Best CPU supporting Vmware Virtual Machines

ravimodi

Junior Member
Jul 28, 2008
1
0
0
Hi,

I want to build a decent Machine which will be used to run several Virtual Machines (Vmware)

The machine will be used in development/testing/demo environment for testing software on various platforms and under LAN environment. The machine will host several OS like Win-2003, win-2008, Linux (several Versions), Vista etc. and many of them will be running in parallel.

Please suggest suitable CPU (either Intel or AMD) which supports hardware Virtualization and will be utilised fully. Since the machine will not be used for production purpose, any lower or mid-range CPUs will be sufficient. Also please suggest suitable Motherboard & RAM requirement. In Motherboard normal inbuilt graphics will be sufficient without any high end graphics card.

Regards

Ravi Modi
 

nanaki333

Diamond Member
Sep 14, 2002
3,772
13
81
i have a couple q6600 based ESX servers all running about 4-6 virtual machines with no noticable slowdown or hiccups. are you going to be running ESX or just the windows client? if you're going to be running ESX, you need to make sure to get a board with a supported NIC and raid controller. LSI SATA raid controllers are very ESX friendly and don't cost very much. there's plenty of intel server boards that use LSI for their raid controller too, but i prefer to have a dedicated card with onboard memory myself. i've had great success with 2 intel NICs in 1 ESX and an HP NIC in the other.
 

QuixoticOne

Golden Member
Nov 4, 2005
1,855
0
0
I don't think I can give you a specific recommendation because the best solution is always
a balance between reliability, convenience, cost, performance, et. al. and I don't quite know what is suited
for your case.

I will say the following -- if you're going to be using commodity "desktop" style technology components,
choose DDR2 PC2-6400 or PC2-8000 RAM, and get 8GB (4x2GB DIMMS) of it. RAM quantity and speed
is extremely beneficial for virtual machine usage like yours, so it pays to maximize the amount of RAM.
For the current DDR2 unbuffered memory prices, I couldn't imagine setting up a VM system with less than
this sort / amount of RAM.

Then get something like a Q9450 or Q6600 CPU; the Q9450 has the best VM technology and is probably the
best choice since your needs emphasize VM usage. The Q6600 has decent previous generation VM support,
and for its current price of around $180 or so, you can't beat it for pure price/performance if you don't think
you'll get much benefit from the slightly newer CPU based VM technology in the Q9450.

If you're going to build the system out of server class components, look for registered FB DIMMs, and get
8GB to 16GB of the RAM since for the multi-OS multi-application VM needs you have, the higher amounts of
RAM will likely be very beneficial. I'd guess one of the newer server class AMD CPUs or the newer generation
of 4-core XEONs would be fine for you. Get some specific VM benchmarks and choose the CPU accordingly,
but pick one with the best hardware VM support that is likely to be relevant to your uses.

I'm not sure if VMWARE is even fully using the latest CPU based VM hardware support in their current
production or beta versions; if they are not, I can only assume they'll do so within a year or so in an upcoming
version. IIRC the newer VM extensions better support virtualizing DMA oriented hardware devices so that
the I/O memory can be virtualized and managed by the hypervisor much more efficiently. If you're not
virtualizing guest OSs and applications that benefit from having advanced I/O devices supported and controlled
by the guest OS/application, though, maybe the older Q6600/X3220 style VM extensions may be entirely
suitable for your needs. Virtualizing advanced GPUs (which you don't need), USB devices, advanced
networking or disk controllers may (eventually) be best done with the newer VM extensions. Just using
basic GPU technology and networking / storage handled only by the VM host, though, doesn't require much
in the way of CPU VM support beyond the basic level many of the last couple of generations of
Xeon X32xx / Q9450 / Q6600 / Opteron / Phenom supports.


If you want to have high availability / run-times of the system in excess of 2-4 weeks between reboots,
I'd consider using server class fully buffered *ECC* based RAM. Without RAM ECC you'll be
much more vulnerable to RAM data corruption due to random and uncontrollable glitches which eventually
over a period of weeks of constant running is not unlikely to corrupt your data and crash your software.
If you can afford to reboot the PC every day or two, and don't consider the data integrity of paramount
importance, using desktop class non-ECC non-buffered non-registered RAM and consumer oriented
motherboards isn't an unreasonable compromise to save a couple of hundred dollars on the RAM and
motherboard.

 

SolMiester

Diamond Member
Dec 19, 2004
5,331
17
76
I think the biggest consideration for a host is RAM, cant have enough of it, that and fast I/O. Any Dual or Quad core with VT will do

edit - and what nanaki333 said, ESX host wont run on SATA drives unless on a SAS controller, and is fussy regarding hardware usually only support server class components.
 

