Bush approves only of heterosexual marriage

[luv2chill]

Originally posted by: UglyCassanova
[If I want show my love to goats, who are you to tell me no? It's not like I choose to find goats attractive, I'm just born that way.

C'mon man use your brain. It is not possible to obtain consent from a goat or any other animal (same goes for children). These are straw man fallacies that get mentioned in just about every one of these threads and are as irrelevent today as they have been every other time someone brings them up. Seriously, find a better argument!

CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS

Repeat that over and over until you understand what it means.

And Stark, for someone who finds homosexuals so deviant and distasteful, I don't understand how you could find so much entertainment in that new gay reality show on Bravo. Or wasn't that you in that thread?

l2c

 

[SagaLore]

Originally posted by: conjur

Originally posted by: SagaLore

Originally posted by: Encryptic

Originally posted by: Quixfire

Originally posted by: Encryptic

Originally posted by: Chaotic42
The government has no business dealing with marriages at all. It's none of their business.

That's what I'm saying. If two people love each other and want to make the commitment of getting married and all that implies, then SO BE IT. Why is the government in charge of making this decision for us?

So if government dissolves marriages, then we could have more than one partner? We could leave our current partner with or without kids and pursue another without a legal recourse on our partner?s behalf?

Is this what you mean?

I don't support same sex marriage and that is my right, but I don't believe this should be a national policy or even a state policy.

No, you misread my post. What I'm saying is that the government shouldn't be in charge of saying whether two people can get married or not. The option of getting married should be valid for gay couples, just as it is for straight couples. To me, getting married is a commitment to one person that you love, as with my marriage to my wife. Why shouldn't gays have the right to make this commitment if they love one another?

I am not advocating the abolishment of marriage as an institution. If you got that impression, I'm afraid that's not what I was trying to convey.

Getting married = commitment between one male and one female whom love each other. If you're going to dillute the definition of marriage just to suit an increasing trend in sexual orientation then why not allow human/animal marriages. Or even human/property marriages.

Why? Because society and our government says so? Because the bible say so?

Pfffft...

Yes and Yes. Both seperate but both right based on individual perspective. Gay people are just trying to get the benefits associated with marriage, those benefits are there for the kids. If there were no such thing as offspring then what point is marriage. Think this out with logical steps, not with wishy-washy feel-good propoganda.

 

[BAMAVOO]

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by: BAMAVOO
I know I should have used an older age, you get the point though. How many 12 year olds do you know? What is the magic age of knowing you are gay?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



When's the magic age you realized you wanted to have sex with a girl? When you found your first scrotum hair?

It's a ridiculous question that could not possibly have a simple answer and you know it. It's different for each person.

I just love it when someone who's on the losing side of a debate starts resorting to ridiculous questions/statements to hide the fact they have nothing on which to fall back.

Yes it is different for each person.

10

8 - yep I am like an ape!


I knew I would not get a direct answer for that question, I thought I might get some insight from a gay member of this forum as to when they knew they were gay.

I have seen married men leave for men and women for women, I don't think they were born that way though. Why would it take them so long to figure it out? Was marriage just to please their family or trying to hide their knowingly wrongful tendencies?

 

[SagaLore]

Originally posted by: luv2chill

Originally posted by: UglyCassanova
[If I want show my love to goats, who are you to tell me no? It's not like I choose to find goats attractive, I'm just born that way.

C'mon man use your brain. It is not possible to obtain consent from a goat or any other animal (same goes for children). These are straw man fallacies that get mentioned in just about every one of these threads and are as irrelevent today as they have been every other time someone brings them up. Seriously, find a better argument!

CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS

Repeat that over and over until you understand what it means.

And Stark, for someone who finds homosexuals so deviant and distasteful, I don't understand how you could find so much entertainment in that new gay reality show on Bravo. Or wasn't that you in that thread?

l2c

Goats have needs too. Just because they can't speak english or read and write doesn't mean they can't consent. Otherwise a great deal of people out there aren't consenting.

