Breonna Taylor - Charges Against Officers

[s0me0nesmind1]

Didn't really see a dedicated thread on this - yet this was a major recent decision that will inevitably spark this week's protests.

Attorney general ended up only charging one of the officers - and it wasn't for murder but more along the lines of recklessly shooting.

Breonna Taylor: Police officer charged but not over death

Brett Hankison fired 10 rounds into her apartment and is accused of endangering her neighbours.

www.bbc.com

Brett Hankison has been charged, not with Ms Taylor's death, but with "wanton endangerment" for firing into a neighbour's apartment in Louisville.
Two other officers who were involved have not been charged.

Personally I think there's some problems on all fronts. Irrational frothing at the mouth lefties won't settle for anything other than 1st Degree murder charges for each officer.

Righties will probably say the officers are entirely innocent.

Reality is somewhere inbetween. If officers are being shot at - you can expect fire to be returned. Goodluck getting a murder charge. Are you expecting them to cower in fear and run away when shots were fired?




But what pisses me the fuck off about this whole thing is the part that NO ONE cares to discuss.... Who is ultimately liable for this? The answer is REALLY fucking simple. The person most liable for this is the judge that approved a warrant. Period. End of story. They are the cause of this. They are supposed to be the checks and balance. They weren't and they never are.

2nd person that is liable should be the officers, investigators, etc... whomever presented the (obvious false) evidence to the judge.

Those are the parties responsible for these events the most. But for some blissful reason we just ignore that and just directly point the finger at the officers that were tasked with performing the warrant. They conduct the warrant - and they get shot at. They respond with shots.



Doing things like raiding a home with guns drawn should require SUBSTANTIAL evidence to approve. I'm talking documented videos and photos of people hauling in bricks of cocaine/heroin or something to that scale. They make it sound like there was a meth lab going on - but the reality was obviously otherwise.

 

[vi edit]

There was a derelict of duty across multiple phases of this. The judge. The raid team. The KY AG telling half truths or a piece of the truth to the jury and public. Ultimately it's our entire criminal and judicial process that is fucked sideways and has a blank check of "oops, immunity" at the end.

Of any of the BLM catalysts this year, this one made me sick to the core. The steady string of bullshit and half truths spread across media. And ultimately a total lack of sympathy and compassion by a depressingly large number of people keeps us where we are. Money won't bring her back. Justice won't stop it in the future. Only change. So far we've done next to nothing on that front.

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

There was a derelict of duty across multiple phases of this. The judge. The raid team. The KY AG telling half truths or a piece of the truth to the jury and public. Ultimately it's our entire criminal and judicial process that is fucked sideways and has a blank check of "oops, immunity" at the end.

Of any of the BLM catalysts this year, this one made me sick to the core. The steady string of bullshit and half truths spread across media. And ultimately a total lack of sympathy and compassion by a depressingly large number of people keeps us where we are. Money won't bring her back. Justice won't stop it in the future. Only change. So far we've done next to nothing on that front.

I ultimately agree with your statements.

My specific problem is that the specific parties that I believe to be the MOST responsible for this aren't being looked at. Do you agree?

 

[vi edit]

I think the problem here, is that there were so many deficiencies in the process, we're a bit at a loss to start. And it doesn't help when the state AG doesn't seem interested in really addressing any of them.

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

I think the problem here, is that there were so many deficiencies in the process, we're a bit at a loss to start. And it doesn't help when the state AG doesn't seem interested in really addressing any of them.

I have to agree with the AG that upon raiding a home (that you are told is a drug meth lab) that drawing return fire isn't worthy of a murder charge.

They aren't responsible for defending themselves. They aren't responsible for the fact that they shouldn't have been raiding the apartment to begin with.

I just have a general problem where people like judges who make FUCKING HUGE decisions are immediately seen as not responsible for their decisions.

 

[Fenixgoon]

Do my eyes deceive me? will this be one of those rare topics where everyone in ATPN is in basic agreement?

 

[Zorba]

I basically agree with the OP. The judge should bare some consequence for approving an in needed no knock warrant.

