Brexit Deal Voted down in "Historic Defeat" according to BBC News site (Brexit still happening but PM May is in trouble)

[hal2kilo]

Its a shit show for sure, yet, when the dust settles, whats left of Britain may be a fraction of what it used to be, the rest will be back with the EU. Poor Brits managed to shoot themselves in the head good and proper.
All it takes is a few corrupt populist politicians and down it goes.

Hopefully, after all this, they will maintain their whiteness.

 

[obidamnkenobi]

Theresa May (previous PM up until... sometime last year I think) couldn't get her deal through parliament, so a general election was had. For unfathomable reasons the electorate handed the tories a commanding lead in parliament so they now have a tonne of brexit disciples saying yes to brexit no matter what.

this is the part I followed

Boris Johnson negotiated a new deal, withdrawal agreement was signed off in parliament and in the EU, then recently Boris said that deal was rubbish and wants to decide what parts of the withdrawal deal he wants to honour despite the alleged fact that it breaks international law. The EU is saying wtf.

this makes no sense... So all normal for brexit then!

 

[Wreckem]

Basically the tories and their followers are going to jump off the cliff and have a hard Brexit with the EU.

 

[Jhhnn]

Basically the tories and their followers are going to jump off the cliff and have a hard Brexit with the EU.

They may well force Ulster out of the UK in the process. A hard border with the Irish Republic would mean blood, I'm sure.

 

[mikeymikec]

Basically the tories and their followers are going to jump off the cliff and have a hard Brexit with the EU.

That's what I'm afraid of. I just don't get it though: no amount of political spin will change the pain from a sharp recession, and I doubt that covid mismanagement will line up nicely for a coincidental "that recession wasn't caused by brexit" bit of spin, but I suppose it might.

 

[mikeymikec]

They may well force Ulster out of the UK in the process. A hard border with the Irish Republic would mean blood, I'm sure.

That too, and I don't see any way for them to spin that one.

 

[K1052]

*rubs hands together*

 

[pmv]

I have to hope Trump soon does something damaging and absurd, in order to knock us off the top of the 'idiot country' league table again. (Losing the election and refusing to accept the result would do it, I think). Otherwise we may hang on to that Number One spot.

 

[zinfamous]

The whole farce gets worse-and-worse. The party of 'law and order' openly admitting to deliberately breaking the law. As with Trumpery, something is causing conservatives to break every principle they once claimed to uphold. Something about the contradictions of their situation is driving them mad.

This Brexit bill finally buries the Conservative party of law and order | Martin Kettle

Breaking international law is a jaw-dropping move, says Guardian columnist Martin Kettle

www.theguardian.com

You know...the funny thing is that the Queen actually has the sovereign power to tell all the tossers to sod off and that Brexit is done, the UK is remaining, so fuck all you twats and get on with it.

She literally does.

But she hasn't exercised that power for any reason in her...whatever 80 years in charge.

 

[mikeymikec]

You know...the funny thing is that the Queen actually has the sovereign power to tell all the tossers to sod off and that Brexit is done, the UK is remaining, so fuck all you twats and get on with it.

She literally does.

But she hasn't exercised that power for any reason in her...whatever 80 years in charge.

It would be a self-sacrificial move if she did, and it would have to be so decisive a move that it couldn't simply be reversed once she's been legislated out of any power at all.

 

[Ajay]

It would be a self-sacrificial move if she did, and it would have to be so decisive a move that it couldn't simply be reversed once she's been legislated out of any power at all.

I think it would be worth it to put England back on a sane path. The queen likely doesn't, because of precedent and the likelihood that this would end the monarchy. The US and Great Britain in shambles, who would've thunk it.

 

[zinfamous]

It would be a self-sacrificial move if she did, and it would have to be so decisive a move that it couldn't simply be reversed once she's been legislated out of any power at all.

She could abdicate and let Charles do it. That family has spent decades turning the British people against him, so they'd just sacrifice him for that and chalk it up to Charles and not the Monarchy.

 

[mikeymikec]

Stuff that makes sense to conservatives:

Minister says he would resign over Brexit bill if law is broken ‘in way I find unacceptable’

Justice secretary says he doesn’t believe international law will be broken, as discontent grows among Conservative backbenchers

www.theguardian.com

"The UK justice secretary, Robert Buckland, has said he would resign if the law was “broken in a way that I find unacceptable”, as Downing Street continued to come under pressure over planned legislation that would override parts of the Brexit withdrawal agreement."

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Ok people who know more than I about the UK. If on the screwupometer the US is a 5 out of 10 to establish a baseline, what is the UK?

 

[mikeymikec]

Ok people who know more than I about the UK. If on the screwupometer the US is a 5 out of 10 to establish a baseline, what is the UK?

IMO In either case, it depends on how Trump/Brexit plays out.

If the era of Trump lasts at least another term (yes I know that a person can only have two terms under current legislation), I could easily see America emulating Nazi Germany (most likely just internally).
If Brexit plays out to a 'hard brexit', then I see the UK heading for a real shitshow of a recession.

If Trump gets kicked out in the next election then the US *can* start to heal. Whether it will continue to take steps in a good direction is another question.

I'd like to think that a hard brexit and recession would result in brexit losing its populist appeal, but I was way off in my estimates of how the last UK election ended up. Just like I don't understand how brexit could be anything other than a marmite topic, I don't understand how anyone who has given Brexit any serious thought could support it, therefore I don't understand why people voted the way they did. But then I don't consume right-wing crap as my staple news diet.

