Boeing problems...

[Zorba]

I can only correct you on one thing, Zorba. FAA doesn't “approve" your MEL or your operating certificate, ie Part 91, 135, or 121. They “accept” it.

I’ve written, submitted, and had accepted at least four over my career. I’ve been retired for about 11 years now but I can't imagine that part of the FARs have changed.

Thanks, I typed accepted first, but then I thought it was approved. I haven't ever been directly involved in creating an MEL for an airline.

 

[Zorba]

Shoulda allowed higher quality union labor in that shop. Boeing has lost its lustre

Boeing Renton and Spirit Aerosystems are union shops.

 

[MrSquished]

Boeing Renton and Spirit Aerosystems are union shops.

ahh thanks for the correction. I wrongly assumed that they were using the SC plant where they had issues with the dreamliner.

 

[Zorba]

ahh thanks for the correction. I wrongly assumed that they were using the SC plant where they had issues with the dreamliner.

Yeah, that one is all 787 Dreamliner I believe.

 

[Pens1566]

RIP Boeing/United stock.

 

[[DHT]Osiris]

If you are referring to me I didn't know so I had to google.

Sorry no, I meant whoever did the wrong with the acronyms. I find that when someone's performing an after action report and there's a lot of acronyms involved, it probably means someone skipped some steps.

 

[[DHT]Osiris]

Ffs

View attachment 91572

Do they not tie bolts on airplanes like they do with whirlybirds?

 

[hal2kilo]

Do they not tie bolts on airplanes like they do with whirlybirds?

The video above had essentially cotter pins on at least the bottom bolts. Not the same, but indicates job was done. Someone's in a hurry and forgetting to go back with the torque wrench.

 

[trenchfoot]

Do they not tie bolts on airplanes like they do with whirlybirds?

You're referring to safety wiring the bolts?

 

[Drach]

You're referring to safety wiring the bolts?

I would hope so.
Amateur road racing motorcycles we had a tech inspection for that.
Couldn't go to tech inspection with fairings on.
If the airline industry is more lax than amateur road racers ill never get on a plane again.

 

[[DHT]Osiris]

You're referring to safety wiring the bolts?

Yeah, sorry, I was always a few steps removed from those things but I'm familiar with the what and the why.

I mean, that is the point of the safety wiring right? So it doesn't vibrate the little bastards out?

 

[trenchfoot]

Yeah, sorry, I was always a few steps removed from those things but I'm familiar with the what and the why.

I mean, that is the point of the safety wiring right? So it doesn't vibrate the little bastards out?

No prob, I assumed that's what you were referring to, just wanted to make sure.

 

[Zorba]

Yeah, sorry, I was always a few steps removed from those things but I'm familiar with the what and the why.

I mean, that is the point of the safety wiring right? So it doesn't vibrate the little bastards out?

Yeah, the nuts are supposed to be pinned. Not sure of the nut type, but distorted thread, self locking nuts are very common, giving you 2 locking methods.

 

[[DHT]Osiris]

Yeah, the nuts are supposed to be pinned. Not sure of the nut type, but distorted thread, self locking nuts are very common, giving you 2 locking methods.

So.. someone skipped a step?

 

[woolfe9998]

Without the minimum equipment lists (MEL), if a reading light on seat 36E burned out, the aircraft couldn't take off until it was replaced. The MEL allows them to fix the light within 10 days and go for now. Literally nothing on an airplane can be broken or not working without some sort of authorization, the MEL being the most common. The MEL is based on the safety design of the aircraft and takes redundancy into account. It also provides any additional inspections or operational restrictions required to operate with that item not working.

MELs can be abused, but the FAA and pilots come down hard on this. My old operator lost their ability to MEL the aux power units on some fleets because they were being used too often.


Sorry, I'll try to spell them out in the future.

Thanks for the explanation.

You only need to define an abbreviation once (in parens, for example) then you can continue to use it without clarification. "Minimum Equipment List" comes up straight away on Google, but not MEL.