No knock warrants should be extremely rare and only carried out by SWAT. Plan clothes cops should never serve forced entry warrants, much less no knock warrants (this is just obvious).

But the first two cops have a legal right to self defense and we're legally serving a warrant, so I don't see how they could be charged with much of anything. Unless they traced a bullet in Taylor to the cop in the parking lot, I think it would be really hard to charge him with more than what he got. However, if his bullets did hit her, he should be getting manslaughter charges.

 

[UNCjigga]

Personally I think there's some problems on all fronts. Irrational frothing at the mouth lefties won't settle for anything other than 1st Degree murder charges for each officer.

While I agree with many of your points—this statement is patently false. I think far more people believe this to be a case of manslaughter (or negligent homicide at worst) vs. murder, and certainly not “murder 1”. Also, forensics seems to have traced whose gun fired which bullets, so no need to charge all the officers with the same crime.

But yeah, those who sought and signed off on the warrant do bear some responsibility as well. Ultimately, tax payers will pick up their tab in the civil settlement.

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

Do my eyes deceive me? will this be one of those rare topics where everyone in ATPN is in basic agreement?

Spoiler

Your eyes do indeed deceive you... I guarantee that plenty of people here are a part of the group I mentioned frothing at the mouth demanding murder in the 1st degree charges.

 

[mect]

I think I'm going to mess up all the agreement taking place in this thread, but I think the gun lobby in America is also bears much of the blame for this. Until Americans can get past compensating for their dick size with the size of their guns, we are going to live in a society where police are regularly concerned about who has a gun and we're going to continue to have trigger fingers going off when they didn't need to. And sometimes when they did need to, but wouldn't have needed to if society weren't obsessed with guns.

 

[ch33zw1z]

This situation really highlights then problems with the CJ system. Facts don't matter, judge has no consequences, police just get things rubber stamped, and people get killed without justification and many people just shrug it off. Things need to change.

 

[VRAMdemon]

I agree with all the points about the system and approval of such a warrant by a judge. However ... if a trained police officer doesn’t at least take a second to pause and think: why am I busting through a wooden fence to apprehend a young adult who hasn’t broken any laws? we need either different training or different police officers. Are they law enforcement officers, or are they just weapons to be aimed at whomever the higher ups direct them to? Even though it is not currently the case, I would hope someday that there is at least some overlap between doing something so egregiously wrong as a police officer that resulted in needless death and you cost the city $12,000,000 in a settlement and some level of serious criminal culpability.

 

[Sunburn74]

As an african american, I have mixed feelings about the case. Firstly the fact that the grand jury reached no indictment on higher charges is baloney. It mostly shows that the case was sabotaged from the beginning. Grand jurys have no defense. A prosecutor can simply say my assessment of the situation warrants charges and a trial and they get it because if that's the only evidence submitted there is no counter evidence. Grand juries are not trials; they are basically one sided shows that should always lead to a pre-determined outcome. This outcome was a finding of not guilt, and by default it was pre-determined.

I do think overall, you can't throw people in jail for returning fire when fired upon.
However, you can throw people in jail for making mistakes that lead to this type of situation. If an engineer make a mistake that leads to a bridge collapsing, they go to jail for negligence. The same should be true here. Someone was clearly negligent and make preventable mistakes and that led to a death. They should face the law.
It's also sad that there was no indictment for bullets entering a black neighbors home but only for those that entered the homes of a white neighbor.

My general assessment of the situation is it was rigged from the get-go which makes the whole thing stink. The fact that this lady is dead and STILL no one had admitted wrong doing is a travesty.

 

[Jaskalas]

There was a derelict of duty across multiple phases of this. The judge. The raid team. The KY AG telling half truths or a piece of the truth to the jury and public. Ultimately it's our entire criminal and judicial process that is fucked sideways and has a blank check of "oops, immunity" at the end.

Of any of the BLM catalysts this year, this one made me sick to the core. The steady string of bullshit and half truths spread across media. And ultimately a total lack of sympathy and compassion by a depressingly large number of people keeps us where we are. Money won't bring her back. Justice won't stop it in the future. Only change. So far we've done next to nothing on that front.

