BMW 325I

[JulesMaximus]

I'd drive a Mini Cooper if handled like the old ones did.

So, have you actually driven an original Mini Cooper or are you just regurgitating what you've read in car magazines?

 

[Don Vito Corleone]

Originally posted by: SkoorbTrue. Anybody who buys a G35 could buy a 325i instead. They don't, because they're more intested in getting car for their money instead of image. Funny thing is that for somebody like me that 325i will draw negative image, simply because I know that they bought it to be a poseur.

This is where I think you're dead wrong. To me, the essence of BMW is in the driving experience, something the 325i delivers. The most lionized BMW in America is probably the 2002, which was never meant as a luxury car. I would have no shame in driving a 325i with vinyl and manually-adjusted seats, because I see the car first and foremost as a sports sedan, not a personal luxury auto. The 325i is no poseur mobile, because it isn't a wannabe fancy car, but a true-blue sports sedan. See, e.g., the Car Talk review of the 328i, back in 1999: "The car is very solid and safe feeling. Is it a good deal? Probably not with the larger engine. Our test car cost $35,000. That's a lot. The 323i (with a perfectly nice 2.5-liter six-cylinder engine) might be a better deal. If we had to choose, we'd opt for the 323I for about $27,000."

 

[StageLeft]

The 325i is no poseur mobile, because it isn't a wannabe fancy car, but a true-blue sports sedan.

Well by God the thing is just SLOW. I can't really understand how somebody more interested in bang for buck or performance, vs. image of a BMW, would even consider buying a 325i (which will be unable to make ground at the lights against several econoboxes that cost HALF the price), when the competition puts the "sports" into sports sedan.

 

[Don Vito Corleone]

Originally posted by: Skoorb

The 325i is no poseur mobile, because it isn't a wannabe fancy car, but a true-blue sports sedan.

Well by God the thing is just SLOW. I can't really understand how somebody more interested in bang for buck or performance, vs. image of a BMW, would even consider buying a 325i (which will be unable to make ground at the lights against several econoboxes that cost HALF the price), when the competition puts the "sports" into sports sedan.

I don't agree it is slow, even if it is less quick than many cheaper cars. My Maxima is theoretically faster from 0-60, but a 325i would eat its lunch in a real-world drive on a county road, and provide vastly better driver feedback and more fun to boot. I have zero interest in racing econoboxes (or anyone else) at stoplights. There is a lot more to a car than how quickly it covers a quarter mile or reaches 60, and the 325i has the exact same class-leading suspension and drivetrain as the 328i, with a smaller engine. As I noted before, Automobile magazine recenly placed the 325i second in a test of $30K sedans, higher than the G35, Maxima (which placed last), IS300, etc.

 

[OS]

Originally posted by: Don_Vito

Originally posted by: SkoorbTrue. Anybody who buys a G35 could buy a 325i instead. They don't, because they're more intested in getting car for their money instead of image. Funny thing is that for somebody like me that 325i will draw negative image, simply because I know that they bought it to be a poseur.

This is where I think you're dead wrong. To me, the essence of BMW is in the driving experience, something the 325i delivers. The most lionized BMW in America is probably the 2002, which was never meant as a luxury car. I would have no shame in driving a 325i with vinyl and manually-adjusted seats, because I see the car first and foremost as a sports sedan, not a personal luxury auto. The 325i is no poseur mobile, because it isn't a wannabe fancy car, but a true-blue sports sedan. See, e.g., the Car Talk review of the 328i, back in 1999: "The car is very solid and safe feeling. Is it a good deal? Probably not with the larger engine. Our test car cost $35,000. That's a lot. The 323i (with a perfectly nice 2.5-liter six-cylinder engine) might be a better deal. If we had to choose, we'd opt for the 323I for about $27,000."

You know, you could apply nearly all of your arguments towards a classic AE86 RWD corolla GT-S. Does that make the AE86 better than entry level luxury cars? Sorry.

Besides, this whole "driving experience" and "fast in the twisties" argument sounds so. . . ricey. If anyone made that sort of argument on a civic vs a mustang, they'd be flamed to all kingdom come.

 

[Don Vito Corleone]

Originally posted by: OS

You know, you could apply nearly all of your arguments towards a classic AE86 RWD corolla GT-S. Does that make the AE86 better than entry level luxury cars? Sorry.

Besides, this whole "driving experience" and "fast in the twisties" argument sounds so. . . ricey. If anyone made that sort of argument on a civic vs a mustang, they'd be flamed to all kingdom come.

