[Benchlife] R9 480 (Polaris 10 >100w), R9

[Flash831]

http://www.giantbomb.com/articles/sources-the-upgraded-playstation-4-is-codenamed-ne/1100-5437/

Seems some of the specs of the upgraded PS4 have leaked

If that is true it means Sony would have paid AMD to shrink the Puma cores to 14nm. I guess that means the cat core family is not scrapped after all.

Does that mean Stoney Ridge will be succeeded by 14nm cats in 2017? :sneaky:

Well played AMD, let Sony & Microsoft keep updating the small core architecture, and focus own resources on the big core

 

[R0H1T]

If that is true it means Sony would have paid AMD to shrink the Puma cores to 14nm. I guess that means the cat core family is not scrapped after all.

Does that mean Stoney Ridge will be succeeded by 14nm cats in 2017? :sneaky:

Well played AMD, let Sony & Microsoft keep updating the small core architecture, and focus own resources on the big core

If the Jaguars are still alive, come 14nm, then we'll likely see them back into the desktop/notebook space. Makes sense for AMD, only if they can further improve the IPC & clocks otherwise it'd be just a glorified Atom competitor even on 14nm D:

 

[antihelten]

^ Pretty reliable rumor really.

Apple ships a ton of notebooks and their Mac Pro lineup is very popular. That's my concern for Polaris 11 and 10 on PC, that AMD is dedicating all the fully good chips for Apple, that's the worse situation for PC gamers.

I just did a quick search and apparently Apple sells roughly 20 million Macs per year or roughly 5 per quarter. Not all of these contain discrete graphics (only the Mac Pro, the 27" iMac and some of the 15" Macbook Pros), as such the number of discrete graphics Apple ships per quarter is probably somewhere around 1-2 million per quarter.

RS just posted a graph indicating total shipment of 70 million discrete GPUs in 2015. that's 17.5 million per quarter, and with AMDs 20% market share, roughly 3.5 million for them.

1-2 million out of 3.5 million total (~30-60%), would indeed be a huge chunk and as such I wouldn't be surprised if Polaris is indeed in short supply in the early months, until AMD can ramp up supply. Now of course one might argue that AMD could just order more wafers from GF, but given that it's a new node for GF, it probably wouldn't be that simple.

 

[Mahigan]

Global Foundries isn't AMDs private foundry. Utter rubbish.



No, its Global Foundries.



More rubbish.

AMD have a deal with Global Foundries, this deal constrained AMD for a while because.

1. GF has to give AMD priority.
2. AMD has to buy a certain amount of wafers from GF.

GF is its own private entity but this deal gives AMD their own dedicated/priority foundry. So no, it's not rubbish.

NV have to compete with everyone for wafer access at TSMC. That's for Tegra, GeForce, Tesla and their automotive parts.

NV is more constrained than AMD now because AMD have two foundries at their disposal. Priority access at GF and Samsung on the side.

 

[Silverforce11]

AMD have a deal with Global Foundries, this deal constrained AMD for a while because.

1. GF has to give AMD priority.
2. AMD has to buy a certain amount of wafers from GF.

GF is its own private entity but this deal gives AMD their own dedicated/priority foundry. So no, it's not rubbish.

NV have to compete with everyone for wafer access at TSMC. That's for Tegra, GeForce, Tesla and their automotive parts.

NV is more constrained than AMD now because AMD have two foundries at their disposal. Priority access at GF and Samsung on the side.

Don't waste your time when all he's able to come up with in a retort is "rubbish" instead of presenting evidence to the contrary.

 

[ShintaiDK]

No evidence was placed in the first case.

 

[lukart]

I find it hard to believe AMD is having polaris running at such low wattage.
I mean, they could but you couldn't the performance to be anything amazing.

From what I heard, polaris 10 will be 180w.
We will see if this is right in june

 

[flopper]

AMD have a deal with Global Foundries, this deal constrained AMD for a while because.

1. GF has to give AMD priority.
2. AMD has to buy a certain amount of wafers from GF.

GF is its own private entity but this deal gives AMD their own dedicated/priority foundry. So no, it's not rubbish.

