Big Three take 47 percent of 'Cash for Clunkers' sales; Ford Focus top-seller

[lupi]

Originally posted by: TruePaige

Originally posted by: lupi

Originally posted by: Phokus

Originally posted by: lupi
lol, told ya this program was worthless for used cars.


And as for the "success" of the program, in a stimulation for the economy where we don't just give money to the business it was.

For the progressive schmuck thinking this will save the planet, when about half those trucks going in are still becoming trucks, yeah not so much.

You know, you're probably the most consistent poster in terms of not reading the article/thread and making stupid comments.

an increase in 10 mpg is a big deal :roll:

and you continue to prove just how much of a total partisan hack idiot you are. You only need a 1-2 MPG increase to qualify for the vast majority of vehicles that have been turned in.

Did you not read the article, lupi?

The average MPG increase over all the cash for clunkers trade ins is 10 MPG.

do some reading on how it's impossible to tell what the actual improvement is without seeing the raw data due to how averages can be averaged to your favor (ala Cafe)

 

[Fox5]

Originally posted by: Patranus
My point is how can you call something a success when you are artificially stimulating the economy?

This is no different than people thinking they were rich because of their artificially inflated home prices, and then taking a 2nd mortgage to buy luxury items.

How is the value of a dollar determined?

 

[BoberFett]

It's going to be funny when the working poor are unable to afford a used card to get back and forth from work because we just destroyed several hundred thousand of them just to artificially pump up the top line revenue of mismanaged companies.

 

[TruePaige]

Originally posted by: lupi

Originally posted by: TruePaige

Originally posted by: lupi

Originally posted by: Phokus

Originally posted by: lupi
lol, told ya this program was worthless for used cars.


And as for the "success" of the program, in a stimulation for the economy where we don't just give money to the business it was.

For the progressive schmuck thinking this will save the planet, when about half those trucks going in are still becoming trucks, yeah not so much.

You know, you're probably the most consistent poster in terms of not reading the article/thread and making stupid comments.

an increase in 10 mpg is a big deal :roll:

and you continue to prove just how much of a total partisan hack idiot you are. You only need a 1-2 MPG increase to qualify for the vast majority of vehicles that have been turned in.

Did you not read the article, lupi?

The average MPG increase over all the cash for clunkers trade ins is 10 MPG.

do some reading on how it's impossible to tell what the actual improvement is without seeing the raw data due to how averages can be averaged to your favor (ala Cafe)

Well you posted against the computed average as provided by the source, so if you think the average is impossible to computer why did you offer a negative opinion?

I still think the average here should be trusted unless otherwise noted, but even if I took your scenario into account it does not make your assumption correct.

 

[jpeyton]

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil
Obama should build on that concept and give the middle and lower classes a tax CUT to stimulate the economy

Ummm...he already did.

However the downside of this is, we don't really know whats going to happen to these 'clunkers'.. If they are not destroyed then there was no point in them being turned in.

Try reading. They are being destroyed.

I also doubt this will have much of an impact on our national MPG ratings as many people whom I have heard take advantage of this were turning in low MPG vehicles for more low MPG vehicles (Old trucks for new trucks, etc.. ).. they may be stepping up slightly, but not much.

The facts directly contradict you (not surprisingly):

The average fuel economy of new vehicles purchased under the CARS program is 25.4 miles per gallon, and the average fuel economy of trade-ins is 15.8 mpg, for an average increase in fuel economy of 9.6 mpg.

Ultimately this program is doing almost nothing for the environment but make people feel good. When people get higher MPG vehicles they tend to drive more.

Yep, I'm sure all those people are getting up every morning and taking the extra long way to work just for shits and giggles :roll:

 

[ZeGermans]

Just dropping by to say that the money spent on this would pay for about 6 F-22's that don't work in the rain or near cell phones

 

[jpeyton]

Originally posted by: ZeGermans
Just dropping by to say that the money spent on this would pay for about 6 F-22's that don't work in the rain or near cell phones

:laugh: :thumbsup:

 

[OCGuy]

Originally posted by: ZeGermans
Just dropping by to say that the money spent on this would pay for about 6 F-22's that don't work in the rain or near cell phones

It took you two hours for that horrible drive-by one liner?

