Bullying in the NFL

[TheFamilyMan]

Roughly translated, his name means "Dick in disguise"...seems his actions have been living up to his namesake...

 

[Adrenaline]

stolen from the NFL thread:

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/9...sed-slurs-messages-jonathan-martin?src=mobile

This link in the first post takes you to the story with that information in it.

 

[Imported]

I don't know if this is more sad.

@SI_JimTrotter
interesting that of the half dozen personnel people/players i've spoken with, all feel martin should've handled this man to man.

@SI_JimTrotter
Said one personnel man (who's not alone): "Instead of being a man and confronting him, (Martin) acted like a coward and told like a kid."

 

[esquared]

He sounds like a perfect candidate for a NE Patriots reclamation project...

Except NE already had this DNDC designation for him back in 2004.
http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nfl-s...jonathan-martin-life-used-180239513--nfl.html

Former NFL head coach Tony Dungy appeared on the "Dan Patrick Show" Monday morning and said that the Indianapolis Colts had Incognito on their "DNDC" draft list (do not draft due to character, Dungy explains) in 2005 when Incognito was coming out because of character concerns. Former NFL general manager Scott Pioli said on "NBC Sunday Night" that the New England Patriots had a similar designation for him.

 

[Wreckem]

I don't know if this is more sad.

That is likely because most athletes are uneducated/undereducated and don't realize that harassment in the work place is wrong(and the employer can be held liable for it) and handling it man to man is usually going to result in criminal charges.

Most of the athletes in the NFL are over grown children of neanderthals. Most are not smart or rational. For every Payton Manning there are half a dozen or so dumbasses.

 

[DrunkenSano]

Hazing builds character. Bullying breaks character.

Not only does it build character, if done correctly, it also strengthens the bonds in the team. The result usually ends up being a 'You are now officially one of us', folding them into the tight knit group.

 

[jaedaliu]

I don't know if this is more sad.

Maybe everyone else thrived with it and it was a character building exercise for them, but for Martin it wasn't. So in everyone else in the NFL's mind, it was standard hazing, but to Martin (and bystanders) it was bullying. (which is why I posted earlier I wanted to see anonymous info that you just posted)

It's also why I believe that there is no place for hazing in civilized society. Maybe I'm too politically correct, but to me, I fail to see the value of hazing. If you want to take a rookie down a peg or 3, better him on the practice field.

 

[smackababy]

That is likely because most athletes are uneducated/undereducated and don't realize that harassment in the work place is wrong(and the employer can be held liable for it) and handling it man to man is usually going to result in criminal charges.

Most of the athletes in the NFL are over grown children of neanderthals. Most are not smart or rational. For every Payton Manning there are half a dozen or so dumbasses.

I think it is also a culture of snitching being seen as cowardly.

From some of the reports, it doesn't look like it was just Incognito that was doing the bullying. Some of the pranks were they invited him to sit with them at lunch, and all got up when he sat down. He couldn't really handle it man to man, because Incognito was in a perceived position of authority (being a senior player AND on the council). What was the guy to do? Fight him? Go Aaron Hernandez on him? Most likely, Incognito not only instigated the harassment, but encouraged others to participate.

Take into account that if you're not a QB, you basically have the IQ of a doorknob, and this situation could have ended a lot worse.

 

[Atomic Playboy]

That said I foresee the NFL handing out a heavy suspension if everything turns out to be true. I could see a multi-year/life time ban in the realm of possibility if racial epithets were used. If racial epithets were used, I dont see him ever playing again, multi-year/life time ban or not.

Why would racial epithets be the dividing line? Racial epithets are horrible, sure, but they're also legal. How many players have been convicted or pleaded guilty to crimes and been allowed to keep playing? Shit, Riley Cooper was caught publicly using the n-word this summer and he's played in every game so far. Racial slurs mean exactly nothing in the NFL; a slap on the wrist, a reproachful look and everyone continues on like nothing happened.

 

[Don Vito Corleone]

I find this story interesting and honestly I'm not sure where I come down on it. Incognito sounds like a complete creep but I'd have to think this kind of thing must happen fairly frequently without it becoming a matter for the team to handle.

 

[smackababy]

I find this story interesting and honestly I'm not sure where I come down on it. Incognito sounds like a complete creep but I'd have to think this kind of thing must happen fairly frequently without it becoming a matter for the team to handle.

I think it happens a lot more than teams or the NFL want to admit. The problem is a lot of these guys just take it. The culture of locker room hazing looks down on snitches. Anyone who has played sports has at least seen some pranks on other players. Any group of guys will do that. I've seen it in sports, the military, and even software development.

The problem is Incognito seemed to single out this one guy and took it way too far.

 

[Imported]

BTW.. best thing I saw today: "Incognito should have used an NFL-approved racial slur, like 'redskins'"

 

[DrunkenSano]

I think it happens a lot more than teams or the NFL want to admit. The problem is a lot of these guys just take it. The culture of locker room hazing looks down on snitches. Anyone who has played sports has at least seen some pranks on other players. Any group of guys will do that. I've seen it in sports, the military, and even software development.

The problem is Incognito seemed to single out this one guy and took it way too far.

It definitely happens more often than people think, it happens in different fields as well, and from when you are young, especially when team bonds is considered incredibly important to succeed. This encompasses sports and the military, and I'm sure many other areas in life.