If both worst case scenarios play out, who's going to have the bigger shitshow. I wouldn't like to guess, thinking about it just depresses me.

 

[sdifox]

Ok people who know more than I about the UK. If on the screwupometer the US is a 5 out of 10 to establish a baseline, what is the UK?

11

 

[pmv]

Does Spitting Image still exist?

They need to do a remake of the (infamously camp) Judas Priest "Breaking the law" video, recast with the Tory cabinet.

 

[ecogen]

Ok people who know more than I about the UK. If on the screwupometer the US is a 5 out of 10 to establish a baseline, what is the UK?

10, Brexit is one of the dumbest political decisions ever to be made.

 

[fskimospy]

IMO In either case, it depends on how Trump/Brexit plays out.

If the era of Trump lasts at least another term (yes I know that a person can only have two terms under current legislation), I could easily see America emulating Nazi Germany (most likely just internally).
If Brexit plays out to a 'hard brexit', then I see the UK heading for a real shitshow of a recession.

If Trump gets kicked out in the next election then the US *can* start to heal. Whether it will continue to take steps in a good direction is another question.

I'd like to think that a hard brexit and recession would result in brexit losing its populist appeal, but I was way off in my estimates of how the last UK election ended up. Just like I don't understand how brexit could be anything other than a marmite topic, I don't understand how anyone who has given Brexit any serious thought could support it, therefore I don't understand why people voted the way they did. But then I don't consume right-wing crap as my staple news diet.

If both worst case scenarios play out, who's going to have the bigger shitshow. I wouldn't like to guess, thinking about it just depresses me.

As far as I can tell a large percentage of Brexit supporters believe demonstrably untrue things about what Brexit is and its likely results, so they are supporting it based on magical thinking. This is the same issue with Trump supporters in the US.

As a nice cross country example here’s what the Economist found from some Trumpkins. They praised his:

1) honesty
2) work on lowering the national debt
3) having China pay money to our farmers
4) finally getting health care ‘done’
5) building of the wall

https://twitter.com/x/status/1305052220325584896

They are just living in a fantasy world. Similarly, it seems like U.K. conservatives think Brexit means:

1) not abiding by EU market regulations but getting to remain in the market
2) not having to abide by EU freedom of movement laws but still getting to move freely wherever they want

In both cases they have substituted what they wish were true for what is true.

 

[mikeymikec]

On one hand I'm thinking I would love to have been in the EU negotiator's shoes when this went down, on the other hand I wonder whether my dripping sarcasm would have fallen on utterly oblivious ears!

UK presses for use of faster passport gates at EU airports post-Brexit

Exclusive: European commission insists letting UK nationals use e-gates would breach EU law

www.theguardian.com

 

[cytg111]

On one hand I'm thinking I would love to have been in the EU negotiator's shoes when this went down, on the other hand I wonder whether my dripping sarcasm would have fallen on utterly oblivious ears!

UK presses for use of faster passport gates at EU airports post-Brexit

Exclusive: European commission insists letting UK nationals use e-gates would breach EU law

www.theguardian.com

Oh so many of the actual consequences of brexit may super unpopular by the people? So unpopular they threaten your numbers (cause that is the only time soulless populists will move to act... and not necessarily in the interest of the people).
You got Brexit... its time to feel it, at least for a while. Oh the rest of EU is actual in need of qualified immigration, people could start to do reverse personal brexits...

 

[sdifox]

On one hand I'm thinking I would love to have been in the EU negotiator's shoes when this went down, on the other hand I wonder whether my dripping sarcasm would have fallen on utterly oblivious ears!

UK presses for use of faster passport gates at EU airports post-Brexit

Exclusive: European commission insists letting UK nationals use e-gates would breach EU law

www.theguardian.com

Why should UK get treated like an EU member? I thought the whole point was to reject EU?

Bloody tossers.

 

[WelshBloke]

On one hand I'm thinking I would love to have been in the EU negotiator's shoes when this went down, on the other hand I wonder whether my dripping sarcasm would have fallen on utterly oblivious ears!

UK presses for use of faster passport gates at EU airports post-Brexit

Exclusive: European commission insists letting UK nationals use e-gates would breach EU law

www.theguardian.com

Ohh there's some fine shade thrown by the EU here!

"A senior EU diplomat said: “Having grown up in Brussels, Boris Johnson values the ability to travel freely to the continent. So it is perfectly apt that the UK is now asking the EU to change its own laws to accommodate London on something it always had. We are probably in for another re-run of ‘the EU is being unfair’, ‘we’re only asking for a Canada-style deal’. It isn’t.”"

 

[sdifox]

Ohh there's some fine shade thrown by the EU here!

"A senior EU diplomat said: “Having grown up in Brussels, Boris Johnson values the ability to travel freely to the continent. So it is perfectly apt that the UK is now asking the EU to change its own laws to accommodate London on something it always had. We are probably in for another re-run of ‘the EU is being unfair’, ‘we’re only asking for a Canada-style deal’. It isn’t.”"

UK should get the Canada Style deal. Canadians are barred from entering EU at the moment

 

[WelshBloke]

UK should get the Canada Style deal. Canadians are barred from entering EU at the moment

I have no idea what countries I'm allowed to go to right now! Frankly I'm not entirely surely if I'm allowed to leave the house and what I'm allowed to do when I do!
Im just going to stay in bed!