I am 100% in favor of changes that will prevent future deaths.
Though I see nothing wrong in officers returning fire when fired upon.
Suppose one of them got careless when aiming and could have hurt people in rooms next door.
But the death itself was 100% expected and legal based on the circumstances. What we need to do is change those circumstances - for everyone.

 

[ivwshane]

Didn't really see a dedicated thread on this - yet this was a major recent decision that will inevitably spark this week's protests.

Attorney general ended up only charging one of the officers - and it wasn't for murder but more along the lines of recklessly shooting.

Breonna Taylor: Police officer charged but not over death

Brett Hankison fired 10 rounds into her apartment and is accused of endangering her neighbours.

www.bbc.com

Personally I think there's some problems on all fronts. Irrational frothing at the mouth lefties won't settle for anything other than 1st Degree murder charges for each officer.

Righties will probably say the officers are entirely innocent.

Reality is somewhere inbetween. If officers are being shot at - you can expect fire to be returned. Goodluck getting a murder charge. Are you expecting them to cower in fear and run away when shots were fired?




But what pisses me the fuck off about this whole thing is the part that NO ONE cares to discuss.... Who is ultimately liable for this? The answer is REALLY fucking simple. The person most liable for this is the judge that approved a warrant. Period. End of story. They are the cause of this. They are supposed to be the checks and balance. They weren't and they never are.

2nd person that is liable should be the officers, investigators, etc... whomever presented the (obvious false) evidence to the judge.

Those are the parties responsible for these events the most. But for some blissful reason we just ignore that and just directly point the finger at the officers that were tasked with performing the warrant. They conduct the warrant - and they get shot at. They respond with shots.



Doing things like raiding a home with guns drawn should require SUBSTANTIAL evidence to approve. I'm talking documented videos and photos of people hauling in bricks of cocaine/heroin or something to that scale. They make it sound like there was a meth lab going on - but the reality was obviously otherwise.

I addressed it and made my recommendations in the other thread.

You are excusing incompetence. Should incompetence be a death sentence? Is it ok that Americans are killed by the government on accident?

What to Know About Breonna Taylor’s Death

Her killing by the police in Louisville, Ky., led to federal and state charges against officers. But one trial ended in acquittal, another in a hung jury, and a judge has dismissed some charges.

www.nytimes.com

One thing I found disturbing was that the reason they were there in the first place was because they believed breonnas apartment was being used as a package drop AND that breonna herself and her boyfriend were both not suspects in the case.

That just seems like really bad policing and detective work. The fact that non suspect was killed should immediately result in the firing of all involved, including the judge, the supervisors, and of course the police officers.

 

[HomerJS]

Do my eyes deceive me? will this be one of those rare topics where everyone in ATPN is in basic agreement?

I'll bust the gaslighting bubble of the OP for a moment.

The family wanted manslaughter charges. Seems reasonable under the circumstances.

Why has nobody talked about BT's boyfriend's right to defend himself in their home? He tried to call 911 which means he clearly didn't know it was the police at the door.

Since evidence to date indicates the cops should have not been there in the first place, manslaughter seems appropriate. Don't drunk drivers get serious jail time even though they don't intend on killing anyone?

There were multi[le other witnesses who would have heard the so called announcement yet the DA went with the only one who helps absolve police responsibility.

Gov. Bashear - D has called for the release of the grand jury evidence. The DA is refusing. Rising Republican, star go figure.

We already know police falsified the report after the shooting claiming BT was not injured.

This case smells of wrong doing up and down. There needs to be an FBI investigation. Something out of the range of Barr who would water it down.

OP - Thinks he can predict responses of the left. What trips him up we operate on ethics and principles. His responses are tribal. That's why he's so predictable. In many cases he's afraid to stand up for his positions because he knows they are not based on reality.

 

[OILFIELDTRASH]

I have to agree with the AG that upon raiding a home (that you are told is a drug meth lab) that drawing return fire isn't worthy of a murder charge.

