Biden considering emergency measures to boost refinery output

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Zorba

Lifer
Oct 22, 1999
14,869
10,286
136
nah. $8/gallon is about right. I mean, if we want to keep living on this planet. But you do you.

....90% of that being taxes, of course. But I'd also be happy if useless assholes with their giant useless rolling houses have to pay the bulk of the exorbitant cost...cylinder/weight of vehicle excise costs. I think any suburban dickbag driving an F150 should be paying $10/gallon. Any SUV or "crossover," same. I don't even care if it's a "hybrid." Your useless big car should be prohibitively expensive because you also aren't paying your fair share of the roads you are destroying at a greater rate than others.

4 cylinders (or less), and under 2k kg, about $4/gallon.

This is the way.
Most crossovers are less than 2 metric tons and 4 cylinders. Most crossovers are sedans with a hatch an an extra two inches of lift.
 

K1052

Elite Member
Aug 21, 2003
46,805
34,731
136
Most crossovers are less than 2 metric tons and 4 cylinders. Most crossovers are sedans with a hatch an an extra two inches of lift.

Crossovers really are not the problem. It's the parking lots full of V8 F150s, Tundras, and Silverados I see all over the damn place for no good reason other than the "big thing good" mentality US automakers foisted upon our primitive brains.
 

Pens1566

Lifer
Oct 11, 2005
11,806
8,380
136
Crossovers really are not the problem. It's the parking lots full of V8 F150s, Tundras, and Silverados I see all over the damn place for no good reason other than the "big thing good" mentality US automakers foisted upon our primitive brains.

And the full time soccer moms driving a suburban that gets ~12mpg all over god's green earth running errands back and forth all day. None of which involve anything requiring that size or type of vehicle.
 
Dec 10, 2005
24,406
7,318
136
You see, though, has is never supposed to get more expensive. It's America's god given right to have deflating gas prices.
Climate change is real. Just don't raise my cost of gas or tell me not to drive a gas guzzler and live in suburban driving wasteland.

Most crossovers are less than 2 metric tons and 4 cylinders. Most crossovers are sedans with a hatch an an extra two inches of lift.
Crossovers are a problem in that they fall under the "light truck" standard of CAFE and don't have to meet the stricter emissions and mileage standards of the sedans they are based off of. A few mpg loss for a consumer moving from sedan to crossover is largely unnoticeable, but do that over a population and that's a huge amount of waste. However, in the grand scheme of things, crossover >> pickups and suburbans.
 

K1052

Elite Member
Aug 21, 2003
46,805
34,731
136
And the full time soccer moms driving a suburban that gets ~12mpg all over god's green earth running errands back and forth all day. None of which involve anything requiring that size or type of vehicle.

Hey they have two whole kids and have to haul some groceries so what do you expect, they really need that ginormous truck instead of like a station wagon.
 

Brovane

Diamond Member
Dec 18, 2001
5,480
1,672
136
Crossovers really are not the problem. It's the parking lots full of V8 F150s, Tundras, and Silverados I see all over the damn place for no good reason other than the "big thing good" mentality US automakers foisted upon our primitive brains.

We owned a 2015 Nissan Leaf for about 3+years. It was the perfect errand vehicle. Only had about 70 miles of range but was perfect for taking our kids to Taekwondo, swim practice, our picking up groceries. It was great, you could sit in the car and wait for the kids to get out and leave the vehicle on and enjoy the AC on a hot summer day. A good hatchback is plenty big enough for running errands. We also had a Honda Pilot but that was only used for longer trips. We liked the Leaf so much we replaced it with a 2019 Nissan Leaf Plus that has 200-mile range. Despite this, my Mom still insists a Leaf isn't suitable as a family car.

 

Pens1566

Lifer
Oct 11, 2005
11,806
8,380
136
Hey they have two whole kids and have to haul some groceries so what do you expect, they really need that ginormous truck instead of like a station wagon.

I say that while owning a Honda Pilot ... but it at least gets somewhat decent mileage compared to the rest of the class. But I'm also not complaining about prices. Yet.
 
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Paratus

Lifer
Jun 4, 2004
16,843
13,772
146
And the full time soccer moms driving a suburban that gets ~12mpg all over god's green earth running errands back and forth all day. None of which involve anything requiring that size or type of vehicle.
Climate change is real. Just don't raise my cost of gas or tell me not to drive a gas guzzler and live in suburban driving wasteland.


Crossovers are a problem in that they fall under the "light truck" standard of CAFE and don't have to meet the stricter emissions and mileage standards of the sedans they are based off of. A few mpg loss for a consumer moving from sedan to crossover is largely unnoticeable, but do that over a population and that's a huge amount of waste. However, in the grand scheme of things, crossover >> pickups and suburbans.
Hey they have two whole kids and have to haul some groceries so what do you expect, they really need that ginormous truck instead of like a station wagon.