 

[luv2chill]

Originally posted by: SagaLore
Yes and Yes. Both seperate but both right based on individual perspective. Gay people are just trying to get the benefits associated with marriage, those benefits are there for the kids. If there were no such thing as offspring then what point is marriage. Think this out with logical steps, not with wishy-washy feel-good propoganda.

You think there is no point to marriage beyond having children? Are you aware of the sheer numbers of couples who are either unable to have children or do not choose to contribute to the mass overpopulation of this world by humans? I guess they should all just annull their marriages and live lives of solitude... what's the point after all?

Have you ever considered the possibility that you might be sterile? Ready to be single the rest of your life as a result?

l2c

 

[UglyCasanova]

Originally posted by: luv2chill

Originally posted by: UglyCassanova
[If I want show my love to goats, who are you to tell me no? It's not like I choose to find goats attractive, I'm just born that way.

C'mon man use your brain. It is not possible to obtain consent from a goat or any other animal (same goes for children). These are straw man fallacies that get mentioned in just about every one of these threads and are as irrelevent today as they have been every other time someone brings them up. Seriously, find a better argument!

CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS CONSENTING ADULTS

Repeat that over and over until you understand what it means.

And Stark, for someone who finds homosexuals so deviant and distasteful, I don't understand how you could find so much entertainment in that new gay reality show on Bravo. Or wasn't that you in that thread?

l2c

Christ Almighty, I was joking, guy. He said something about animal love so I thought I'd make a little haha. I couldn't care less if you like the d!ck or not. I think the government needs to drop this whole marrige thing in general, be it hetero/homo/metro/animalo/whatever. If 2 people, or hell if 3 or 4 people, want to live together and have buttsecks and all of that, so be it. As for the benefits, I'm not really sure what to do. Maybe we should do away with that, or you get it married or not when you turn a certain age.

 

[luv2chill]

Originally posted by: SagaLore
Goats have needs too. Just because they can't speak english or read and write doesn't mean they can't consent. Otherwise a great deal of people out there aren't consenting.

I hope you're joking because otherwise I don't know how to respond to that? Goats get all the lovin' they need and want from OTHER goats. Children are not sexually or emotionally mature and thus have no business having sex with anyone.

Originally posted by: BAMAVOO
I have seen married men leave for men and women for women, I don't think they were born that way though. Why would it take them so long to figure it out? Was marriage just to please their family or trying to hide their knowingly wrongful tendencies

You provided a couple of very good answers to your own question. In today's society, gay people must feel tremendous pressure to "go with the flow" or risk persecution, being disowned, and/or being injured/killed by bigots. Not to mention the stigma they must feel that something must be "wrong" with them if they are attracted to their same sex. I would imagine there is a surprisingly large number of homosexuals living a heterosexual life.

l2c

 

[luv2chill]

Originally posted by: UglyCassanova
Christ Almighty, I was joking, guy. He said something about animal love so I thought I'd make a little haha. I couldn't care less if you like the d!ck or not. I think the government needs to drop this whole marrige thing in general, be it hetero/homo/metro/animalo/whatever. If 2 people, or hell if 3 or 4 people, want to live together and have buttsecks and all of that, so be it. As for the benefits, I'm not really sure what to do. Maybe we should do away with that, or you get it married or not when you turn a certain age.

Sorry, didn't know you were joking (broken sarcasm detector?). But my comments still stand as a few other people brought up those stupid bestiality/pedophilia arguements.

I agree with you. Our government treats us like children. "You can't do this. You can't do that". Treat people like they're irresponsible and they'll live up to that standard. Treat people like they are capable of making good decisions on their own and watch what happens.

l2c

 

[BAMAVOO]

07/30/2003 10:05 PM (NEW!)