They aren't responsible for defending themselves. They aren't responsible for the fact that they shouldn't have been raiding the apartment to begin with.

I just have a general problem where people like judges who make FUCKING HUGE decisions are immediately seen as not responsible for their decisions.

I'm pretty sure they had surveillance on the apartment for months and it was pretty much confirmed they were moving drugs. Not sure why that is not reason to have a warrant?

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

I do think overall, you can't throw people in jail for returning fire when fired upon.
However, you can throw people in jail for making mistakes that lead to this type of situation. If an engineer make a mistake that leads to a bridge collapsing, they go to jail for negligence. The same should be true here. Someone was clearly negligent and make preventable mistakes and that led to a death. They should face the law.

And this is my precise problem.

For all we know - the officers are given a piece of paper that says "Serve this warrant here - we have evidence to suggest that there is a big drug ring going on here".

This is why I'm saying the judge and investigation team that gave them the warrant are the ones who should be charged with the crimes - or at least, the most severe crimes.

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

I'm pretty sure they had surveillance on the apartment for months and it was pretty much confirmed they were moving drugs. Not sure why that is not reason to have a warrant?

I'm open to any evidence suggesting such. Considering they found nothing in the place indicated to me otherwise.

But again, feel free to prove me wrong there. I'm all ears - and I haven't heard of them having surveillance with documented proof.

 

[OILFIELDTRASH]

I'm open to any evidence suggesting such. Considering they found nothing in the place indicated to me otherwise.

But again, feel free to prove me wrong there. I'm all ears - and I haven't heard of them having surveillance with documented proof.

UPDATED: Shocking Report Leaked in Breonna Taylor Death Investigation Shows How Involved She Really Was

UPDATE: New Investigative Files have been exclusively leaked to the Tatum Report. At the bottom of this page, you'll find the original leaked report as well as the newly leaked files and pictures from Breonna Taylor's boyfriend, Kenneth Walker's phone. An anonymous source has provided the Tatum

www.tatumreportexclusive.com

 

[HomerJS]

UPDATED: Shocking Report Leaked in Breonna Taylor Death Investigation Shows How Involved She Really Was

UPDATE: New Investigative Files have been exclusively leaked to the Tatum Report. At the bottom of this page, you'll find the original leaked report as well as the newly leaked files and pictures from Breonna Taylor's boyfriend, Kenneth Walker's phone. An anonymous source has provided the Tatum

www.tatumreportexclusive.com

You going to buy so called leaked evidence from a PD that falsified the police report on her shooting? It's going to take a lot more then some bullshit assed website to convince me otherwise.

Their credibility is very low

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

You going to buy so called leaked evidence from a PD that falsified the police report on her shooting? It's going to take a lot more then some bullshit assed website to convince me otherwise.

Their credibility is very low

I flipped through it - real or not, I don't see a bombshell worthy of a warrant.

I want to see someone bringing in boxes of cocaine or glimpses of a meth-lab inside or something.

There is some evidence of some drug use/selling - but were talking small amounts. That isn't worthy of a warrant, that's worthy of an arrest at the scene of a drug-deal.

 

[OILFIELDTRASH]

I flipped through it - real or not, I don't see a bombshell worthy of a warrant.

I want to see someone bringing in boxes of cocaine or glimpses of a meth-lab inside or something.

There is some evidence of some drug use/selling - but were talking small amounts. That isn't worthy of a warrant, that's worthy of an arrest at the scene of a drug-deal.

What about a dead body in a rental car in her name? You don't think they were looking to get these people after they skated on a homicide?

 

[HomerJS]

What about a dead body in a rental car in her name? You don't think they were looking to get these people after they skated on a homicide?

C-R-E-D-I-B-I-L-I-T-Y

Need better sources. Once you lie on a police report I'm not going to believe a fucking thing you say without corroboration.

 

[MrSquished]

What about a dead body in a rental car in her name? You don't think they were looking to get these people after they skated on a homicide?

Did Breonna Taylor assassinate John F Kennedy too?