 

[her209]

Originally posted by: BoberFett
It's going to be funny when the working poor are unable to afford a used card to get back and forth from work because we just destroyed several hundred thousand of them just to artificially pump up the top line revenue of mismanaged companies.

How would the working poor be able to afford a used car that gets bad gas mileage?

 

[Pens1566]

Originally posted by: BoberFett
It's going to be funny when the working poor are unable to afford a used card to get back and forth from work because we just destroyed several hundred thousand of them just to artificially pump up the top line revenue of mismanaged companies.

Since when does anyone in the republican party care about the working poor???

OH! THE FAUX OUTRAGE!!!!

 

[OCGuy]

Originally posted by: Pens1566

Originally posted by: BoberFett
It's going to be funny when the working poor are unable to afford a used card to get back and forth from work because we just destroyed several hundred thousand of them just to artificially pump up the top line revenue of mismanaged companies.

Since when does anyone in the republican party care about the working poor???

OH! THE FAUX OUTRAGE!!!!

Right, because those Southern Republicans are all just filthy rich!

 

[ZeGermans]

The best part about successful government projects is desperate flailing about an inevitable failure of the glorious free market wrapped up in faux populism

 

[StageLeft]

Originally posted by: jpeyton
Excellent results! Not only are domestic made auto sales up, but we're seeing a dramatic increase in average MPG.

Most modern sedans have great fuel economy. The problem with our nationwide MPG average isn't new cars, but the old "clunkers" that this government program clearly targeted.

Another big win for the Obama administration.

Good Lord, man, pull yourself from his anus, it's just not becoming.

 

[charrison]

Originally posted by: her209

Originally posted by: BoberFett
It's going to be funny when the working poor are unable to afford a used card to get back and forth from work because we just destroyed several hundred thousand of them just to artificially pump up the top line revenue of mismanaged companies.

How would the working poor be able to afford a used car that gets bad gas mileage?

THe poor drive all kinds of junk, including those with poor gas mileage. They often even get enhanced with stereos and rims worth more than car itself.

 

[BoberFett]

Originally posted by: her209

Originally posted by: BoberFett
It's going to be funny when the working poor are unable to afford a used card to get back and forth from work because we just destroyed several hundred thousand of them just to artificially pump up the top line revenue of mismanaged companies.

How would the working poor be able to afford a used car that gets bad gas mileage?

I don't know, but apparently they're supposed to trade their clunkers in for brand new $20K+ vehicles.

That was the point of the program, wasn't it?

 

[BoberFett]

Originally posted by: Pens1566

Originally posted by: BoberFett
It's going to be funny when the working poor are unable to afford a used card to get back and forth from work because we just destroyed several hundred thousand of them just to artificially pump up the top line revenue of mismanaged companies.

Since when does anyone in the republican party care about the working poor???

OH! THE FAUX OUTRAGE!!!!

Since when am I in the republican [sic] party?

OH! THE ONGOING STUPIDITY OF DEMOCRATS!!!!

 

[BoberFett]

Originally posted by: ZeGermans
The best part about successful government projects is desperate flailing about an inevitable failure of the glorious free market wrapped up in faux populism

Haha, successful. You're a riot.

BTW, have you raped any female soldiers lately? Maybe you can get the government to sponsor that program too.

 

[themusgrat]

Originally posted by: Patranus
My point is how can you call something a success when you are artificially stimulating the economy?

This is no different than people thinking they were rich because of their artificially inflated home prices, and then taking a 2nd mortgage to buy luxury items.

Dude, this is not what Republicans want to be going ballistic over. This program benefited the economy, per dollar, much more than any of the other 850bn dollars in the stimulus package will ever. The program was a huge success, for what it was. It's shitty that our government has to help bail the economy out, but it's also shitty that our government was a huge reason the economy went down the tubes in the first place.

