Biden shames US policies in Munich speech, calls America 'an embarrassment'

JEDIYoda

Lifer
Jul 13, 2005
33,982
3,318
126
A lot of truth!!
https://news.yahoo.com/munich-conference-exposes-decline-west-144000606.html

America and Europe continue to go their separate ways.
Munich Conference Exposes the Decline of the West

Who knew that the 2020 presidential campaign would really kickoff at the annual Munich Security Conference? Former Vice-President Joe Biden announced, “we will be back. We will be back. Don’t have any doubt about that.” He was referring to what he sees as America’s natural leading role in the international stage. But it was hard not to read in it another message, which is that he himself will be back in Washington. This time as the Democratic candidate who ousted Trump whose policies Biden dismissed as an “embarrassment.” Biden dinged Trump for everything from its climate change policies, or lack of them, to its trade wars. The message was clear: after a four-year interregnum, the ancien regime will be restored.

Vice President Mike Pence, by contrast, suggested that everything is hunky-dory. Pence is a member of the hawkish wing of the GOP that is straight out of the Reaganite 1980s. Fresh off his flagrant failure in Warsaw to convince Europeans to join the anti-Iran crusade, he tried to paint Trump as strengthening the NATO alliance, a goal that Trump himself displays zero interest in pursuing. Nuking the INF Treaty, as Trump has done, scarcely bolsters European security; it erodes it.

Trump is a believer in old fashion realpolitik, not in permanent alliances. Pence, though, sought to reinvent Trump: Under Trump’s leadership, he said, “America is leading the free world once again.” Trump, in other words, is a new Reagan.

Whether the Europeans believed any of this folderol from both Biden and Pence is doubtful. Trump has accelerated America’s drift away from Europe, which took place under President Barack Obama. Obama took no particular interest in Europe, other than regretting that he led a NATO coalition into Libya in March 2012. He later called it the “worst mistake” of his presidency. But unlike Trump, Obama never heaped public contempt on Europe as does Trump for whom the failure to pay adequately for their defenses served as a fine pretext to condemn the entire project.

Of course, the Europeans are doing a fine job of sabotaging themselves. German Chancellor Angela Merkel delivered an impassioned speech defending the West, but latest reports indicate that the Germans can barely field a functioning army. If a hard Brexit occurs, Europe will be further weakened politically and economically. Germany could start looking East rather than West.

In this regard, tensions are rising between Washington and Berlin over the controversial gas pipeline Nordstream 2, which Merkel is stoutly defending. France and other countries worry that the project will strengthen German-Russian ties at the expense of Ukraine. Merkel is an advocate of maintaining political ties to Moscow. At Munich, she said it would be foolish not to consider the geopolitical repercussions of halting the Nordstream project: “Consciously shutting Russia out politically, I think that’s also wrong. Europe can’t have a geopolitical interest in halting all relations to Russia.”

No matter what Biden or Pence may say, Europe knows that it is increasingly on its own. Munich did not create any new transatlantic policies or clashes. It simply exposed them.
 
Nov 25, 2013
32,083
11,718
136
Where did Biden call "America" an "embarrassment?" I'd really like to see that.

From a different article

"Apparently swiping at President Donald Trump in particular, Biden criticized the separation of migrant families. “The America I see values basic human decency, not snatching children from their parents or turning our back on refugees at our border,” he said. “The American people understand…because it makes us an embarrassment. The American people know, overwhelmingly that it is not right. That it is not who we are."

https://www.newsweek.com/joe-biden-immigration-europe-nato-donald-trump-1334094

Hard to disagree with him although I think he's a wee bit optimistic re what the "American people' know and understand given that roughly 40% seem to be just fine with what's been happening in their country.

(Edit: forgot the link)
 
Last edited:

woolfe9998

Lifer
Apr 8, 2013
16,189
14,102
136
From a different article

"Apparently swiping at President Donald Trump in particular, Biden criticized the separation of migrant families. “The America I see values basic human decency, not snatching children from their parents or turning our back on refugees at our border,” he said. “The American people understand…because it makes us an embarrassment. The American people know, overwhelmingly that it is not right. That it is not who we are."

https://www.newsweek.com/joe-biden-immigration-europe-nato-donald-trump-1334094

Hard to disagree with him although I think he's a wee bit optimistic re what the "American people' know and understand given that roughly 40% seem to be just fine with what's been happening in their country.

(Edit: forgot the link)

Well kind of. He's really talking about Trump's border policies though. He isn't generalizing about "America." In fact, he says right in the next sentence that what Trump is doing is not really who we are.

