one with the higher FSB and lower multi will perform better e.g., 220fsb X I0 multi is faster than 200 fsb X II multi)

I think the different colors means different fabrication plants.
 

xxichibanxx

Senior member
Jun 30, 2004
528
0
0
mobile chips have their multiplier unlocked b/c laptops need them to save energy when they're running on battery power instead of ac power. Oldman420 is correct, they basically have all the chips come out of the batch and they test them. they run them as hot as they can( well sort of) and the ones that can reach high speeds at low voltages make it in the mobile bin. the others continue to get tested and then each is laser locked (cut bridges) and packaged and labeled by their performance. they higher you can go, the higher you get labled. that's why the bridges are cut, b/c they're not supposed to go higher than that. of course companies always put conservative ratings on their b/c they don't want to put out a product that doesn't do AT LEAST what it's advertised to do. the different wattage mobiles came out b/c AMD is continuing to try and produce lower wattage cpu's in order to compete w/ the intel Centrino and save on battery power. so you can assume that they can handle a lot of voltage and perform well. but it's all a guess. i haven't read of a mobile doing any worse than it's rating. there are some mobiles that don't do as well as some unlocked desktop bartons. but that's all a gamble and on your cooling. all the desktop bartons are locked now. my advice, either go A64 or get a mobile xp and some really good cooling. oh, you'll also need a mobo that does 400fsb and ram capable of that also.
 

Richardito

Golden Member
Feb 24, 2001
1,411
0
0
Originally posted by: Slickone
Someone mentioned that the average overclock for mobile Bartons is to about 2.4GHz's. Assuming that since they run cooler than desktop Bartons, will they overclock higher than desktop chips with the same modest cooling on both?

And if they will, what speed desktop Barton would you have to buy to be able to overclock to 2.4Ghz with modest cooling?

Why are there two different wattages? ie. Newegg has a $77 45watt mobile 2400+, and an $87 35watt mobile 2400+.

They are cooler (mine idles at 4ºC over case temp.) and o'clock a bit higher. The wattage is related to the voltage that is used by the CPU, so the reason for the difference in wattage is that the faster CPU has a higher default voltage.
 

Slickone

Diamond Member
Dec 31, 1999
6,120
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Which desktop XP(s) normally overclocks to 2400Ghz?


Originally posted by: Richardito
Originally posted by: Slickone
Someone mentioned that the average overclock for mobile Bartons is to about 2.4GHz's. Assuming that since they run cooler than desktop Bartons, will they overclock higher than desktop chips with the same modest cooling on both?

And if they will, what speed desktop Barton would you have to buy to be able to overclock to 2.4Ghz with modest cooling?

Why are there two different wattages? ie. Newegg has a $77 45watt mobile 2400+, and an $87 35watt mobile 2400+.

They are cooler (mine idles at 4ºC over case temp.) and o'clock a bit higher. The wattage is related to the voltage that is used by the CPU, so the reason for the difference in wattage is that the faster CPU has a higher default voltage.
What faster CPU? They're both 2400+
 

CraigRT

Lifer
Jun 16, 2000
31,440
5
0
I am considering eBaying my 2500+ and buying a cheap mobile to see how that thing works.
my desktop chip doesn't overclock amazing.. it's OK, but not 2.4 that's for sure.
 

dejacky

Banned
Dec 17, 2000
1,598
0
0
What is the fastest stock speed for a barton core (mobile) 35watt AthlonXP cpu? I want to buy one .
 

Concillian

Diamond Member
May 26, 2004
3,751
8
81
I have a Desktop barton 2500+ from before there were mobiles. It overclocks reasonably well, to around 2300 MHz or so.
I recently have been building a low-end system for a friend, and rather than have them buy a super low end processor, I'm giving them the Duron 800 from my backup system and I bought a Fry's special 2500+ for my backup system. That one overclocks to around 2100 MHz. And from what I hear, that is kind of the norm now for a desktop Barton.