Suburbans get 17.8 mpg
 
Reactions: Leeea

Roger Wilco

Diamond Member
Mar 20, 2017
3,940
5,818
136
Our van is a “large” vehicle with a v6, but it gets 19/27 mpg.

My 4 cylinder crossover gets 22/32.
 
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MrSquished

Lifer
Jan 14, 2013
21,884
20,193
136
Crossovers really are not the problem. It's the parking lots full of V8 F150s, Tundras, and Silverados I see all over the damn place for no good reason other than the "big thing good" mentality US automakers foisted upon our primitive brains.
I'm a guy and knows lots of guys that don't have pickup trucks.

It's also a conservative toxic masculinity mindset penis extender
 
Reactions: Leeea and hal2kilo

Leeea

Diamond Member
Apr 3, 2020
3,696
5,431
136
I'm a guy and knows lots of guys that don't have pickup trucks.
I cannot imagine life without a pick up truck.

It's also a conservative toxic masculinity mindset penis extender
It can be, but your average pickup truck is not.

You can tell if it is a penis extender by simply looking at the truck. If it is excessively jacked up, or has had its exhaust modified yea, it is something stupid. All those mods make the truck less capable at everything.


A truck is most capable in its stock configuration from the factory. If you see a stock truck, odds are someone wanted something useful. Trucks can do a lot of things you would not want to do with a car or SUV.


Hauling garbage, brush, boat, paint, tar, lumber, and etc are all way easier with a truck. A tool box can fit right nice in the front of the bed way easier, and it is just a reach over the side to grab stuff. Lumber can easily extend out the back with the tailgate down, all you need is a red flag. A box of pool chemicals leaking in the bed of the truck is a sad day, a box of pool chemicals leaking inside your SUV is a disaster and possibly a trip to the ER.

Part time 4x4 systems on trucks are just better then AWD systems, and are very helpful for not damaging the grass when the ground is soft or wet. AWD systems work off of slip, and as soon as a wheel slips or spins the vehicle has damaged the turf. A part time 4x4 drive puts power to all the wheels all the time when it is engaged. Far less likely to harm the turf.


Trucks are just useful, and if I could only have one vehicle, it would be a truck.


A person needs both though. Truck + front wheel drive car. Cars are so much better and safer in the snow I would consider owning both a requirement.
 
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Reactions: gothuevos

MrSquished

Lifer
Jan 14, 2013
21,884
20,193
136
I cannot imagine life without a pick up truck.


It can be, but your average pickup truck is not.

You can tell if it is a penis extender by simply looking at the truck. If it is excessively jacked up, or has had its exhaust modified yea, it is something stupid. All those mods make the truck less capable at everything.


A truck is most capable in its stock configuration from the factory. If you see a stock truck, odds are someone wanted something useful. Trucks can do a lot of things you would not want to do with a car or SUV.


Hauling garbage, brush, boat, paint, tar, lumber, and etc are all way easier with a truck. A tool box can fit right nice in the front of the bed way easier, and it is just a reach over the side to grab stuff. Lumber can easily extend out the back with the tailgate down, all you need is a red flag. A box of pool chemicals leaking in the bed of the truck is a sad day, a box of pool chemicals leaking inside your SUV is a disaster and possibly a trip to the ER.

Part time 4x4 systems on trucks are just better then AWD systems, and are very helpful for not damaging the grass when the ground is soft or wet. AWD systems work off of slip, and as soon as a wheel slips or spins the vehicle has damaged the turf. A part time 4x4 drive puts power to all the wheels all the time when it is engaged. Far less likely to harm the turf.

I understand there are many legitimate uses for big trucks, especially in more rural areas, and even the bigger SUV's, I mean when people have BIG families.

I'm talking about the tons of guys that use them as penis extenders, even if they don't mod them much, they still don't use the truck as anything but a vehicle to get around.
 
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Leeea

Diamond Member
Apr 3, 2020
3,696
5,431
136
I'm talking about the tons of guys that use them as penis extenders, even if they don't mod them much, they still don't use the truck as anything but a vehicle to get around.
Those guys perform an important service.

They eat the depreciation so people like me can afford good* used trucks . After all, it is people like me that give the truck its macho image. Especially ironic since I am not even a guy.