NV have to compete with everyone for wafer access at TSMC. That's for Tegra, GeForce, Tesla and their automotive parts.

NV is more constrained than AMD now because AMD have two foundries at their disposal. Priority access at GF and Samsung on the side.

seems plausible.
anyone calling your posts rubbish are clueless in my book.

 

[Mahigan]

Links..

Exclusivity deals..
http://fudzilla.com/34382-amd-amends-wafer-deal-with-globalfoundries

http://mobile.eweek.com/blogs/first...lfoundries-deal-includes-game-chips-gpus.html

http://wccftech.com/ex-amd-foundry-globalfoundries-15-billion-deal-ibm/


Prior cancellation of 28nm APU Deal:
http://m.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/2157380/amd-dumps-globalfoundries-stake-cancels-28nm-apu-deal

New Exclusivity Deals:
http://wccftech.com/ex-amd-foundry-globalfoundries-15-billion-deal-ibm/

 

[Mahigan]

Oh and AMD GF purchase agreements..
http://www.amd.com/en-us/press-releases/Pages/amd-amends-wafer-2014apr1.aspx

So where's the rubbish?

 

[Adored]

Why is everybody assuming this is polaris on 14nm?

 

[R0H1T]

Why is everybody assuming this is polaris on 14nm?

Because the leaks err slide said so

 

[maddie]

Why is everybody assuming this is polaris on 14nm?

I'm thinking this myself. I suppose # CU, thus size and power.

 

[ShintaiDK]

Links..

Exclusivity deals..
http://fudzilla.com/34382-amd-amends-wafer-deal-with-globalfoundries

http://mobile.eweek.com/blogs/first...lfoundries-deal-includes-game-chips-gpus.html

http://wccftech.com/ex-amd-foundry-globalfoundries-15-billion-deal-ibm/


Prior cancellation of 28nm APU Deal:
http://m.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/2157380/amd-dumps-globalfoundries-stake-cancels-28nm-apu-deal

New Exclusivity Deals:
http://wccftech.com/ex-amd-foundry-globalfoundries-15-billion-deal-ibm/

Oh and AMD GF purchase agreements..
http://www.amd.com/en-us/press-releases/Pages/amd-amends-wafer-2014apr1.aspx

So where's the rubbish?

The WSA is isn't exclusive both ways. The WSA that runs to 2024 means that AMD have to pay for wafers at Glofo, used or not. Then it doesn't matter how Glofo performs.

IBM had to pay Glofo to take their foundry. That's how great that was.

 

[Adored]

For me there's a decent chance of this being a faster, updated and doubled Pitcairn on GF's 28nm. The mere idea of shrinking Jaguar to 14nm gives me shudders tbh.

That's a thought, did anyone ever compare the die sizes of the PS4 done on GF and TSMC? Or XB1?

I'm really struggling to see the point of this console if they can't do exclusives for it. A total waste of Polaris if you ask me. And 14nm.

 

[beginner99]

Don't waste your time when all he's able to come up with in a retort is "rubbish" instead of presenting evidence to the contrary.

AMD moved consoel APUs to GF in late 2014 or early 2015. Use google for sources. So in this case ShintaiDK is right. And of course AMD would be stupid to not use console volume to fulfill WSA. Still, that 28 nm for current console APUs.

However it also makes sense that PS4K (or however you want to call it) will use GF 14 nm as polaris was made for that process. Maybe AMD does not have to compete with Apple directly but are dependent on GF. I'm not sure what is worse...

 

[monstercameron]

For me there's a decent chance of this being a faster, updated and doubled Pitcairn on GF's 28nm. The mere idea of shrinking Jaguar to 14nm gives me shudders tbh.

That's a thought, did anyone ever compare the die sizes of the PS4 done on GF and TSMC? Or XB1?

I'm really struggling to see the point of this console if they can't do exclusives for it. A total waste of Polaris if you ask me. And 14nm.

cat cores are heavily synthesized, not hand built like con-cores. Jaguar is also tiny -smaller than an intel atom. if there was a core to transition to 14nm ff, jaguar would be the easiest in amd's portfolio.

also, didnt you read the rumor/leak? higher resolution and/or framerates.

