[bitsandchips]: Pascal to not have improved Async Compute over Maxwell

[3DVagabond]

What happens when you have 8gb of system memory and the game/operating system uses 7.2gb's and your running @ 4k with 4gb of hbm? Where does it get the memory to stream then or does it just tank?

There is a few game that now recommend 16gb of system memory.
http://wolfsgamingblog.com/2015/10/...nt-system-requirements-recommend-16gb-of-ram/

Hmmm? I think I've found your solution.

 

[Det0x]

Seems like they were semi correct

http://www.bitsandchips.it/52-engli...scal-in-trouble-with-asyncronous-compute-code

Pascal in trouble with Asynchronous Compute code

According to our sources, next GPU micro architecture Pascal from NVIDIA will be in trouble if it will have to heavly use Asynchronous Compute code in video games.

Broadly speaking, Pascal will be an improved version of Maxwell, especially about FP64 performances, but not about Asyncronous Compute performances. NVIDIA will bet on raw power, instead of Asynchronous Compute abilities. This means that Pascal cards will be highly dependent on driver optimizations and games developers kindness. So, GamesWorks optimizations will play a fundamental role in company strategy.

 

[biostud]

If Nvidia cards are faster (or the same) without AC than AMD cards are with AC, what is the problem?

 

[Redentor]

Seems like they were semi correct

http://www.bitsandchips.it/52-engli...scal-in-trouble-with-asyncronous-compute-code

"NVIDIA will bet on raw power, instead of Asynchronous Compute abilities".

GTX1080 performances: DX12 with AC = DX12 w/o AC

 

[Actaeon]

If Nvidia cards are faster (or the same) without AC than AMD cards are with AC, what is the problem?

It is a problem for Nvidia because their brand new card is only 10% faster than previous generation AMD cards.

Vega will blow it out of the water and Nvidia has nothing to respond with. Volta is their next opportunity to really improve async compute and that is still two years out.

 

[2is]

It is a problem for Nvidia because their brand new card is only 10% faster than previous generation AMD cards.

Vega will blow it out of the water and Nvidia has nothing to respond with. Volta is their next opportunity to really improve async compute and that is still two years out.

Not really a problem for them when you can only make this claim for a single game.

 

[Arachnotronic]

Not really a problem for them when you can only make this claim for a single game.

A single game that virtually nobody plays. Ashes of The Singularity has done its job though -- promote AMD and sow the seeds of doubt for the "DX12 performance" of NVIDIA based cards.

Hope the Oxide guys got compensated nicely for this because AMD seems to be drawing tremendous value from it.

 

[AtenRa]

Not really a problem for them when you can only make this claim for a single game.

And lets see how it will perform in Warhummer and Deus Ex.

 

[thesmokingman]

A single game that virtually nobody plays. Ashes of The Singularity has done its job though -- promote AMD and sow the seeds of doubt for the "DX12 performance" of NVIDIA based cards.

Hope the Oxide guys got compensated nicely for this because AMD seems to be drawing tremendous value from it.

You keep downplaying Ashes but it will underpin future games from Stardock which make a helluva lot RTS games. But don't let that stop you.

 

[airfathaaaaa]

A single game that virtually nobody plays. Ashes of The Singularity has done its job though -- promote AMD and sow the seeds of doubt for the "DX12 performance" of NVIDIA based cards.

Hope the Oxide guys got compensated nicely for this because AMD seems to be drawing tremendous value from it.

60.000 for a space rts is damn good number
http://steamspy.com/app/228880
also

During a briefing call today, NVIDIA confirmed that their latest line-up of graphics cards will indeed natively support Async compute. Furthermore, they clarified that this has been achieved without the need for context switching. When discussing Async Compute, NVIDIA discussed the current testing procedure and explained basing results on Ashes of the Singularity isn’t the best idea

http://www.eteknix.com/nvidia-confirms-pascal-natively-supports-asynchronous-compute/

they are still downplaying it despite the fact that they do have"async support"

the problem is that on dx12 nvidia is only what 8-10% ahead of amd while bruteforcing

 

[TestKing123]

Can't seem to notice how convenient the DX12 benchmarks from Rise of the Tomb Raider is being ignored in favor of AoTS.

Rise of the Tomb Raider = graphical masterpiece
Ashes of the Singularity = isometric strategy game with subpar graphics that nobody plays

If I were concerned with DX12 performance, I know which game I'd be looking at first and foremost.

 

[AtenRa]

Can't seem to notice how convenient the DX12 benchmarks from Rise of the Tomb Raider is being ignored in favor of AoTS.

Rise of the Tomb Raider = graphical masterpiece
Ashes of the Singularity = isometric strategy game with subpar graphics that nobody plays

If I were concerned with DX12 performance, I know which game I'd be looking at first and foremost.

