Boehner finally concedes to raise taxes on the rich.

[Nemesis 1]

http://www.cnn.com/2012/12/05/politics/fiscal-cliff/index.html?hpt=hp_t1

Does this mean disaster averted? The major obstacle has now finally been removed. I think this could turn into a win for both parties since nobody cares about the top 2% except themselves. Although I don't like the Robin Hood mentality, it's better than across the board tax increases. Thoughts?

If its a rate increase on 500k. The dems caved into the rep. Don't let details ruin your fairytail

 

[Nemesis 1]

Yeah disaster averted. The government can reduce the $1.4 trillion deficit by $100 billion.

14 trillion is the correct number is it not ?

 

[Double Trouble]

Yay, raising tax on the rich will fix it all! Oh wait, it will fix nothing since the morons in DC continue to spend like drunken sailors. No amount of tax increases on the rich will fix anything at this point. I say lets go over that cliff, at least that way spending won't increase by as much. And if that puts the economy into recession, so be it.

 

[First]

Ya, they all keep it under mattresses. They don't have mansions built, buy more cars, hire people to work on thier houses. [/sarcasm]

lulz troll.

 

[michal1980]

sad if they cave. would show they have no back bone, and stand for nothing. Obama will then just continue to roll over them and rule like a dictator.

Just like he is right now 'Its my way or the highway' - Obama

 

[raildogg]

Take money from some people in order to supposedly give to a lot more people. Good job. That is all we need: higher taxes rather than cutting costs. Lets start more wars and buy more missiles. Lets give everyone what they want. That way, no one has to sacrifice, expect for people whom the government feels need to pay. This time they have chosen the top income group, who knows whose next.

 

[buckshot24]

Didn't Cheney say deficits don't matter?

Even if he did the deficits he was talking about were 10% of the ones we run now.

 

[Jhhnn]

Even if he did the deficits he was talking about were 10% of the ones we run now.

Hogwash. actual debt increases here-

http://www.treasurydirect.gov/govt/reports/pd/histdebt/histdebt_histo5.htm

We haven't run a $5T deficit.... no matter how desperately you need to exaggerate.

 

[schneiderguy]

The simple truth of the matter is that having lower tax rates on the top 1-2% of Americans actually takes money OUT of the economy. The rich don't have the need to spend money like everyone else. You lower their taxes, they hoard the money, not put it back in the economy. Lowering taxes or keeping low taxes on people who have no need to spend it hurts the economy by keeping money out of it. I personally right about crack the top 20% income, I support an increase in taxes on even my tax bracket.

Please explain how investing money is taking it out of the economy.

 

[Jhhnn]

Please explain how investing money is taking it out of the economy.

Depends on what you mean by investment. When it's used to build factories in China, it definitely goes out of the economy. When it's used merely to cover vast amounts of money swirling over our heads in derivatives, it's functionally out of the economy of normal commerce. when it's just about asset inflation in the market, it does commerce little to no good. When it piles up as corporate cash reserves, it's simply withheld from the economy. When it's used to buy govt securities, currently very popular, we might as well take part of it as taxes to gain the same result w/o interest or future financial obligation.

 

[shady28]

While I don't worry too much about the 2%, this type of thinking sets a dangerous precedent in the form of mob rule.

Here's something maybe closer to home if you don't get the point.

The top 25% of earners pay almost 90% of the taxes. 25% starts around 65k+ household income.

I bet many here who think this is ok fit that income level. Consider, the bottom 75% own your asses, all they have to do is vote.

That is not much removed from saying nobody cares about the top 1% who pay 30% of revenue, or the top 10% who pay about 55%. Make them pay more, because we can.

Reminds me of this quote :

-----

First they came for the communists,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a communist.

Then they came for the socialists,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a socialist.

Then they came for the trade unionists,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a trade unionist.

Then they came for me,
and there was no one left to speak for me.
-----

Now get back to work.

 

[Abraxas]

Nobody cares about the top 2% (except those of us who are in the 2%)? You guys sure as fuck to seem to care a lot about us. We have what you want - money - and are slobbering like the Foghorn Leghorn weasel trying to get after it.

You don't care about the 2%, except we are providing the new revenue.

The taxes for everyone should have been raised. According to the APPA Americans spent $50 BILLION on pets in 2011. All of us can afford to pay for school and infrastructure when we spend $50 BILLION on pets alone. Let me know when we are closing in on real poverty, not just American Poverty where we have to cancel HBO and drop our unlimited data plans to "make it."

Wow, I never knew. It must be so terrible to be among the most privileged people in one of the most privileged nations on Earth, enjoying a standard of living so much higher than the vast majority of your countrymen, let alone the rest of the planet. It must be so pressing to not have to worry about one illness or accident wiping out your life savings, not have to worry about an underwater mortgage or being fired because a bureaucrat decided he could pay workers in Sri Lanka to do the same job he pays you for. Having people expect you to pay back into a system that enables you to create and maintain your wealth through an advanced system of infrastructure, education, laws, etc. How burdensome it must be to have all that going for you that in spite of all your good fortune, that in spite of how good life has been to you, you still find room to play the pity card like the self centered, self entitled, spoiled child you seem to be. Woe; woe is you.