Just look at it like this. 3bn total is almost nothing to the government. People that could afford new cars but were too afraid to spend the money went out and spent that money, money that desperately needed to be spent. At the end of September, 750,000 new cars will have been sold because of the program, and if the 83% number of trucks holds up, that means over 600,000 guzzlers will be removed from the roads. While that will hurt gas sales

waiiiiittttt.......... Give me one moment to cry horrible tears of anguish, the GAS COMPANIES OBAMA, THINK OF THE MIDDLE EASTERN OIL SHEIKS!!!!

Sorry about that. Anyways, it will reduce our gas comsumption by a bit, which is always good. You know that whole supply/demand thing? Maybe this will help keep gas prices down just a little bit. It's worth it in every way. The only downside is the used car market, but in another 2 months it will pick back up again.

 

[BMW540I6speed]

We're in the grips of a deep recession. Nobody is spending their money. This program gives them an incentive to purchase a new vehicle with much better gas mileage. That could be a HUGE savings for some. Some are imagining some hypothetical other purchases the participants in the program could have made had they not participated, but that ignores the fact that nobody is being forced to participate and that they're presumably getting lots of value from their decision to participate. If the participants had a better use for their money, I think they would have opted for the better use, and not junked a perfectly useable vehicle for no reason.

The money came from the stimulus package. Many have objected that the stimulus would take a long time to kick in. This billion dollars kicked in right away (faster than expected). Many will also complain that the program is injecting uncertainty into the market, as if a market with two companies who just emerged from bankruptcy didn't have enough uncertainty before, and as if they would complain about more sales now.

As for opportunity cost, we've already seen that the alternate spending would be something less stimulative. For consumers, they don't appear to have been rushing to spend the last quarter. It might well cut into savings, granted, but that is what we need right now. The glitches in the system I read about involve it being more successful than expected, and the risk that the government wouldn't pay for clunkers already bought - which would be a problem if the government hadn't promised to make good on this. If they hadn't, then there would be a legitimate complaint. There's no satisfying some people. If the government figured out how to make it rain inflation-free $20 bills, they would complain about them clogging the sewers.

 

[BMW540I6speed]

Originally posted by: BoberFett
It's going to be funny when the working poor are unable to afford a used card to get back and forth from work because we just destroyed several hundred thousand of them just to artificially pump up the top line revenue of mismanaged companies.

Hell, we OWN General Motors now. And I'd rather own that than a pile of bad debts.

 

[blackangst1]

Originally posted by: BMW540I6speed
We're in the grips of a deep recession. Nobody is spending their money. This program gives them an incentive to purchase a new vehicle with much better gas mileage. That could be a HUGE savings for some. Some are imagining some hypothetical other purchases the participants in the program could have made had they not participated, but that ignores the fact that nobody is being forced to participate and that they're presumably getting lots of value from their decision to participate. If the participants had a better use for their money, I think they would have opted for the better use, and not junked a perfectly useable vehicle for no reason.

The money came from the stimulus package. Many have objected that the stimulus would take a long time to kick in. This billion dollars kicked in right away (faster than expected). Many will also complain that the program is injecting uncertainty into the market, as if a market with two companies who just emerged from bankruptcy didn't have enough uncertainty before, and as if they would complain about more sales now.

As for opportunity cost, we've already seen that the alternate spending would be something less stimulative. For consumers, they don't appear to have been rushing to spend the last quarter. It might well cut into savings, granted, but that is what we need right now. The glitches in the system I read about involve it being more successful than expected, and the risk that the government wouldn't pay for clunkers already bought - which would be a problem if the government hadn't promised to make good on this. If they hadn't, then there would be a legitimate complaint. There's no satisfying some people. If the government figured out how to make it rain inflation-free $20 bills, they would complain about them clogging the sewers.

I am willing to bet that for 90% of people who used this program did NOT see a savings. Unless you dont count the extra car payment....this was a terrible program right now. People need to SAVING and CUTTING COSTS, not increasing debt.