Quote

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by: UglyCassanova
Christ Almighty, I was joking, guy. He said something about animal love so I thought I'd make a little haha. I couldn't care less if you like the d!ck or not. I think the government needs to drop this whole marrige thing in general, be it hetero/homo/metro/animalo/whatever. If 2 people, or hell if 3 or 4 people, want to live together and have buttsecks and all of that, so be it. As for the benefits, I'm not really sure what to do. Maybe we should do away with that, or you get it married or not when you turn a certain age.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Sorry, didn't know you were joking (broken sarcasm detector?). But my comments still stand as a few other people brought up those stupid bestiality/pedophilia arguements.

I agree with you. Our government treats us like children. "You can't do this. You can't do that". Treat people like they're irresponsible and they'll live up to that standard. Treat people like they are capable of making good decisions on their own and what what happens.

See you can't even be responsible enough to watch what you type! Just think if the government let people think and make decisions on everything on their own. Then where would we be?





J/K

 

[conjur]

Originally posted by: SagaLore
Why? Because society and our government says so? Because the bible say so?

Pfffft...

Yes and Yes. Both seperate but both right based on individual perspective. Gay people are just trying to get the benefits associated with marriage, those benefits are there for the kids. If there were no such thing as offspring then what point is marriage. Think this out with logical steps, not with wishy-washy feel-good propoganda.[/quote]
1) I DAMN sure don't want any laws enacted because 'the Bible says so'. That whole separation of church and state is a GOOD thing.
2) Gay people just don't want to be discriminated. Granted, there may be a few who might want to be legally married for less-than-altruistic reasons but, look at how many marriage between male and female there are simply for the sake for one of them to obtain automatic U.S. citizenship, and, therefore, receive benefits? I'd be willing to bet that *that's* a much higher percentage!
3) Gays can adopt and raise a child just as easily as a heterosexual couple. Just because our society is transfixed on the male/female union doesn't mean that that is how is MUST be.

 

[conjur]

Originally posted by: BAMAVOO

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by: BAMAVOO
I know I should have used an older age, you get the point though. How many 12 year olds do you know? What is the magic age of knowing you are gay?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



When's the magic age you realized you wanted to have sex with a girl? When you found your first scrotum hair?

It's a ridiculous question that could not possibly have a simple answer and you know it. It's different for each person.

I just love it when someone who's on the losing side of a debate starts resorting to ridiculous questions/statements to hide the fact they have nothing on which to fall back.

Yes it is different for each person.

10

8 - yep I am like an ape!


I knew I would not get a direct answer for that question, I thought I might get some insight from a gay member of this forum as to when they knew they were gay.

I have seen married men leave for men and women for women, I don't think they were born that way though. Why would it take them so long to figure it out? Was marriage just to please their family or trying to hide their knowingly wrongful tendencies?

Umm...hello??? Why do you think they stuck thru a marriage that they knew was a farce?? Look at my previous post discussing a former co-worker who was married, had a kid and then divorced as he could no longer live the lie that society all but mandated that he live!

 

[BAMAVOO]

look at how many marriage between male and female there are simply for the sake for one of them to obtain automatic U.S. citizenship, and, therefore, receive benefits? I'd be willing to bet that *that's* a much higher percentage!

That is a totally different topic, that should be stopped too.

I read your post above and I said I have witnessed the same thing, I stil think that he chose to be gay. If not why would he not act on it sooner. As soon as, whatever age it happens to a particular person, they begin to feel feeling for someone, would they not choose to be gay then???? I would venture to say most gays don't choose to be with the same sex at an early age because they are not born that way.

 

[conjur]

Originally posted by: BAMAVOO

look at how many marriage between male and female there are simply for the sake for one of them to obtain automatic U.S. citizenship, and, therefore, receive benefits? I'd be willing to bet that *that's* a much higher percentage!

That is a totally different topic, that should be stopped too.

I read your post above and I said I have witnessed the same thing, I stil think that he chose to be gay. If not why would he not act on it sooner. As soon as, whatever age it happens to a particular person, they begin to feel feeling for someone, would they not choose to be gay then???? I would venture to say most gays don't choose to be with the same sex at an early age because they are not born that way.