Nathelion

Senior member
Jan 30, 2006
697
1
0
You should go for Server-class components and ECC memory... on the low end, the price difference is really minimal.
 

tr1kstanc3

Senior member
Sep 25, 2001
361
0
0
at work we use HP blades for our vmware esx 3.5 environment connected to a netapp SAN. at home i use a dfi bloodiron tf2rl, q6600, 4gb ddr2-800, 150gb raptor, and intel pro1000gt nic to run esx 3.5 for test purposes. i have no problems running desktop hardware and it was cheap to put together unlike buying a real server.
 

SolMiester

Diamond Member
Dec 19, 2004
5,331
17
76
OP, sorry to hijack the thread.....
tr1kstanc3, do you run ESX inside a VM, or have you dedicated your desktop for ESX?....I have hosts at work and would like to be able to do testing at home on my quad also!
 

v8envy

Platinum Member
Sep 7, 2002
2,720
0
0
My data point: Xeon 3210 CPU at 3.0 ghz, DS3L board, 4G of G.Skill 400 mhz ram. Running the free vmware server. This is my home 'server consolidation' project where I've moved all the old desktops and servers onto that machine. I'm thinking of migrating to kvm instead since I don't need all the fancy management features of vmware.

It's been up 24x7 with only hardware tweaking downtime since February. No problems whatsoever.

One of the things to realize is VMWare doesn't support hardware virtualization (either AMD nor Intel) for 32 bit guest OSes AFAIK. So unless you get a first generation Phenom you'll be fine with any CPU -- so long as it's macho enough and you've got plenty of RAM.
 

SolMiester

Diamond Member
Dec 19, 2004
5,331
17
76
Originally posted by: v8envy
My data point: Xeon 3210 CPU at 3.0 ghz, DS3L board, 4G of G.Skill 400 mhz ram. Running the free vmware server. This is my home 'server consolidation' project where I've moved all the old desktops and servers onto that machine. I'm thinking of migrating to kvm instead since I don't need all the fancy management features of vmware.

It's been up 24x7 with only hardware tweaking downtime since February. No problems whatsoever.

One of the things to realize is VMWare doesn't support hardware virtualization (either AMD nor Intel) for 32 bit guest OSes AFAIK. So unless you get a first generation Phenom you'll be fine with any CPU -- so long as it's macho enough and you've got plenty of RAM.

??, are you sure, I had to turn on VT in the BIOS of my DL385?....
 

bradley

Diamond Member
Jan 9, 2000
3,671
2
81
VMWare's own personal cpu of choice is AMD's Barcelona, as it supports nested page tables. The performance difference between a machine running NPT and one without can be fairly dramatic.
 

Phynaz

Lifer
Mar 13, 2006
10,140
819
126
Originally posted by: bradley
VMWare's own personal cpu of choice is AMD's Barcelona, as it supports nested page tables. The performance difference between a machine running NPT and one without can be fairly dramatic.

Link?
 

tr1kstanc3

Senior member
Sep 25, 2001
361
0
0
Originally posted by: SolMiester
OP, sorry to hijack the thread.....
tr1kstanc3, do you run ESX inside a VM, or have you dedicated your desktop for ESX?....I have hosts at work and would like to be able to do testing at home on my quad also!


on my q6600 i run vmware esx 3.5 on the hardware and not within vmworkstation. i haven't been following the latest discussions on the vmware forums concerning the capability of running esx within a vm but last time i checked 3.5 was having a kernel crash when you tried to initialize a virtual machine.

on my q6600 esx server i had no problems running virtualcenter in a server 2003 vm, windows 2003 ADDS (2 vms), windows server 2008 x64, ubuntu linux, and vista x64 concurrently.

 

tr1kstanc3

Senior member
Sep 25, 2001
361
0
0
Originally posted by: SolMiester
I think the biggest consideration for a host is RAM, cant have enough of it, that and fast I/O. Any Dual or Quad core with VT will do

edit - and what nanaki333 said, ESX host wont run on SATA drives unless on a SAS controller, and is fussy regarding hardware usually only support server class components.


you can run esx 3.5 on an intel ICH9R with AHCI enabled. i had to make sure that i was also running a sata dvd-rom drive in order to get it installed properly. i am running a standard dfi p35 chipset board with the ICH9R southbridge on a single wd raptor drive. i have not tried enabling a raid array as this machine is for home testing/learning purposes. on previous esx 3.0.x installations this was not possible.

 

Fraggable

Platinum Member
Jul 20, 2005
2,799
0
0
I have nothing new to add, other than a few things about VMware I've found recently...

VMware Server (as opposed to ESX) runs way better - in my experience almost as fast as ESX - if you configure each VM to store its working directory on a different spindle/array. If you can't/won't use ESX for whatever reason, this is worth considering as it typically supports more and cheaper hardware.

Server 08's Hyper-V may be worth considering too. It's free!
 

classy

Lifer
Oct 12, 1999
15,219
1
81
I would say ram is the most important. In esx the way cpus are virtualized any 4 core will do. And depending on the use a dual core will work well as well.
 