 

[Pr0d1gy]

Wow, I never knew. It must be so terrible to be among the most privileged people in one of the most privileged nations on Earth, enjoying a standard of living so much higher than the vast majority of your countrymen, let alone the rest of the planet. It must be so pressing to not have to worry about one illness or accident wiping out your life savings, not have to worry about an underwater mortgage or being fired because a bureaucrat decided he could pay workers in Sri Lanka to do the same job he pays you for. Having people expect you to pay back into a system that enables you to create and maintain your wealth through an advanced system of infrastructure, education, laws, etc. How burdensome it must be to have all that going for you that in spite of all your good fortune, that in spite of how good life has been to you, you still find room to play the pity card like the self centered, self entitled, spoiled child you seem to be. Woe; woe is you.

And these are the same idiots that call Welfare et al. "entitlements". They should know what entitlement feels like judging by their actions of the last 40+ years. Fucking reverse psychology bullshit is bullshit.

Suck it up, buttercup. The top tax rates should have never been lowered to where they are now. We were told it would create jobs. Count your blessings that enough Americans were stupid enough to believe that for as long as they did.

Exactly. They were caught in their own lies and now they're crying about it. What a bunch of fucking douchebags. The funny thing is there are plenty of rich people basically begging the government to raise taxes, like Stephen King, so you really don't have to do much mental gymnastics to figure out where these lower tax lies came from. Corporate America/Wall Street is the biggest enemy America has in the world at this moment.

 

[Doc Savage Fan]

14 trillion is the correct number is it not ?

I think you're confusing national debt and our annual deficit (where spending exceeds revenues). Our national debt is currently about $16.3T and our annual deficit is running around $1.1T. So, assuming no significant changes, our national debt will be about $17.4T this time next year.

 

[Genx87]

Yes, clearly that's what I said based on my post you just quoted. It's not hard to see that the economy (always the main driver of higher revenue) will significantly close the deficit with general economic growth; e.g. corporate tax receipts are higher with higher profits, and payroll revenue is higher as more people find work. Add in higher estate taxes, higher taxes on the upper 2% and especially higher investment taxes like dividends going back into the 30%'s from the current 15%, and that's easily an additional $700-$900B in revenue annually right there.

Sounds good. So what is your prediction for deficit if this all passes in the next budget cycle?

 

[hal2kilo]

Just like he is right now 'Its my way or the highway' - Obama

Really, must be nice to live in an alternate reality.

 

[EagleKeeper]

Suck it up, buttercup. The top tax rates should have never been lowered to where they are now. We were told it would create jobs. Count your blessings that enough Americans were stupid enough to believe that for as long as they did.

Difficult to create jobs when the overall economy has tanked; Jobs are created based on demand; there was no demand;

Everyone was sitting around paralyzed.

 

[Pr0d1gy]

Difficult to create jobs when the overall economy has tanked; Jobs are created based on demand; there was no demand;

Everyone was sitting around paralyzed.

Yeah, the economy has tanked yet corporations set a record for profits. Keep believing the bullshit. The only thing that tanked was the love for this great nation by the people who profit the most from it. Way to work it through, really brilliant.

 

[First]

Sounds good. So what is your prediction for deficit if this all passes in the next budget cycle?

I'll make a hard prediction once something actually passes, as sometimes the budgets are gimmicky and they might backload a lot of savings or taxes. Either way we'll still run a deficit without question, even if Obama's current (high opening bid) proposal passes into law. But I'm hoping less than half a trillion dollar deficit by 2014, I think that's realistic. But frankly it's all extremely dependent on economic growth, and China and Europe slowing down is not a good omen in the near term.

So unless Obama gets fleeced on tax rates somehow and only passes very small ones, we'll see significantly lower deficits either way. Which is great.

 

[michal1980]

Really, must be nice to live in an alternate reality.

No just in reality.

Wheres Obama's compromise? Where's Obama working with the republicans like he said he would?

Oh right, he said that crap to get relected.

Got his job back, and states - 'Increase tax rates, or I'll blow the economy up, and my media empire will insure you (republicans) take the blame.'

 

[piasabird]

In the Senate the Republicans asked the Democrats for a straight up vote on the President's Fiscal Tax Plan and the Domocrats refused to vote on it. They dont have the votes to pass their own bill!

 

[First]

In the Senate the Republicans asked the Democrats for a straight up vote on the President's Fiscal Tax Plan and the Domocrats refused to vote on it. They dont have the votes to pass their own bill!

Yawn, it's a bullshit gimmick since neither Obama (or Boehner) expect either of their proposals to be up for a vote in either chamber, since they're opening offers in a negotiation, not bills they expect to be passed into law as is. McConnell yet again with another waste of time request.

 

[Ldir]

Wow, I never knew. It must be so terrible to be among the most privileged people in one of the most privileged nations on Earth, enjoying a standard of living so much higher than the vast majority of your countrymen, let alone the rest of the planet. It must be so pressing to not have to worry about one illness or accident wiping out your life savings, not have to worry about an underwater mortgage or being fired because a bureaucrat decided he could pay workers in Sri Lanka to do the same job he pays you for. Having people expect you to pay back into a system that enables you to create and maintain your wealth through an advanced system of infrastructure, education, laws, etc. How burdensome it must be to have all that going for you that in spite of all your good fortune, that in spite of how good life has been to you, you still find room to play the pity card like the self centered, self entitled, spoiled child you seem to be. Woe; woe is you.

Let's all have a good cry for the rich. They are so oppressed. It's funny they don't just give away all their money so they too can reap the rewards of being poor.

 

[buckshot24]

But I'm hoping less than half a trillion dollar deficit by 2014, I think that's realistic.

Not a chance.

 

[buckshot24]

Difficult to create jobs when the overall economy has tanked; Jobs are created based on demand; there was no demand;

Everyone was sitting around paralyzed.

Yeah, and the implementation of Obamacare will just make it worse.