And guess what, he's right. Trump IS an embarrassment to the country. In so, so many different ways.
 

PJFrylar

Senior member
Apr 17, 2016
974
617
136
The border separations was a breaking point for me. When members of my extended family bent over backwards to first deny then justify the practice... that's not politics anymore. That is just simply devoid of basic human decency. They say you can't pick your family; excuse me, who are they and why the heck are they trying to tell me what I can do?
 

ch33zw1z

Lifer
Nov 4, 2004
38,003
18,350
146
The border separations was a breaking point for me. When members of my extended family bent over backwards to first deny then justify the practice... that's not politics anymore. That is just simply devoid of basic human decency. They say you can't pick your family; excuse me, who are they and why the heck are they trying to tell me what I can do?

You're a patient fellow. The breaking point for me was when Republicans primaried and voted for an asshat like trump. They're really good at playing dumb, like who's this trump guy and what's he doing here?

IMO, the US has been an embarrassment since we went full on stupid with trickle down. I mean, I was barely a hatchling then....but now i'm almost 40 and it's sad to see.

this is what it's become:

 

PJFrylar

Senior member
Apr 17, 2016
974
617
136
You're a patient fellow. The breaking point for me was when Republicans primaried and voted for an asshat like trump. They're really good at playing dumb, like who's this trump guy and what's he doing here?

IMO, the US has been an embarrassment since we went full on stupid with trickle down. I mean, I was barely a hatchling then....but now i'm almost 40 and it's sad to see.

this is what it's become:

View attachment 3471

That gif is the American dream.
 
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SlowSpyder

Lifer
Jan 12, 2005
17,305
1,001
126
The border separations was a breaking point for me. When members of my extended family bent over backwards to first deny then justify the practice... that's not politics anymore. That is just simply devoid of basic human decency. They say you can't pick your family; excuse me, who are they and why the heck are they trying to tell me what I can do?


Boo fucking hoo, your poor feels. Don't want to get separated, THEN DON'T COME HERE ILLEGALLY. Look, I just kept families together! And let's not pretend that this wasn't happening under Obama too. And it should happen, we want to stop human trafficking. Are you another sheeple fooled by the false leftist narrative that kids were kept in cages like animals? Because that didn't happen. Lastly, when you do something illegal, the possibility of jail and prison is real. Do you realize that when someone goes to jail/prison they are separated from their family? And by coming here ILLEGALLY one risks jail.
 

PJFrylar

Senior member
Apr 17, 2016
974
617
136
Boo fucking hoo, your poor feels. Don't want to get separated, THEN DON'T COME HERE ILLEGALLY. Look, I just kept families together! And let's not pretend that this wasn't happening under Obama too. And it should happen, we want to stop human trafficking. Are you another sheeple fooled by the false leftist narrative that kids were kept in cages like animals? Because that didn't happen. Lastly, when you do something illegal, the possibility of jail and prison is real. Do you realize that when someone goes to jail/prison they are separated from their family? And by coming here ILLEGALLY one risks jail.

Congratulations. You justified it because they crossed and turned themselves in to seek asylum. Congratulations. You are exactly the kind of person that I want nothing to do with anymore. You have transcended differences in politics to someone who lacks basic human decency. I notice you have ignored my calls to explain things in numerous other threads. This is the hill you choose to die on? Really? Jesus god damned mother fucking christ. Wow.
 

PJFrylar

Senior member
Apr 17, 2016
974
617
136
Yep. Slow has proved over and over that he has absolutely no desire to discuss things logically or rationally. His arguments are entirely about his feels with complete disregard for data and facts. His is some of the most impressive projection I've ever seen. Also, I tend to think he's just a troll.

I wonder what is really going through his head. Did he really think that he could pounce on me in a "I got you now" type way? I mean... wow. It really says a lot that this is the subject he chose to engage me on. It is actually somewhat mind blowing.
 
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TheVrolok

Lifer
Dec 11, 2000
24,254
4,077
136
I wonder what is really going through his head. Did he really think that he could pounce on me in a "I got you now" type way? I mean... wow. It really says a lot that this is the subject he chose to engage me on. It is actually somewhat mind blowing.

That's why I tend to think he's a troll. His sentence structure and grammar suggest some level of intelligence; he doesn't just sit, pound keys, and rage post like a lot of Trump faithful. That level of intelligence is at odds with the absolutely illogical and irrational drivel he posts, though. It could be as simple as he's truly that brainwashed and delusional, very well could be, but another easy solution is that he knows what he writes is absurd but he's just a troll doing it for lulz/cash.
 

