Boeing problems...

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Zorba

Lifer
Oct 22, 1999
15,395
11,004
136
Well honestly it would be good if the CVR could record for as many hours...
Yeah, thank the pilot's unions for that. Preserving the CVR is also on the parking check list. I think pilots have learned they can get away with not preserving it and not get in trouble. To combat this the FAA should mandate all CVRs be 25 hours (they would still be cleared after nominal flights). The pilots have brought it on themselves by purposely destroying evidence.
 
Nov 17, 2019
12,717
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Well honestly it would be good if the CVR could record for as many hours...
Related:



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trenchfoot

Lifer
Aug 5, 2000
15,143
7,653
136
Yeah, the nuts are supposed to be pinned. Not sure of the nut type, but distorted thread, self locking nuts are very common, giving you 2 locking methods.

"Pinned" as in "cotter pin"?



Most suspension and many steering parts on automobiles have castle nuts, (nuts that have slots machined or forged across the top half of the nuts) with a matching hole drilled through the bolt it gets screwed on whereby after the nut is torqued, the nearest matching slot and hole gets lined up (preferably tightened not loosened) and a cotter pin is installed through the matching slot and hole, thus preventing the nut from backing out.
 

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Zorba

Lifer
Oct 22, 1999
15,395
11,004
136
"Pinned" as in "cotter pin"?

View attachment 91638

Most suspension and many steering parts on automobiles have castle nuts, (nuts that have slots machined or forged across the top half of the nuts) with a matching hole drilled through the bolt it gets screwed on whereby after the nut is torqued, the nearest matching slot and hole gets lined up (preferably tightened not loosened) and a cotter pin is installed through the matching slot and hole, thus preventing the nut from backing out.
Yes, castellated nuts with a cotter pin.
 

Paratus

Lifer
Jun 4, 2004
17,217
14,788
146
"Pinned" as in "cotter pin"?

View attachment 91638

Most suspension and many steering parts on automobiles have castle nuts, (nuts that have slots machined or forged across the top half of the nuts) with a matching hole drilled through the bolt it gets screwed on whereby after the nut is torqued, the nearest matching slot and hole gets lined up (preferably tightened not loosened) and a cotter pin is installed through the matching slot and hole, thus preventing the nut from backing out.
In space applications using bolts where catastrophic hazards exist we have so many controls to make sure the bolts are quality and installed via certified processes. Then we have a verifications to make sure that was all done correctly.

Designs using bolts have to have a secondary locking mechanism like you have there and the design has to tolerate 1-2 bolts out.
 

hal2kilo

Lifer
Feb 24, 2009
24,512
11,145
136
In space applications using bolts where catastrophic hazards exist we have so many controls to make sure the bolts are quality and installed via certified processes. Then we have a verifications to make sure that was all done correctly.

Designs using bolts have to have a secondary locking mechanism like you have there and the design has to tolerate 1-2 bolts out.
There are similar practices with regards to submarines. Sub safe is the word. Better have paper work based on reality or you end up getting canned. Jackson lost it's Bull Nuke and CO when it couldn't submerge due to someone not removing the vent covers before departing.
 
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dainthomas

Lifer
Dec 7, 2004
14,676
3,560
136
There are similar practices with regards to submarines. Sub safe is the word. Better have paper work based on reality or you end up getting canned. Jackson lost it's Bull Nuke and CO when it couldn't submerge due to someone not removing the vent covers before departing.

One of the guys at TTF in Bangor told us that if you touch one bolt on one of the missile tube covers, you have to take them all off and redo them in proper order.
 

hal2kilo

Lifer
Feb 24, 2009
24,512
11,145
136
They thought all their problems would go away if they move the headquarters remotely to Chicago.
An ex-Boeing employee worked in the DOD shop I supported. He had to support a DASO mission in San Diego. He would not fly, and would only go on Amtrack after the things he saw while working for Boeing. He was an idiot, so I wrote him off. Now, I'm beginning to wonder.
One of the guys at TTF in Bangor told us that if you touch one bolt on one of the missile tube covers, you have to take them all off and redo them in proper order.
Absopositively. It's really embarrassing also if you are stuffing a tube and forget to pull the ladder out of one access doors to the tube. That's was quite the standdown.
 
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brycejones

Lifer
Oct 18, 2005
28,030
27,437
136
What the hell is wrong with Boeing? They used to be the gold standard. Suggest watching Downfall on Netflix. Story about the crashes of the Boeing 737 Max 8. Some CEO's of major carriers said they are considering switching to Airbus.