*which is why I hate it when I see a new truck that has any sort of mod on it. Just ruins it for the next person.
 

evident

Lifer
Apr 5, 2005
11,938
538
126
And the full time soccer moms driving a suburban that gets ~12mpg all over god's green earth running errands back and forth all day. None of which involve anything requiring that size or type of vehicle.
THIS x10000. I don't understand why everyone drives around in BOF SUV based Trucks that get shit MPG for no reason. I mean i get it, I like the way land cruisers look and they are cooler than a minivan, but that's pretty much it for this demographic. No one in my neighborhood with one of these types of vehicles use it for anything other than as a family hauler. never seen any one tow a damn thing either.


I cannot imagine life without a pick up truck.


It can be, but your average pickup truck is not.

You can tell if it is a penis extender by simply looking at the truck. If it is excessively jacked up, or has had its exhaust modified yea, it is something stupid. All those mods make the truck less capable at everything.
dont forget the brandon, harley davidson and AR15 bumper stickers. it's the dumbest culture.
 

HomerJS

Lifer
Feb 6, 2002
36,282
28,141
136
Is there a 1970s style "shortage" where its being rationed? No, not yet. But obviously the supply is much lower than demand, hence the price.
But is the insufficient supply due to oil companies holding back on production capacity? I suspect so
 
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Pens1566

Lifer
Oct 11, 2005
11,806
8,380
136
THIS x10000. I don't understand why everyone drives around in BOF SUV based Trucks that get shit MPG for no reason. I mean i get it, I like the way land cruisers look and they are cooler than a minivan, but that's pretty much it for this demographic. No one in my neighborhood with one of these types of vehicles use it for anything other than as a family hauler. never seen any one tow a damn thing either.



dont forget the brandon, harley davidson and AR15 bumper stickers. it's the dumbest culture.

Yeah. I work from home, full time. My office has big windows that look out on the main drag that is the only way in/out of a large-ish development that would be considered upper high end of the market in our area. So all I see every day are the latest and greatest super expensive monster sized suburban assault vehicles and tricked out king cab pickups passing back and forth. The first group is almost entirely stay at home moms that are shuttling back and forth between starbucks runs and yoga/spin classes. The latter is the penis extension group others have already discussed as they go off to their office for the day. These vehicles are not fulfilling any unique intended purpose that couldn't be handled by a smaller more efficient vehicle.

We willingly brought this on ourselves, and deserve everything that is coming as a result ...
 

BoomerD

No Lifer
Feb 26, 2006
63,344
11,720
136
I know you're joking but can anyone break that price point down for me?
From extraction in the oil field, processing, transport by cargo ship, distribution to the hose you put in your tank.

Now whats the cost of Milk? - And you dont even have to wait for the cow to be dead 200.000 years and suck it out of the ground.
In the late 60's and early 70's, until the Arab oil embargo, gasoline prices were stable around 30-35 cents... And stations used to have "gas wars" with decreasing prices pretty regularly.
I realize costs have gone up, but gas prices have gone up far more than other things.
 

MrSquished

Lifer
Jan 14, 2013
21,884
20,193
136
Yeah. I work from home, full time. My office has big windows that look out on the main drag that is the only way in/out of a large-ish development that would be considered upper high end of the market in our area. So all I see every day are the latest and greatest super expensive monster sized suburban assault vehicles and tricked out king cab pickups passing back and forth. The first group is almost entirely stay at home moms that are shuttling back and forth between starbucks runs and yoga/spin classes. The latter is the penis extension group others have already discussed as they go off to their office for the day. These vehicles are not fulfilling any unique intended purpose that couldn't be handled by a smaller more efficient vehicle.

We willingly brought this on ourselves, and deserve everything that is coming as a result ...

Where do you live? It's not that bad up in Northeast NJ. Yes they are here too it's just most people drive sedans or crossovers.
 
Feb 4, 2009
34,703
15,950
136
I’ll say it again regarding profits during this time.
Let’s say a dude owns a convenience store, just because of ordering oddities he ends up with a large supply of bottled water & diapers. A weather event happen hurricane, blizzard, tornado or whatever and these items are in short supply, if the Dude marks all the water & diapers up to 20x their purchase price is this Dude a Captain of industry or an asshole who is exploiting an act of God?
Should oil companies be reporting record earnings in our current environment? They are assholes imo.
 
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Pens1566

Lifer
Oct 11, 2005
11,806
8,380
136
I’ll say it again regarding profits during this time.
Let’s say a dude owns a convenience store, just because of ordering oddities he ends up with a large supply of bottled water & diapers. A weather event happen hurricane, blizzard, tornado or whatever and these items are in short supply, if the Dude marks all the water & diapers up to 20x their purchase price is this Dude a Captain of industry or an asshole who is exploiting an act of God?
Oil companies should be reporting record earnings in our current environment. They are assholes imo.

As they're considered "essentials", he's an asshole.
 
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