Jesus Christ you're fvcking dense! You suppose to think the opposite of what this guy told me himself?

Amazing...simply amazing.

Take those blinders off before you hurt yourself, or someone else.

 

[Wuffsunie]

Originally posted by: BAMAVOO
I have seen married men leave for men and women for women, I don't think they were born that way though. Why would it take them so long to figure it out? Was marriage just to please their family or trying to hide their knowingly wrongful tendencies?

And this is such a large stretch for you, how? We have thosands of years of tradition telling us that that is what's supposed to happen. You admit that. We have religions which constantly refer to the fact that that is what's supposed to happen. We have followers of those religions that constantly harp on that fact. We have the fact that it's the most biologically correct thing to do. We have societies that bash on and condem any other choice. All this you already admitted to. EVERYTHING points to the fact that a man and a woman SHOULD get together, marry, and have kids. It's the RIGHT THING TO DO.

Thus people will bury their feelings about whatever the might "feel" and go with what they "know." With the kind of pressure in people's lives in regards to that kind of thing, is it any wonder that gays have been marrying for centuries? If it's biological, all the more reason for them to marry! Get those genes out of the gene pool! Remeber; gay != more kids. Let them marry and they can breed themselves out of society.

-- Jack

Life is too important to take seriously.
-- Corky Siegel

 

[luv2chill]

Originally posted by: BAMAVOO

look at how many marriage between male and female there are simply for the sake for one of them to obtain automatic U.S. citizenship, and, therefore, receive benefits? I'd be willing to bet that *that's* a much higher percentage!

That is a totally different topic, that should be stopped too.

I read your post above and I said I have witnessed the same thing, I stil think that he chose to be gay. If not why would he not act on it sooner. As soon as, whatever age it happens to a particular person, they begin to feel feeling for someone, would they not choose to be gay then???? I would venture to say most gays don't choose to be with the same sex at an early age because they are not born that way.

C'mon think about it for a second. As difficult as it might be for you, put yourself in the shoes of a teenager discovering he/she is gay. Look at some of the hateful, cruel replies in some of the past gay threads on this message board. Look at the statistics (or even your own experiences) at how even kids in school who "appear" gay are taunted, harassed, and even beaten toward an inch of their life. Look at the percentage of straight people to gay people. Look at how many people in this world are still so uncomfortable around gay people that they wish for them to "keep the hell away from me and my family". You can sum up all of that in one word--marginalization. In American society, gays are made to feel like they are sick, insane, perverted individuals only half-a-step away from murderers and drug dealers. Is it any wonder gays have a high suicide rate (and by the same token, why so many participate in risky sexual behavior?) Face it, this culture encourages/demands normalcy, homogeny (no pun intended ), sameness in just about every aspect of human life. Imagine being a left-handed person in a right-handed world where you are forced to use your right-hand because using your left is seen as "deviant". In fact this actually used to happen (not that long ago, either). Try to wrap your head around what these teenagers must be going through--the sense of isolation and dispair they must feel. Placed in a similar situation, you too might decide to just ignore your homosexual orientation and pretend to be straight, except unlike the handedness example, you're not likely to have much success getting rid of your gay feelings (despite what the Southern Baptist Church proclaims). You might eventually tire of living a lie and feel like you don't owe it to anyone to pretend to be someone you're not. That is why you see guys like conjur's friend acknowledging their true self after having a go at hiding from it.

The reason you don't see gay children is because before sexual maturity, sexual feelings of any kind (including juvenile "crushes" and the like) lie dormant in childhood. It's only during puberty that one's sexuality comes to the surface. I've heard of some gay folks saying they always "knew" they were gay. However, I doubt they perceived this in an explicitly sexual way. They may have just felt like they weren't "the same" as the other kids. I don't know... no one does. But to assume that people just wake up one morning and choose to be gay just makes no sense if you give it any thought. The life of a gay person must be tremendously difficult in today's times (despite all the strides that have been made recently)... choosing to go "gay" is just non-sensical. Even in the most accepting culture, could you choose to be gay? Doubtful, so what makes you think Bill and Steve around the corner are any different?

l2c

 

[amcdonald]

When we eventually clone people, I'm gonna clone myself have the weirdest honeymoon ever... with myself.