 

[ShintaiDK]

AMD moved consoel APUs to GF in late 2014 or early 2015. Use google for sources. So in this case ShintaiDK is right. And of course AMD would be stupid to not use console volume to fulfill WSA. Still, that 28 nm for current console APUs.

However it also makes sense that PS4K (or however you want to call it) will use GF 14 nm as polaris was made for that process. Maybe AMD does not have to compete with Apple directly but are dependent on GF. I'm not sure what is worse...

+1 :thumbsup:

 

[Erenhardt]

They need volume for WSA. New PS4 means new volume.

Sony would do a slim revision of ps4 regardless. If they are porting it to 14nm, why not boost it along the way? Doubling GPU CUs and going from 28 to 14nm would still make it a smaller chip.

Sony gets new customers (and pisses old customers), AMD gets some 14nm cats and expertise. Fills the WSA easier because the PS4 and PS4 neo die size are similar, but the market is increased for two consoles.

In case of capacity/yield troubles, AMD goes Samsung for their GPUs.

 

[dark zero]

seems plausible.
anyone calling your posts rubbish are clueless in my book.

He wants Intel in everything, no matter if this cost way more than the other solution. If there is an Intel Console, he would buy, even if is as good as a Virtual Boy or a Tiger Electronics videogames (watch Angry Video Game Nerd for more information)

BTW... If AMD having more supplies will have trouble, nVIDIA seeing that Apple will use the same wafer will have a very hellish time. It will sell fast, but they won't recover their stock.

 

[maddie]

They need volume for WSA. New PS4 means new volume.

Sony would do a slim revision of ps4 regardless. If they are porting it to 14nm, why not boost it along the way? Doubling GPU CUs and going from 28 to 14nm would still make it a smaller chip.

Sony gets new customers (and pisses old customers), AMD gets some 14nm cats and expertise. Fills the WSA easier because the PS4 and PS4 neo die size are similar, but the market is increased for two consoles.

In case of capacity/yield troubles, AMD goes Samsung for their GPUs.

Do you really believe this? Are console gamers so different from PC gamers?

One can also argue that the gamers will have the option to upgrade to higher specs sooner allowing new possibilities such as 4K, better frame rates, instead of waiting years for a new generation. A dynamic market in used low end consoles might develop. PC market dynamics.

 

[Gonad the Barbarian]

My own interest in consoles is largely based on avoiding the market dynamics I get with a PC. I don't think I'm in the minority on that either.

 

[xthetenth]

I think it really depends on how they handle it. If it's a parallel option so that your console is still viable for a decent life or you could go for the half-generation newer box for an IQ upgrade, that'd be cool. If it shortens the lifespan of the current boxes, uncool.

 

[MrTeal]

For me there's a decent chance of this being a faster, updated and doubled Pitcairn on GF's 28nm. The mere idea of shrinking Jaguar to 14nm gives me shudders tbh.

That's a thought, did anyone ever compare the die sizes of the PS4 done on GF and TSMC? Or XB1?

I'm really struggling to see the point of this console if they can't do exclusives for it. A total waste of Polaris if you ask me. And 14nm.

I would disagree and say that there's almost no chance of them doing a doubled up Pitcairn on 28nm for PS4k. Even if they went with a 384-bit bus instead of doubling it, you're still essentially describing a downclocked R9 290. Even if they don't move to a smaller case, that's just too much heat to deal with in something that needs to be relatively quiet and is often going to be stuck in home theatre stands with terrible ventilation.

 

[swilli89]

I think it really depends on how they handle it. If it's a parallel option so that your console is still viable for a decent life or you could go for the half-generation newer box for an IQ upgrade, that'd be cool. If it shortens the lifespan of the current boxes, uncool.

Did you really not read through this thread? NOTHING is being made obsolete, there is a "base" mode and "neo" mode for games. Two quality levels for two targeted hardware performance levels.

I've been saying this is the optimum solution for over a year now and a good way forward with consoles.