For the chips that come from the Barton manufacturing line, there will be a certain amount of variation in the performance capability of the chips. Now the chips that go into the Desktops and the mobiles are not physically different from the manufacturing standpoint, they are different parts of the same population. To be a good mobile, it has to be able to do a given MHz at as low a voltage as possible...

If you look at the voltage ratings for the 35W 2400+ and the 45W 2400+, you'll see that the 35W is at 1.35v and the 45W is 1.45v, this is where the power difference comes from. Presumably the 45W mobiles are not capable of doing 1.8GHz at 1.35 volts, or they would have been binned as a 35W. Now, there will probably be some overlap among the different rated processors to account for demand of the various grades vs. production capability, but in general, this should be true.

The 35W mobiles ability to do 1.8GHz at a lower voltage DIRECTLY translates to a better overclocked processor, as the same internal functional advantages that make it able to do a higher MHz at 1.35v will allow it to do a higher MHz at the default AXP desktop voltage of 1.65v, or at whatever voltage the 'enthusiast' chooses to run. Quite simple really.

This is why the 35W 2400+ are so desired and command the extra few bucks. They are the highest clocked 1.35v AthlonXPs. So they must be pretty near the top of the distribution. The 45W 2400+ mobiles will likely be lower capability, as AMD sells a 2600+ 1.45v mobile processor as well. It's basically pre-sorted to overclock well, even though that was almost certainly not AMDs intent.

The other supreme advantage of the mobiles is that they are unlocked. So you can basically set your FSB however fits you best. The desktop solutions are limited to whatever multiplier you had, all the 'tricks' to unlock them are gone. Bridges and pin-mods don't seem to work anymore.

I mean theoretically a 3200+ should overclock well too, after all, not all the Bartons can reach 2.2 GHz without issue at 1.65v. But in reality, you're locked at 11x, and to get 2.4 GHz, you need to run your FSB to 218. Sounds easy enough, but the selection of motherboard that can do that is somewhat limited. When you start talking about needing 220+ FSB, you can basically forget about it unless you're into volt modding your hardware. Not to mention tha tthe 3200+ is nearly $200.

While a desktop 2800+ will work fine, there is NO reason to buy one when you can get a 45W 2400+ for like 30% cheaper that will overclock the same or better... or for ~20% cheaper you can get a 35W chip and pretty much be guaranteed that it will overclock better.
 

oldman420

Platinum Member
May 22, 2004
2,179
0
0
as for the max oc on a mobile is have discovered using several barton cpus that 2.2 ghz is the best speed 2.3 ,2.4 and 2.5 are all possible for me but i have found that 2.2 is just a sweet spot for bartons this chip loves 200 x 11 and will generly do well at that speed the mobiles just do it at a lower vcore is all.
i have ocd and benched my donkey off and get about 15-20% actaul improvement in mem bandwidth etc at higher speeds but i cant tell the diff in games or gui. at 2.2 its realy fast as far as i can tell.
 

Slickone

Diamond Member
Dec 31, 1999
6,120
0
0
Originally posted by: Fern
Originally posted by: Slickone
^

Why u bumping?

What info you still looking for?

Fern
All my questions, including the main one in the OP, that I cut down and re-asked differently twice trying to get an answer; ending up with:
Which desktop XP(s) normally overclocks to 2400Ghz?

Originally posted by: Concillian
While a desktop 2800+ will work fine, there is NO reason to buy one when you can get a 45W 2400+ for like 30% cheaper that will overclock the same or better... or for ~20% cheaper you can get a 35W chip and pretty much be guaranteed that it will overclock better.
But don't most people that get mobile Barton also get the more expensive mobo's? So instead if you got a desktop XP a few ratings (but *which* rating is my question) up from the mobile, you could get a cheap $40-$50 mobo (~half price) and not need to o'c as much to get the same speeds as the mobile Barton overclocks to. Follow me? So this is the reason I was asking what desktop XP you would need to buy to be able to overclock to speeds the mobile Bartons overclock to. On average of course, realizing it's no guarantee.

oldman420, your post is too hard to read.
 