PJFrylar

Senior member
Apr 17, 2016
974
617
136
That's why I tend to think he's a troll. His sentence structure and grammar suggest some level of intelligence; he doesn't just sit, pound keys, and rage post like a lot of Trump faithful. That level of intelligence is at odds with the absolutely illogical and irrational drivel he posts, though. It could be as simple as he's truly that brainwashed and delusional, very well could be, but another easy solution is that he knows what he writes is absurd but he's just a troll doing it for lulz/cash.
Just going to quote myself here


It's moments like this where thinking the most intelligent poster in P&N is trolling changes to hoping he is. A person that is so easily bamboozled and hateful carrying about thinking they are brilliantly smart ... well you see their appeal to Trump. However, I've seen enough people like the most intelligent poster in P&N to realize there is a chance he's not a troll.

However, he has neglected to engage me in numerous other threads in the last day or two. I mean, it isn't like he would have not noticed ... I @ ed him. I think I said that right? I feel old. I think we need a sticky to ignore him completely, if he isn't a troll ... then wow. Just wow.
 
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TheVrolok

Lifer
Dec 11, 2000
24,254
4,077
136
Just going to quote myself here




However, he has neglected to engage me in numerous other threads in the last day or two. I mean, it isn't like he would have not noticed ... I @Ed him. I think I said that right? I feel old. I think we need a sticky to ignore him completely, if he isn't a troll ... then wow. Just wow.
Yep. He oddly disappears for awhile and fails to address numerous obvious conflicts which are directed quite directly to him. More evidence I suspect he's just a troll/shill. I don't respond to him at all. He's not worth it.
 

PJFrylar

Senior member
Apr 17, 2016
974
617
136
Yep. He oddly disappears for awhile and fails to address numerous obvious conflicts which are directed quite directly to him. More evidence I suspect he's just a troll/shill. I don't respond to him at all. He's not worth it.

I can't argue with that.
 

Genx87

Lifer
Apr 8, 2002
41,095
513
126
Biden helped the current wave of immigration into Europe with that disaster of an operation in Libya. Then he was part of an administration that doubled down on trying to topple Syria. Prolonging a civil war which sent millions more into Europe. Trump is part of the problem but so was he. I find it ironic the only thing Trump has done right Biden is complaining about. And that is to not get us into a new shooting war under the guise of leading the free world. Something the last 5 presidents failed to do. I think Jimmy Carter was the last one to not get us into a shooting war????
 

soundforbjt

Lifer
Feb 15, 2002
17,788
6,040
136
Biden helped the current wave of immigration into Europe with that disaster of an operation in Libya. Then he was part of an administration that doubled down on trying to topple Syria. Prolonging a civil war which sent millions more into Europe. Trump is part of the problem but so was he. I find it ironic the only thing Trump has done right Biden is complaining about. And that is to not get us into a new shooting war under the guise of leading the free world. Something the last 5 presidents failed to do. I think Jimmy Carter was the last one to not get us into a shooting war????
Are you forgetting that Trump (Bolton, Pence) is trying to get us into a war with Iran? Hopefully he doesn't accomplish it.
 
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Genx87

Lifer
Apr 8, 2002
41,095
513
126
Are you forgetting that Trump (Bolton, Pence) is trying to get us into a war with Iran? Hopefully he doesn't accomplish it.

We have been "trying" to get into a war with Iran since 1979. There is a difference in continuing a 40 year cold war and going hot. Trump isn't going into Iran anymore than Reagan, Bush I-II, Clinton, or Obama were.
 

soundforbjt

Lifer
Feb 15, 2002
17,788
6,040
136
We have been "trying" to get into a war with Iran since 1979. There is a difference in continuing a 40 year cold war and going hot. Trump isn't going into Iran anymore than Reagan, Bush I-II, Clinton, or Obama were.
If things heat up against him enough here with the investigations, I wouldn't put it past him to try to save his re-election chances.
 
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fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
84,825
49,526
136
We have been "trying" to get into a war with Iran since 1979. There is a difference in continuing a 40 year cold war and going hot. Trump isn't going into Iran anymore than Reagan, Bush I-II, Clinton, or Obama were.

Uhmm, Bush II (or at least large segments of his administration) had a pretty clear plan to go after Iran, the main issue was that Iraq turned out to be a catastrophe.

Obama on the other hand had a pretty clear plan to de-escalate tensions with Iran. That’s one of the things the ‘horrible’ nuclear deal was all about.

Trump appointed someone who has explicitly argued in favor of bombing Iran to be his national security adviser.

Saying they are all the same is... just wrong?
 
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