I don't know - I've never driven an AE86. I do know that I have driven a lot of cars in this category, and intangibles like steering feel and throttle response are what define the driving experience. I own a Maxima, but IMO a 325i is a MUCH better car, even if it is trivially slower in raw acceleration. I don't consider that "ricey," but I'm not sure I know what "ricey" means, so maybe you're right.

 

[StageLeft]

Originally posted by: Don_Vito

Originally posted by: OS

You know, you could apply nearly all of your arguments towards a classic AE86 RWD corolla GT-S. Does that make the AE86 better than entry level luxury cars? Sorry.

Besides, this whole "driving experience" and "fast in the twisties" argument sounds so. . . ricey. If anyone made that sort of argument on a civic vs a mustang, they'd be flamed to all kingdom come.

I don't know - I've never driven an AE86. I do know that I have driven a lot of cars in this category, and intangibles like steering feel and throttle response are what define the driving experience. I own a Maxima, but IMO a 325i is a MUCH better car, even if it is trivially slower in raw acceleration. I don't consider that "ricey," but I'm not sure I know what "ricey" means, so maybe you're right.

Your maxima is also a hell of a lot cheaper, and the new maximas WILL destroy a 325i in straightline (and cost cheaper to boot, and have more room).

And I've said in the past in regards to twisties that there are no such twisties in Birmingham that I'm aware of, unless you want to be constantly worried about an oncoming police car after every corner.

 

[Don Vito Corleone]

Originally posted by: Skoorb

Your maxima is also a hell of a lot cheaper, and the new maximas WILL destroy a 325i in straightline (and cost cheaper to boot, and have more room).

And I've said in the past in regards to twisties that there are no such twisties in Birmingham that I'm aware of, unless you want to be constantly worried about an oncoming police car after every corner.

As I said, consider the aforementioned Automobile test - the quick, roomy (but rather ponderous and wallowing) Max placed 12th of 12 in the same comparison test where the 325i placed second. I have only spend a bit of time in Birmingham, but have found lots of entertaining county roads outside Montgomery, and I'm sure they exist in Birmingham too.

I'm not sure why I continue to argue this - to each his own, and enjoy your car. I do enjoy my Max, but IMO even the most stripped-down 325i (which has a similar retail price) offers a vastly superior driving experience. I don't give a damn about prestige, nor do I care a lot about luxury, but I do care about the experience of driving.

 

[sxr7171]

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus

I'd drive a Mini Cooper if handled like the old ones did.

So, have you actually driven an original Mini Cooper or are you just regurgitating what you've read in car magazines?

Actually I have, on a visit to England. Sure it wasn't very powerful, but man was it fun. BTW, I don't really even read magazines and hence I cannot regurgitate from them as someone like you might do.

 

[StageLeft]

As I said, consider the aforementioned Automobile test - the quick, roomy (but rather ponderous and wallowing) Max placed 12th of 12 in the same comparison test where the 325i placed second. I have only spend a bit of time in Birmingham, but have found lots of entertaining county roads outside Montgomery, and I'm sure they exist in Birmingham too.

Well, the maxima is more of a family sedan than anything else, even if it can smoke a 325i in the quarter. It's also cheaper. did say I'd rather a 325i than a maxima... HOWEVER, not for the price difference. I would rather have it if they were the same price...maybe

And in terms of track times I should note that a sentra spec V, which can be had new for the ballpark of $15k has not only 4 doors, but also a superior power to weight ratio than the 325i, AND can outgrip it on the skidpad...(.90 G). Performance wise the 325i just can't compete with the TL/G35, "driving experience" or not

 

[hans007]

Originally posted by: Don_Vito

Originally posted by: SkoorbTrue. Anybody who buys a G35 could buy a 325i instead. They don't, because they're more intested in getting car for their money instead of image. Funny thing is that for somebody like me that 325i will draw negative image, simply because I know that they bought it to be a poseur.

This is where I think you're dead wrong. To me, the essence of BMW is in the driving experience, something the 325i delivers. The most lionized BMW in America is probably the 2002, which was never meant as a luxury car. I would have no shame in driving a 325i with vinyl and manually-adjusted seats, because I see the car first and foremost as a sports sedan, not a personal luxury auto. The 325i is no poseur mobile, because it isn't a wannabe fancy car, but a true-blue sports sedan. See, e.g., the Car Talk review of the 328i, back in 1999: "The car is very solid and safe feeling. Is it a good deal? Probably not with the larger engine. Our test car cost $35,000. That's a lot. The 323i (with a perfectly nice 2.5-liter six-cylinder engine) might be a better deal. If we had to choose, we'd opt for the 323I for about $27,000."

the problem with this is its a 5 year old review. the 328 became the 330 and now has a .2 L and 25 more HP. the other thing is that 323 and 328 were brand new in 1999 and their competitors then were far worse.

now the g35, is300 etc are viable competitors and for the g35 are fairly new in their product cycles. not to mention the 3series is a dated design at this point since in 1999 it wasnt THAT old but it is now (it is basically an e36 tweaked, hence now 10 years old)

 

[sxr7171]

Originally posted by: hans007

Originally posted by: Don_Vito

Originally posted by: SkoorbTrue. Anybody who buys a G35 could buy a 325i instead. They don't, because they're more intested in getting car for their money instead of image. Funny thing is that for somebody like me that 325i will draw negative image, simply because I know that they bought it to be a poseur.