Is Async Compute enabled in Rise of the Tomb Rider in DX-12 ???

 

[Krteq]

Nope. It's enabled in XBONE version, but disabled in DX12 PC version.. you know, nVidia

 

[airfathaaaaa]

Can't seem to notice how convenient the DX12 benchmarks from Rise of the Tomb Raider is being ignored in favor of AoTS.

Rise of the Tomb Raider = graphical masterpiece
Ashes of the Singularity = isometric strategy game with subpar graphics that nobody plays

If I were concerned with DX12 performance, I know which game I'd be looking at first and foremost.

if you were concerned about dx12 you would have known that rotr dx12 path is broken
also on the joint nvidia amd panel they clearly stated that the games must be either dx11 or dx12 attempting to mix them up will lead up to weird things
(gow a dx9 game ported into dx12 with hbao+ broke amd cards and some nvidia cards)
(ark a dx11 game that apparently "cant work correctly with dx12" as per devs)
arma 3 almost the same fate as ark
rotr kinda works but doesnt really work like it suppose to on dx12

 

[Actaeon]

Not really a problem for them when you can only make this claim for a single game.

The availability of DX12 games and ones that benefit from Async compute is a separate issue and one I agree with. DX12 won't really start becoming prevalent until next year.

IMO, this is what limit's Maxwell's downside regarding lack of async support because it will be three to four years old by the time DX12 games become a huge factor. Pascal is brand new so it'll have a shorter effective lifespan. It will be prematurely obsolete (less than two years) and why it is a problem for Pascal.

 

[TestKing123]

Is Async Compute enabled in Rise of the Tomb Rider in DX-12 ???

Is Async compute going to overcome a 40fps defecit???
<redacted>


Link redacted, you can not create links that auto download files.
Markfw900

 

[AtenRa]

Is Async compute going to overcome a 40fps defecit???
<link redacted>

No, but we are talking about Async Compute here and Rise Of The Tomb Rider doesnt have it. That is why people ignore ROTTR benchmarks here.

 

[TestKing123]

My response was to fanboys who make this kind of statement:

the problem is that on dx12 nvidia is only what 8-10% ahead of amd while bruteforcing

Tomb Raider is a valid example of DX12 performance, yet ignored for obvious reasons.

 

[Zodiark1593]

It is a problem for Nvidia because their brand new card is only 10% faster than previous generation AMD cards.

Vega will blow it out of the water and Nvidia has nothing to respond with. Volta is their next opportunity to really improve async compute and that is still two years out.

Nvidia probably has GP100 to respond with, albeit at a far higher price than Vega.

 

[Stuka87]

Is Async compute going to overcome a 40fps defecit???

<link redacted>

If you read the few post just above yours, you will see why rotr benches are pointless to use.

 

[Zodiark1593]

What imaginary person games at 4k with 8 GB of system ram?

Since you didn't exclude old games (or DSR for that matter), I raise my hand.

 

[AtenRa]

My response was to fanboys who make this kind of statement:

the problem is that on dx12 nvidia is only what 8-10% ahead of amd while bruteforcing

Tomb Raider is a valid example of DX12 performance, yet ignored for obvious reasons.

If we are talking about DX-12 games in general than yes you are correct we should include ROTTR.

But personally i was only covering the Async Compute enabled Games because of the thread title.

 

[airfathaaaaa]

the reason as to why we dont care about games with mixed in api's is that
http://www.dualshockers.com/2016/03...-nvidia-and-amd-cards-lots-of-details-shared/

when you read it you will understand as to why games like rotr/gow/ark/arma3 wont never be a true dx12 game

 

[Despoiler]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bh7ECiXfMWQ&app=desktop

-The dynamic load balancing feature of Pascal is confirmed to be in the driver. 3m:25s
-Their async demo was done in DX11. lol? 12m:00s
-3 keys to "Nvidia async" are dynamic load balancing, pixel level preemption, and instruction level preemption.

 

[2is]

You keep downplaying Ashes but it will underpin future games from Stardock which make a helluva lot RTS games. But don't let that stop you.

It won't stop him. It won't stop me, it won't stop anyone. Notice how the AMD praise is already starting to narrow. First it was amd is better at DX12, not it's AMD is better at DX12 WITH Async Compute.

There's a reason why AOTS keeps being brought up... It's all the ADF has got, and it isn't much... So yeah, it isn't going to stop anyone from doing anything. Sorry to break the news, but AMD will have to do a lot more then continue to fall further behind to gain market share. Deluding their existing fanbase isn't going to get them there.

Not even arguing, you can go.

-Rvenger