SolMiester

Diamond Member
Dec 19, 2004
5,331
17
76
Originally posted by: tr1kstanc3
Originally posted by: SolMiester
I think the biggest consideration for a host is RAM, cant have enough of it, that and fast I/O. Any Dual or Quad core with VT will do

edit - and what nanaki333 said, ESX host wont run on SATA drives unless on a SAS controller, and is fussy regarding hardware usually only support server class components.


you can run esx 3.5 on an intel ICH9R with AHCI enabled. i had to make sure that i was also running a sata dvd-rom drive in order to get it installed properly. i am running a standard dfi p35 chipset board with the ICH9R southbridge on a single wd raptor drive. i have not tried enabling a raid array as this machine is for home testing/learning purposes. on previous esx 3.0.x installations this was not possible.

Is that the update 1 or just 3.5?
 

nanaki333

Diamond Member
Sep 14, 2002
3,772
13
81
Originally posted by: tr1kstanc3
Originally posted by: SolMiester
I think the biggest consideration for a host is RAM, cant have enough of it, that and fast I/O. Any Dual or Quad core with VT will do

edit - and what nanaki333 said, ESX host wont run on SATA drives unless on a SAS controller, and is fussy regarding hardware usually only support server class components.


you can run esx 3.5 on an intel ICH9R with AHCI enabled. i had to make sure that i was also running a sata dvd-rom drive in order to get it installed properly. i am running a standard dfi p35 chipset board with the ICH9R southbridge on a single wd raptor drive. i have not tried enabling a raid array as this machine is for home testing/learning purposes. on previous esx 3.0.x installations this was not possible.

oh wow. when i was setting up just a test monkey to play/learn on, i was trying to use just a single SATA drive and it would not pick it up, i just used a little NAS. i never really tried it with 3.5 though.
 

tr1kstanc3

Senior member
Sep 25, 2001
361
0
0
Originally posted by: SolMiester
Originally posted by: tr1kstanc3
Originally posted by: SolMiester
I think the biggest consideration for a host is RAM, cant have enough of it, that and fast I/O. Any Dual or Quad core with VT will do

edit - and what nanaki333 said, ESX host wont run on SATA drives unless on a SAS controller, and is fussy regarding hardware usually only support server class components.


you can run esx 3.5 on an intel ICH9R with AHCI enabled. i had to make sure that i was also running a sata dvd-rom drive in order to get it installed properly. i am running a standard dfi p35 chipset board with the ICH9R southbridge on a single wd raptor drive. i have not tried enabling a raid array as this machine is for home testing/learning purposes. on previous esx 3.0.x installations this was not possible.

Is that the update 1 or just 3.5?


it is a new feature of esx 3.5 to work with sata controllers. there should really be no problem using any of the recent ICHx southbridges.

i am using this motherboard with these NICs .
 

nanaki333

Diamond Member
Sep 14, 2002
3,772
13
81
wow! seriously, that's freaking awesome! you don't know how heart broken i was when i tried to install a play server and it barked at me saying no drives were detected.
 

child of wonder

Diamond Member
Aug 31, 2006
8,307
175
106
RAM RAM RAM

In a virtual environment it will be your first bottleneck 99% of the time.

Just build your own system with a Q6600 and 8GB RAM minimum plus NIC if you're going ESX.
 

Chiropteran

Diamond Member
Nov 14, 2003
9,811
110
106
Everyone is screaming about RAM, but if you are going to have multiple active servers hard disk can just as important. If you intend to run multiple virtual machines all on a single hard drive, it can end up being a huge bottleneck. I'd suggest running 3-4 drives, and spread out the virtual machines so there is only 1-2 on each physical drive. If you don't have the budget for multiple drives, make sure the drive you do get is a fast one, although I would not suggest a velociraptor- for the price of a single raptor you could buy 3 decent 7200 rpm drives, and your performance would be better spread on multiple lesser drives. But if you do have the money to blow, nothing would beat 4+ raptors each running at most 2 VMs.
 

tr1kstanc3

Senior member
Sep 25, 2001
361
0
0
Originally posted by: ravimodi
Hi,

I want to build a decent Machine which will be used to run several Virtual Machines (Vmware)

The machine will be used in development/testing/demo environment for testing software on various platforms and under LAN environment. The machine will host several OS like Win-2003, win-2008, Linux (several Versions), Vista etc. and many of them will be running in parallel.

Please suggest suitable CPU (either Intel or AMD) which supports hardware Virtualization and will be utilised fully. Since the machine will not be used for production purpose, any lower or mid-range CPUs will be sufficient. Also please suggest suitable Motherboard & RAM requirement. In Motherboard normal inbuilt graphics will be sufficient without any high end graphics card.

Regards

Ravi Modi


you may want to check out this post about building an esx whitebox.
 
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