This is where I think you're dead wrong. To me, the essence of BMW is in the driving experience, something the 325i delivers. The most lionized BMW in America is probably the 2002, which was never meant as a luxury car. I would have no shame in driving a 325i with vinyl and manually-adjusted seats, because I see the car first and foremost as a sports sedan, not a personal luxury auto. The 325i is no poseur mobile, because it isn't a wannabe fancy car, but a true-blue sports sedan. See, e.g., the Car Talk review of the 328i, back in 1999: "The car is very solid and safe feeling. Is it a good deal? Probably not with the larger engine. Our test car cost $35,000. That's a lot. The 323i (with a perfectly nice 2.5-liter six-cylinder engine) might be a better deal. If we had to choose, we'd opt for the 323I for about $27,000."

the problem with this is its a 5 year old review. the 328 became the 330 and now has a .2 L and 25 more HP. the other thing is that 323 and 328 were brand new in 1999 and their competitors then were far worse.

now the g35, is300 etc are viable competitors and for the g35 are fairly new in their product cycles. not to mention the 3series is a dated design at this point since in 1999 it wasnt THAT old but it is now (it is basically an e36 tweaked, hence now 10 years old)

It is true the 3-series could use a major redesign to more clearly beat away the newcomers but it really scares me thinking about how Bangle will butcher the car.

I think that all the German manufacturers are trying to have at least one model that plays the current "horsepower game" that the Japanese love to play, they cost a lot more but they also out perform the competitors. Examples are the new Audi S4 with a new V8, the C32 AMG with supercharged inline 6, and the BMW M3. Slowly the regular models get closer in power to the sport models and the sport models get even more powerful. Sooner or later this will have to stop as there are limits to how much power a car can have (and still be affordable).

 

[hans007]

Originally posted by: sxr7171

Originally posted by: hans007

Originally posted by: Don_Vito

Originally posted by: SkoorbTrue. Anybody who buys a G35 could buy a 325i instead. They don't, because they're more intested in getting car for their money instead of image. Funny thing is that for somebody like me that 325i will draw negative image, simply because I know that they bought it to be a poseur.

This is where I think you're dead wrong. To me, the essence of BMW is in the driving experience, something the 325i delivers. The most lionized BMW in America is probably the 2002, which was never meant as a luxury car. I would have no shame in driving a 325i with vinyl and manually-adjusted seats, because I see the car first and foremost as a sports sedan, not a personal luxury auto. The 325i is no poseur mobile, because it isn't a wannabe fancy car, but a true-blue sports sedan. See, e.g., the Car Talk review of the 328i, back in 1999: "The car is very solid and safe feeling. Is it a good deal? Probably not with the larger engine. Our test car cost $35,000. That's a lot. The 323i (with a perfectly nice 2.5-liter six-cylinder engine) might be a better deal. If we had to choose, we'd opt for the 323I for about $27,000."

the problem with this is its a 5 year old review. the 328 became the 330 and now has a .2 L and 25 more HP. the other thing is that 323 and 328 were brand new in 1999 and their competitors then were far worse.

now the g35, is300 etc are viable competitors and for the g35 are fairly new in their product cycles. not to mention the 3series is a dated design at this point since in 1999 it wasnt THAT old but it is now (it is basically an e36 tweaked, hence now 10 years old)

It is true the 3-series could use a major redesign to more clearly beat away the newcomers but it really scares me thinking about how Bangle will butcher the car.

I think that all the German manufacturers are trying to have at least one model that plays the current "horsepower game" that the Japanese love to play, they cost a lot more but they also out perform the competitors. Examples are the new Audi S4 with a new V8, the C32 AMG with supercharged inline 6, and the BMW M3. Slowly the regular models get closer in power to the sport models and the sport models get even more powerful. Sooner or later this will have to stop as there are limits to how much power a car can have (and still be affordable).

picturse of the new banglized 1 series are out. and well it reminds me of a pt cruiser with a bmw front fascia. that is scary.