 

[marincounty]

Originally posted by: blackangst1

Originally posted by: BMW540I6speed
We're in the grips of a deep recession. Nobody is spending their money. This program gives them an incentive to purchase a new vehicle with much better gas mileage. That could be a HUGE savings for some. Some are imagining some hypothetical other purchases the participants in the program could have made had they not participated, but that ignores the fact that nobody is being forced to participate and that they're presumably getting lots of value from their decision to participate. If the participants had a better use for their money, I think they would have opted for the better use, and not junked a perfectly useable vehicle for no reason.

The money came from the stimulus package. Many have objected that the stimulus would take a long time to kick in. This billion dollars kicked in right away (faster than expected). Many will also complain that the program is injecting uncertainty into the market, as if a market with two companies who just emerged from bankruptcy didn't have enough uncertainty before, and as if they would complain about more sales now.

As for opportunity cost, we've already seen that the alternate spending would be something less stimulative. For consumers, they don't appear to have been rushing to spend the last quarter. It might well cut into savings, granted, but that is what we need right now. The glitches in the system I read about involve it being more successful than expected, and the risk that the government wouldn't pay for clunkers already bought - which would be a problem if the government hadn't promised to make good on this. If they hadn't, then there would be a legitimate complaint. There's no satisfying some people. If the government figured out how to make it rain inflation-free $20 bills, they would complain about them clogging the sewers.

I am willing to bet that for 90% of people who used this program did NOT see a savings. Unless you dont count the extra car payment....this was a terrible program right now. People need to SAVING and CUTTING COSTS, not increasing debt.

Absolutely wrong. People need to get off the dime and spend some money, if you have any.
If everyone stops spending we will be in a worldwide depression. Those of you with money need to spend.

 

[Harvey]

Originally posted by: Patranus

Borrow/Print money to run government - Check
Borrow/print money to build cars/pay labor - Check
Lose money on each car built - Check
Borrow/Print money to give consumers incentives to buy cars - Check
Tax "borrowed/printed" money from consumers to pay for Government - Check
Tax "borrowed/printed" money from labor who built cars - Check

Help consumers buy new cars that cost less to drive and maintain - Check
Get gas guzzlers off the road for cars getting better milage, saving fuel and reducing pollution - Check
Boost sales of American cars, saving American jobs from assembly plants to dealerships - Check
Boost local economies where employees who now still have jobs live and spend their pay - Check
Increase Federal, state and local tax revenues from consumers because they can still consume - Check
Reduce Federal, state, and local expenditures for unemployment, welfare and other expenses to help the unemployed - Check

Anyone else see a problem?

Yeah! I see dogmatic right wingnut jackasses trying to put turds in the punchbowl of anything the Obama adminstration does, including a program like "Cash for Clunkers" that is working beyond all expectations. :roll:

THAT is a problem! :thumbsdown:

 

[Modelworks]

Originally posted by: blackangst1


I am willing to bet that for 90% of people who used this program did NOT see a savings. Unless you dont count the extra car payment....this was a terrible program right now. People need to SAVING and CUTTING COSTS, not increasing debt.

Agree. I am concerned that it may have caused people to buy cars that they normally would have not bought because they could not afford the monthly payment. Rather than wait till they could afford to pay for a new car they acted now because they wanted to get in on the savings..

My aunt is one cold hearted person I never really liked, the Aunt Scrooge of the family , but she was always smart about her money. Every so many years she buys a new car and pays cash. The day she drives it off the lot she starts putting money in a saving account for the next one. She has done that at least 4 times that I know about.

 

[JSt0rm]

Originally posted by: OCguy

Originally posted by: ZeGermans
Just dropping by to say that the money spent on this would pay for about 6 F-22's that don't work in the rain or near cell phones

It took you two hours for that horrible drive-by one liner?

more like most people here do other things then refresh the p&n page like you. Dont you work? Or do you hide in a cubical and hope no one notices you all day long.