 

[Lost_in_the_HTTP]

Idiot lights need to be prioritized. A seat or bathroom door light can be skipped for a short period.

A cabin pressure lights says (should say) the plane doesn't leave the ground.

 

[Lost_in_the_HTTP]

I haven't seen this mentioned here yet:

Passenger phone found on ground after Alaska Airlines emergency​

ABC|8 hours ago
NTSB investigators arrived in Portland, Oregon, on Saturday to begin their investigation into what happened on Alaska Flight 1282.


And they've found the door:

Emergency at 3 miles high: Alaska Airlines pilots, passengers kept calm after fuselage blowout​

Passengers remained surprisingly calm after an Alaska Airlines flight had part of its fuselage blow out three miles above Oregon.

 

[Zorba]

Article on the United Findings. This looks like the bolts that were loose were not the lockout bolts but the bolts that hold the fittings on to the door.

United finds loose bolts on plug doors during 737 Max 9 inspections

United Airlines has found loose bolts and other parts on 737 Max 9 plug doors as it inspects its fleet of Boeing jets following the Friday rapid depressurization aboard an Alaska Airlines jet of the same make, according to three people familiar with the findings.

theaircurrent.com

Idiot lights need to be prioritized. A seat or bathroom door light can be skipped for a short period.

A cabin pressure lights says (should say) the plane doesn't leave the ground.

There are 2 automatic controllers and you can manually control. To dispatch the aircraft without one of the automatic controllers (which Alaska never did), the other automatic controller and the manual control must work correctly.

The investigation will determine if it was related or not, but good chance it wasn't related. Doors scream and howl loudly when they leak. I think a leak big enough to set an automatic pressurization lights would have been obvious to people on the aircraft.

 

[skyking]

The United discovery is good news for Alaska.
Someone had mentioned that possibly Alaska had messed up the door with their own inspection and acceptance process.
Now we can assume the fleet wide inspections are the right thing to do.
It also means that the emergency Airworthiness Directive ( AD) system is working as it is intended.
Something changed in the process with the MAX. They'll find it and there will be some FAA hand-slapping. They may have to slap their own hands for a lack of oversight.

 

[iRONic]

Whirlybirds… Shitlol

Not as bad as Chopper I guess. *shrug*

 

[ElFenix]

Shoulda allowed higher quality union labor in that shop. Boeing got taken over by McDonnell Douglas* and Douglas's beancounter jack welch sycophants were put in charge and moved the corporate hq to chicago so that an engineer in seattle couldn't walk into the president's office to say, 'we need to change this or people are going to die.'




*boeing was run by a bunch of engineers who didn't realize that mcdonnell was buying boeing using boeing's money

ftfy

 

[Lost_in_the_HTTP]

Some bits:

"Only seven seats on the flight were unoccupied, and as fate would have it, these included the two seats closest to the blown-out hole. "

--------

"On Sunday, a passenger’s cellphone that had been sucked out of the plane was found. It was still operational, having survived its plunge from the sky.

It was open to the owner’s baggage claim receipt. "

Twisted metal, rushing wind: A narrowly avoided disaster as jet's wall rips away at 3 miles high

The loud boom startled passenger Kelly Bartlett, and the roaring wind that followed left her unnerved.

apnews.com

 

[Paratus]

“
Shoulda allowed higher quality union labor in that shop. Boeing got taken over by McDonnell Douglas* and Douglas's beancounter jack welch sycophants were put in charge and moved the corporate hq to chicago so that an engineer in seattle couldn't walk into the president's office to say, 'we need to change this or people are going to die.'




*boeing was run by a bunch of engineers who didn't realize that mcdonnell was buying boeing using boeing's money”

ftfy

Quote for MF truth.

 

[iRONic]

“Why aren't the black boxes made out of the same material an iPhone is???"

 

[K1052]

“Why aren't the black boxes made out of the same material an iPhone is???"

Well honestly it would be good if the CVR could record for as many hours...