Just because it happens on a Boeing doesn't mean it's a Boeing issue. 757s have been out of production for 20 years. I'm willing to bet this is a maintenance issue at the airline level.

But your larger point is valid. Boeing is facing an existential threat to their business if they don't fix their culture and regain trust. Frankly one of the dumbest things they've done is move the HQ to Chicago and separate the senior leadership team from the products they build.

The results of management by spreadsheet are clear and it's a disaster for them.
 
Reactions: hal2kilo
Dec 10, 2005
25,515
8,938
136
Just because it happens on a Boeing doesn't mean it's a Boeing issue. 757s have been out of production for 20 years. I'm willing to bet this is a maintenance issue at the airline level.

But your larger point is valid. Boeing is facing an existential threat to their business if they don't fix their culture and regain trust. Frankly one of the dumbest things they've done is move the HQ to Chicago and separate the senior leadership team from the products they build.

The results of management by spreadsheet are clear and it's a disaster for them.
But for a short period of time, they created shareholder value, the most important thing in any business (lol).
 

Zorba

Lifer
Oct 22, 1999
15,395
11,004
136
What the hell is wrong with Boeing? They used to be the gold standard. Suggest watching Downfall on Netflix. Story about the crashes of the Boeing 737 Max 8. Some CEO's of major carriers said they are considering switching to Airbus.

What's wrong is for the last 25 years it's been a string of Jack Welch loving management at the top. They've hallowed out the experience, won't pay to train people. Also IIRC in the negotiation around 2016 with the IEM they massively slashed wages for new mechanics. So when you are only paying mechanics slightly above minimum wage, you are going to get minimum wage style labor.
 

Zorba

Lifer
Oct 22, 1999
15,395
11,004
136
Just because it happens on a Boeing doesn't mean it's a Boeing issue. 757s have been out of production for 20 years. I'm willing to bet this is a maintenance issue at the airline level.

But your larger point is valid. Boeing is facing an existential threat to their business if they don't fix their culture and regain trust. Frankly one of the dumbest things they've done is move the HQ to Chicago and separate the senior leadership team from the products they build.

The results of management by spreadsheet are clear and it's a disaster for them.
Yeah, this isn't the first time a 757 has lost a NLG wheel, the times I've seen it before it was always maintenance induced. The NLG wheels are replaced roughly every 300 landings, so lots of opportunities for someone to screw it up.
 
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hal2kilo

Lifer
Feb 24, 2009
24,512
11,145
136
One of the guys at TTF in Bangor told us that if you touch one bolt on one of the missile tube covers, you have to take them all off and redo them in proper order.
That's exactly where my field office was, across the street in the SWS Maintenance shops building.
 
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hal2kilo

Lifer
Feb 24, 2009
24,512
11,145
136
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hal2kilo

Lifer
Feb 24, 2009
24,512
11,145
136
Yeah, this isn't the first time a 757 has lost a NLG wheel, the times I've seen it before it was always maintenance induced. The NLG wheels are replaced roughly every 300 landings, so lots of opportunities for someone to screw it up.
I was thinking the very same thing. Landing gear probably is one of the highest maintenance items, and unfortunately, people F up.
 

Zorba

Lifer
Oct 22, 1999
15,395
11,004
136
I was thinking the very same thing. Landing gear probably is one of the highest maintenance items, and unfortunately, people F up.
Yeah, luckily the only real risk is hitting something on the ground. The aircraft is designed to lose a tire.
 

hal2kilo

Lifer
Feb 24, 2009
24,512
11,145
136
What the hell is wrong with Boeing? They used to be the gold standard. Suggest watching Downfall on Netflix. Story about the crashes of the Boeing 737 Max 8. Some CEO's of major carriers said they are considering switching to Airbus.

Looks like McDonnel Douglas management practices took over Boeing after it acquired Douglas.


And once again letting companies police themselves, is a better idea NOT.
 
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hal2kilo

Lifer
Feb 24, 2009
24,512
11,145
136
Related:



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One of the divisions of the corporation I used to work for, L3 now LHX, makes those things. Obviously, they moved on to SSD's quite a while back. They will just make ones with a easily increased memory. Being that they are made to take massive G forces, there's no memory card to just exchange though.
 

brycejones

Lifer
Oct 18, 2005
28,030
27,437
136
It seemed like a 50/50 battle for many years but Airbus clearly has the upper hand now.

LOL WTF when will it end?

The only way it will change is if the company’s culture changes. Even then it looks like they lost a lot of experienced employees and it will take them years to relearn the lessons those folks already had. It’s a going to be a slow rolling shit show for the next several years.
 
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