Ah so the Neville Chamberlain play. It’s a bold move. Let’s see if it pays off.Well, yes, on balance I think "stay and fight" would have been the better option. But it would not have been an easy one. Leaving means not having to deal with that, and I'm taking what consolations I can find.
What frequently irks me is that there seems to be a kind of 'my country, right-or-wrong' nationalism about some EU fans. With the Lib Dems, it's always seemed obvious that their uncritical, fervent support of the EU is simply because being pro-EU is the only political principle they have. There is nothing else they are remotely consistent or principled about, nothing else they appear to believe in, so they cling to that one issue all the more strongly.
Ah so the Neville Chamberlain play. It’s a bold move. Let’s see if it pays off.
It has nothing to do with the UK's EU membership.
Of course it has.
Nothing.I'm intrigued.
If Poland does something dickish internally, what does that have to do with the UKs EU membership?
Nope.When the UK sold Typhoon fighter jets to Saudi Arabia, would you expect the Poles (or any other EU member) to start wringing their hands over their own EU membership?
That's a pretty weak analogy, given that Poland and Hungary (and I have my doubts about some of the Baltic states also) are hardly Hitler's Germany, and the 'fight' would have been a purely political one, not a military one.
But, yes, I think the ideal response would have been to engage in that political fight, across the whole continent and by means of trying to make alliances across borders and change things from the bottom up. But that's a hugely demanding project, and not one I'd know how to go about. As an individual with very little power over anything, I just take consolation in the fact that particular problem is now much less my moral responsibility. It's primarily the responsibility of those still in the EU.
Let me put it this way. Before, Britain had a role to play in determining who gets to join the EU. Most western European countries voted to allow countries like Poland, Hungary and Greece in because their capitalist elites wanted slightly more exploitable labor markets (I still remember how my face wrinkled when I took delivery of my VW Passat and saw it was built in Bratislava!)Who wants to be in an 'ever closer union' with countries that are giving up on democracy? In what way is that going to make our lives better in some way? If the EU is no longer a union of "liberal democracies" what is it?
Let me put it this way. Before, Britain had a role to play in determining who gets to join the EU. Most western European countries voted to allow countries like Poland, Hungary and Greece in because their capitalist elites wanted slightly more exploitable labor markets (I still remember how my face wrinkled when I took delivery of my VW Passat and saw it was built in Bratislava!)
But now, Britain no longer has any say in who joins the EU, nor should they really care. But taking a hard Brexit was a bit like shooting your foot off to avoid stepping on a dirty floor.
Brexit was not about Poland and Hungary starting to go down the wrong far right wing path, it was about hating other brown people and shortsighted jingoism. Poland and Hungary do seem headed in the wrong directions, and as an outsider, I would think it would be the EU's plan to draw them back in line or kick them out. The UK leaving really didn't help accomplish any of those causes, and had nothing to do with either.
I'm intrigued.
If Poland does something dickish internally, what does that have to do with the UKs EU membership?
When the UK sold Typhoon fighter jets to Saudi Arabia, would you expect the Poles (or any other EU member) to start wringing their hands over their own EU membership?
Hearing Brits talk of Poland and Hungary is giving me the itch to talk about West Virginia, Kentucky and Florida.
But I think it would be rude...
We have a lot A LOT of working people from Poland via the free movement Schengen Agreement, these guys(and gals), actually commutes back and forth back and forth. I dont understand why they are not offered an easy path to citizen ship, they are obviously hard working people standing on their own feet, they should bring the rest of their family and set up shop in Scandinavia .
I am dense, sorry. Educate me plz.Oh I bet you do know why! Pretty obvious
That's a pretty weak analogy, given that Poland and Hungary (and I have my doubts about some of the Baltic states also) are hardly Hitler's Germany, and the 'fight' would have been a purely political one, not a military one.
But, yes, I think the ideal response would have been to engage in that political fight, across the whole continent and by means of trying to make alliances across borders and change things from the bottom up. But that's a hugely demanding project, and not one I'd know how to go about. As an individual with very little power over anything, I just take consolation in the fact that particular problem is now much less my moral responsibility. It's primarily the responsibility of those still in the EU.
wow. so what are your "doubts about some of the Baltic states" that they are a bit...more like Hitler's Germany, than what is observably unquestionable about today's Poland and Hungary?
This will be interesting.
Or am I not understanding your British typing and the quirky nuances of how your words work over there? (this is always possible, lol)
A small exodus began last week as expats - including some whose applications for residency have been rejected - started to head back to Britain to beat Wednesday's deadline.
Anthony Cook, who has lived in Spain for seven years, told Global247news: “The Spanish dream is over for me, it’s time to go back to Cardiff.
"It’s been a blast but the new regulations have made it impossible to stay.
Fellow returning expat Shaun Cromber voted Leave but said he did not believe Brexit would end his Spanish lifestyle.
He said: "Yes I voted out, but I didn’t realise it would come to this.
"My application has been rejected and we are on our way home – my wife is in tears, she’s distraught if I’m honest and I’m not too happy at the prospect of returning back to the UK.
“I’ve loved living on the Costa del Sol and after five years can’t believe it has come to this.
"We applied but got rejected and so have no choice, although long term I think the Spanish will regret chucking us out of Spain.”
wow. so what are your "doubts about some of the Baltic states" that they are a bit...more like Hitler's Germany, than what is observably unquestionable about today's Poland and Hungary?
This will be interesting.
Or am I not understanding your British typing and the quirky nuances of how your words work over there? (this is always possible, lol)
LMAO
British expats 'in tears' as Spain to deport 500 under new rules ‘Dream over'
THOUSANDS of British expats face being booted out of Spain for failing to register for residency under post-Brexit regulations.
https://www.express.co.uk/news/poli...ock-astrazeneca-uk-john-redwood-boris-johnson
LMAO
British expats 'in tears' as Spain to deport 500 under new rules ‘Dream over'
THOUSANDS of British expats face being booted out of Spain for failing to register for residency under post-Brexit regulations.
https://www.express.co.uk/news/poli...ock-astrazeneca-uk-john-redwood-boris-johnson
Well well well, if it isn’t the consequences of my own actions.
That sucks they were not allowed to vote in something that could impact them as well.Not necessarily the case for all of them. Any expatriot (migrant, if you prefer) who had lived there for more than 15 years did not qualify for a vote in the referendum. It's not entirely impossible that if that rule had not been in place the result could have been different, as surveys have suggested that a majority of ex-pats would have voted remain, but a couple of million of them were excluded by that rule.
Of course there are clearly some who voted 'leave' without thinking through the implications.