 

[Orsorum]

Originally posted by: Orsorum

Originally posted by: Orsorum
Show me which civilizatons have labeled it a "bad thing". In all my studies of history, the only religions that have labeled it as a negative thing were the big three monotheistic religions, and if you know anything about history you know that homosexuality was a rampant and socially-accepted practice from the Greeks up to Victorian society at the beginning of this century. It's only been in Protestant America that this has really caught this much flak.

Stark: I am still waiting for you or someone else who supports this action to reply to this.

BAMAVOO: I'm still waiting for a reply.

 

[Skyclad1uhm1]

Why doesn't Al Qaida send a suicide bomber to one of those Republican conferences to take out Bush and friends? Would be fun to watch that getting replayed over and over again on TV.

 

[conjur]

Originally posted by: Skyclad1uhm1
Why doesn't Al Qaida send a suicide bomber to one of those Republican conferences to take out Bush and friends? Would be fun to watch that getting replayed over and over again on TV.

A**hole.

 

[Orsorum]

Originally posted by: Skyclad1uhm1
Why doesn't Al Qaida send a suicide bomber to one of those Republican conferences to take out Bush and friends? Would be fun to watch that getting replayed over and over again on TV.

Chalk that quote up to the "101 things I never thought I'd hear from an established member".

 

[BAMAVOO]

Quote

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by: Orsorum
Show me which civilizatons have labeled it a "bad thing". In all my studies of history, the only religions that have labeled it as a negative thing were the big three monotheistic religions, and if you know anything about history you know that homosexuality was a rampant and socially-accepted practice from the Greeks up to Victorian society at the beginning of this century. It's only been in Protestant America that this has really caught this much flak.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



Stark: I am still waiting for you or someone else who supports this action to reply to this.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



BAMAVOO: I'm still waiting for a reply.

What do you want me to say? I have never heard of being a homo being accepted ever. Not until this forum, sure isn't like that where I live. People here see it as sick and want nothing to do with them. Sure it may be redneck fear, but it is not normal and we are all praying for the day they invent the BeStraight pill.

 

[Siddhartha]

What is wrong with treating homosexuals like people?

 

[Orsorum]

Originally posted by: BAMAVOO
What do you want me to say? I have never heard of being a homo being accepted ever. Not until this forum, sure isn't like that where I live. People here see it as sick and want nothing to do with them. Sure it may be redneck fear, but it is not normal and we are all praying for the day they invent the BeStraight pill.

I'm asking you to either educate yourself about sexual practices throughout history, or sit down and shut up.

 

[Warthog912]

Originally posted by: Staley8

Originally posted by: Encryptic
Oh please. "Yes, I am mindful that we're all sinners." That's right Bush, just keep pandering to the religious right so they get you elected for another term.

The government has no business telling the American public who they can and can't marry, gays included.

YOU THE MAN, BUSH!!!. I'll be voting for him again....and even though it seems a majority of the people here don't agree just take a look at the poll...the public is with Bush....out of more than 139,000 votes 61% agree with him. I'm looking forward to another term with GWB.

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: Warthog912

Originally posted by: Staley8

Originally posted by: Encryptic
Oh please. "Yes, I am mindful that we're all sinners." That's right Bush, just keep pandering to the religious right so they get you elected for another term.

The government has no business telling the American public who they can and can't marry, gays included.

YOU THE MAN, BUSH!!!. I'll be voting for him again....and even though it seems a majority of the people here don't agree just take a look at the poll...the public is with Bush....out of more than 139,000 votes 61% agree with him. I'm looking forward to another term with GWB.

So is Leno, Letterman and O'Brien