From the evidence, Incognito transitioned it from hazing to bullying, where there is a difference.

 

[crashtestdummy]

There's a section in Nate Jackson's recent book where he talks about a $28k rookie dinner, and how Clinton Portis was ordering expensive bottles of Champagne to take home with him. It's clear that at least that particular part is standard operating procedure in the NFL. Tedy Bruschi also mentioned something similar, but said it was quashed because it was getting out of hand. I think that if this were all it was, the Dolphins wouldn't be doing much about it.

What seems different in this case are the threats from Incognito. I think there's a lot more behind all this than we know right now, but there's ribbing and pushing buttons, then there's what Incognito apparently said in that voice mail.

 

[Wreckem]

Why would racial epithets be the dividing line? Racial epithets are horrible, sure, but they're also legal. How many players have been convicted or pleaded guilty to crimes and been allowed to keep playing? Shit, Riley Cooper was caught publicly using the n-word this summer and he's played in every game so far. Racial slurs mean exactly nothing in the NFL; a slap on the wrist, a reproachful look and everyone continues on like nothing happened.

NFL teams aren't liable for a players criminal actions off the field. Riley Coopers actions were not against a fellow teammate or any way related to the workplace. Incognito's actions are different than either of the above.

Incognito apparently pulled a trifecta of workplace harassment. Run of the mill harassment, sexual harassment, and racial harassment has NO business in the work place and the NFL is not an exception to that rule. That's where everything is different. The NFL has to abide by state/federal labor laws regarding workplace harassment. They dont have anything to abide by if someone in their private life called someone a n****r or killed someone(other suffer the bad publicity).

If you called your African American co-worker a half n****er or told any co-worker you wanted to shit down their throats you would be fired on the spot. If the company didn't do anything eventually the company could be sued by your co-worker. That is were everything is different, the team(s) could have financial liability, where as the instances you mention the teams wouldn't have any financial liability. NFL teams are first and foremost a business and businesses don't like potential financial liabilities like this.

 

[OutHouse]

I don't know if this is more sad.

Trotter is a dirtbag

 

[Thebobo]

douche

 

[mugs]

I guess Richie Incognito should have done his bullying... incognito.

 

[uclaLabrat]

I think it is also a culture of snitching being seen as cowardly.

From some of the reports, it doesn't look like it was just Incognito that was doing the bullying. Some of the pranks were they invited him to sit with them at lunch, and all got up when he sat down. He couldn't really handle it man to man, because Incognito was in a perceived position of authority (being a senior player AND on the council). What was the guy to do? Fight him? Go Aaron Hernandez on him? Most likely, Incognito not only instigated the harassment, but encouraged others to participate.

Take into account that if you're not a QB, you basically have the IQ of a doorknob, and this situation could have ended a lot worse.

I'd dispute that, some aren't too bright, but there are some very smart non-QBs in the league. I was in an honors program in junior high with Scott Fujita, I'd wager he's smarter than I am, and I have a Ph. D. in chemistry.

 

[KeithTalent]

I think it is also a culture of snitching being seen as cowardly.

From some of the reports, it doesn't look like it was just Incognito that was doing the bullying. Some of the pranks were they invited him to sit with them at lunch, and all got up when he sat down. He couldn't really handle it man to man, because Incognito was in a perceived position of authority (being a senior player AND on the council). What was the guy to do? Fight him? Go Aaron Hernandez on him? Most likely, Incognito not only instigated the harassment, but encouraged others to participate.

Take into account that if you're not a QB, you basically have the IQ of a doorknob, and this situation could have ended a lot worse.

I heard the offensive linemen were the smartest guys on the team. Not sure if that's true or not.

KT

 

[edro]

I wouldn't let him go for that one message.
I am sure there is much more, it just hasn't been released yet.

 

[Ayrahvon]

I don't know if this is more sad.

Quote:
@SI_JimTrotter
interesting that of the half dozen personnel people/players i've spoken with, all feel martin should've handled this man to man.
Quote:
@SI_JimTrotter
Said one personnel man (who's not alone): "Instead of being a man and confronting him, (Martin) acted like a coward and told like a kid."
__________________

It's amazing how often you hear this crap being spouted out about the NFL. He was a coward for reporting this? They basically think this behavior is okay, and that he has somehow hurt the NFL brand by allowing this to come to light at all. That's why he should have manned up!

I really wish that SI, ESPN, and broadcast would stop using ex players and coaches for all of their game insight. Maybe it's all the brain damage they got from multiple concussions, but they have very little of value to contribute.

Oh, and this: http://deadspin.com/shirtless-richie-incognito-drops-an-n-bomb-and-acts-lik-1458436867

 

[Miramonti]

This guy sounds like a class-a douchebag...other players around the league no doubt are laughing, high-fiving each other about this news.

 

[waggy]

I really wish that SI, ESPN, and broadcast would stop using ex players and coaches for all of their game insight. Maybe it's all the brain damage they got from multiple concussions, but they have very little of value to contribute.

Oh, and this: http://deadspin.com/shirtless-richie-incognito-drops-an-n-bomb-and-acts-lik-1458436867

i agree. at time i hate having ex players and coaches give the insight. sometimes its good most times it sucks ass.

 

[Adrenaline]

Miami HC spoke today.