Albis

Platinum Member
May 29, 2004
2,722
0
0
I currently use the mobile 2400+ and it's very easy to OC. The reason is because of the lower vcore. I'm currently stable at 1.5 Vcore at 11x200, which is 3200+ speeds. I don't think you can go wrong with this chip.

As for reaching 2.4ghz, it's possible on my 2400+ but it raises heat which i do not want. If you check out ocforums.com you can find more detailed info and lots of hardcore overclockers that can help answer your question
 

Concillian

Diamond Member
May 26, 2004
3,751
8
81
Originally posted by: Slickone

Originally posted by: Concillian
While a desktop 2800+ will work fine, there is NO reason to buy one when you can get a 45W 2400+ for like 30% cheaper that will overclock the same or better... or for ~20% cheaper you can get a 35W chip and pretty much be guaranteed that it will overclock better.
But don't most people that get mobile Barton also get the more expensive mobo's? So instead if you got a desktop XP a few ratings (but *which* rating is my question) up from the mobile, you could get a cheap $40-$50 mobo (~half price) and not need to o'c as much to get the same speeds as the mobile Barton overclocks to. Follow me? So this is the reason I was asking what desktop XP you would need to buy to be able to overclock to speeds the mobile Bartons overclock to. On average of course, realizing it's no guarantee.

3 things wrong with that:

1) cheap motherboards don't overclock well. The Fry's special I got with my 2500+ came with a motherboard, an ECS KT600A, and it can't overclock for squat. The same processor that gets ~2100 MHz on a ASUS A7N8X-E couldn't even do 2000 MHz stable on the KT600A. At that point I gave up on overclocking that board. I just stuck with the default 1833 MHz.

A budget board of any kind is not an overclocking board. There is a reason they are a budget board. I think you're going to have to spend more than $40-50 to get a board with decent overclocking capability.

2) No reason you can't get a cheap motherboard to OC a mobile. All you need is one that supports changing the multiplier of the processor. All but the super cheap boards will do this. On some board this is actually a MORE STABLE option, because they deal best with the "standard" FSB speeds, and you can set the FSB to 166 or 200 and just change the multiplier.

3) You also lose performance options with a cheap motherboard.
-- dual channel
-- SoundStorm audio (which saves CPU % usage in most games)

You can get Dual channel nForce2 400 Ultra boards for around $60. That's a much better option for a motherboard than anything int he $40-50 range. You still give up the SoundStorm though. BUT they also work for mobiles. Again I don't see a reason not to get a mobile. I really think you'd need at least a 2800+ to be assured of even 2200 MHz, and I wouldn't feel 2400 a shoe-in. All to save $10-20 on a motherboard? Doesn't make sense.
 

Slickone

Diamond Member
Dec 31, 1999
6,120
0
0
1. But which is why I said 'and not need to overclock as much' (if you already are starting out with a faster chip). And a mobo better than the ECS. The Shuttle AN35N-U is supposed to be a cheap decent overclocker.

2. Someone on here said there were only 3 mobos that could support multipliers about 12.5 (?).

3. Some people prefer soundcards.

But my intent wasn't to argue these points about mobo's, just to ask a [different] question.
BTW, I got the AN35N-U and Tbred 2700+ combo from outpost for $99. Couldn't pass it up.
 

ThunderGod66

Junior Member
Aug 10, 2004
3
0
0
I think I lucked out because I bought a retail desktop 3000+ (333fsb) and I have it stable right now @ 2.51ghz (13x193) using corsair value pc2700ram and a DFI ultra infinity m/b. My vcore is pretty high (2 volts) but I'm getting 50c load temps with a Thermaltake Silent tower hs/fan. I'm ordering new ram to see if I can push it any higher. Not that I need to...but it's just so much fun

I'm just curious, does anyone know the max clock that someone's been able to get on a desktop barton on with air cooling?
 
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