Originally posted by: Cogman
And now my questions to you. What violence begate the World trade center bombing? What Violence begate the bombing of the USS Cole? What Violence Begate the HUNDREDS killed in a hostile takeover of A SCHOOL?
You seam to think if we just talk to them and smoke a little crack that everything will be fine and we will all be happy. Well your crazy. The terrorists that hate the US hate it because of its Ideals, many of them contridict their own. They call us evil because our main relegion is not their own. They hate us because of who and what we are not What we are doing.
Motives for 9/11 Terrorist Attacks
The motives for 9/11 are no mystery. The motives have been stated by several people clearly and repeatedly for years. The terrorists are not attacking us in order to force us to convert to Islam or because we don't believe in Islam or that they don't like freedom or that they are envious.
Note that Osama bin Laden has said why repeatedly and he says that the attacks will continue UNTIL specific foreign policies (American policy in the Middle East and its support of Israel) are stopped. He doesn't say "until you believe in Alah", none of the terrorists have ever said this or anything about attacking us because of our freedoms. It is dangerous to spread false reasons for why 9/11 happened. Please read the following for the motives for 9/11 attacks:
"Your position against Muslims in Palestine is despicable and disgraceful. America has no shame. ... We believe that the worst thieves in the world today and the worst terrorists are the Americans. Nothing could stop you except perhaps retaliation in kind. We do not have to differentiate between military or civilian. As far as we are concerned, they are all targets, and this is what the fatwah says ... . The fatwah is general (comprehensive) and it includes all those who participate in, or help the Jewish occupiers in killing Muslims. " - Osama bin Laden May 1998
"For over half a century, Muslims in Palestine have been slaughtered and assaulted and robbed of their honor and of their property. Their houses have been blasted, their crops destroyed. And the strange thing is that any act on their part to avenge themselves or to lift the injustice befalling them causes great agitation in the United Nations which hastens to call for an emergency meeting only to convict the victim and to censure the wronged and the tyrannized whose children have been killed and whose crops have been destroyed and whose farms have been pulverized " - Osama bin Laden May 1998
"The International Islamic Front for Jihad against the U.S. and Israel has issued a crystal-clear fatwa calling on the Islamic nation to carry on jihad aimed at liberating holy sites. The nation of Muhammad has responded to this appeal. If the instigation for jihad against the Jews and the Americans in order to liberate Al-Aksa Mosque and the Holy Ka'aba Islamic shrines in the Middle East is considered a crime, then let history be a witness that I am a criminal." - Osama bin Laden May 1999
"We swore that America wouldn't live in security until we live it truly in Palestine . This showed the reality of America, which puts Israel's interest above its own people's interest. America won't get out of this crisis until it gets out of the Arabian Peninsula , and until it stops its support of Israel." -Osama bin Laden, October 2001
A German friend of Mohammed Atta(the hijacker pilot who flew into WTC) is quoted as describing him as "most imbued actually about Israeli politics in the region and about US protection of these Israeli politics in the region. And he was to a degree personally suffering from that."
These facts point to a motive for attacking the WTC in 2001 that is consistent with the motive expressed by terrorists in a letter sent to the New York Times after the 1993 bombing attack of the WTC, "We declare our responsibility for the explosion on the mentioned building. This action was done in response for the American political, economical, and military support to Israel the state of terrorism and to the rest of the dictator countries in the region."
It is also the same motive that Mir Aimal Kasi had for killing CIA employees Frank Darling and Lansing Bennett outside CIA headquarters in Langley,Virginia in 1993 . Mir Aimal Kasi said, "What I did was a retaliation against the US government for American policy in the Middle East and its support of Israel ." Mir Aimal Kasi once professed a love for this country, his uncle testified. "He always say that 'I like America, I love America and I want to go there,'" Amanullah Kasi said at a sentencing hearing for his nephew, Mir Aimal Kasi . Kasi's roommate, who had reported him missing after the shootings, told police that Kasi would get incensed watching CNN when he heard how Muslims were being treated. After the Sept. 11, 2001, terrorist attacks, Kasi said he did not approve of the attack on the World Trade Center because innocent were killed. He understood, however, the attack on the Pentagon, the symbol of government might.
The shoe bomber (Richard Reid) has said:"The reason for me sending you (a document he calls his "will") is so you can see that I didn't do this act out of ignorance nor did I just do it because I want to die, but rather because I see it as a duty upon me to help remove the oppressive American forces from the Muslim land and that this is the only way for us to do so as we do not have other means to fight them."
Abdullah Azzam authored Join the Caravan and he writes, "We then are calling upon the Muslims and urging them to proceed to fight, for many reasons, at the head of which are the following:" Then he lists 16 reasons. NONE of them state that the reason is just for the sake of attacking non-believers.In fact the first reason is: "1. In order that the Disbelievers do not dominate.""Do not dominate" Note that he does not write "just because they are disbelievers" or "in order to make them believe." NONE of the 16 reasons say "fight to make disbelievers into Muslims"In fact Osama bin Laden addressed the lying about motives for 9/11:
"... the Mujahideen saw the black gang of thugs in the White House hiding the Truth, and their stupid and foolish leader, who is elected and supported by his people, denying reality and proclaiming that we (the Mujahideen) were striking them because we were jealous of them (the Americans), whereas the reality is that we are striking them because of their evil and injustice in the whole of the Islamic World, especially in Iraq and Palestine and their occupation of the Land of the Two Holy Sanctuaries." -Osama Bin Laden , February 14 , 2003
in that same statement Osama bin Laden once again listed the motives: " ... in 1995 , the explosion in Riyadh took place, killing four Americans, in a clear message from the people of that region displaying their rejection and opposition to the American policy of bankrolling the Jews and occupying the Land of the Two Holy Sanctuaries. The following year, another explosion in Al-Khobar killed 19 Americans and wounded more than 400 of them, prompting them to move their bases from the cities to the desert . Then in 1998 , the Mujahideen warned America to cease their support to the Jews and to leave the Land of the Two Holy Sanctuaries, but the enemy refused to heed this warning, so the Mujahideen, with the ability from Allah , smashed them with two mighty smashes in East Africa . Then again America was warned, but she refused to pay attention to the warnings, so the Mujahideen destroyed the American Destroyer, the USS Cole, in Aden, in a martyrdom operation, striking a solid blow to the face of the American military and at the same time, exposing the Yemeni Government as American agents, similar to all the countries in the region." -Osama bin Laden February 14, 2003
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I condemn killing another person for beliefs but I want to see Osama caught and dealt with as much as any other American but this is not an issue of beliefs it is a direct attack on a native peoples and their response. if you think America is innocent then look back on our history of genocide. People don't blow themselves up for no reason we need to look in the mirror first or all our talk of a shining beacon of freedom sounds like just another American double-standard while Arab famlies die at OUR hand.
We have been the agressors time and time again by our MANY MANY vetos in the UN, our regime overthrowing happy goverment and meddling in their affairs this isn't so much of a war on terrorism against the US but a cry out for attention to our terrorist war on a poor people half a world away and their response.
Violence begats violence time and time again we kill their famlies and people arent just going to sit around and take it forever -the only way to stand up to a overwhelming military is partisan actions (IE terrorism)
Simple cause and effect stop killing Muslim people and they will go back to normal life. Noone wants this stuff to happen but it is not surprising at all. (I said this on 9/11/01 and It is double true now with our ageressive actions in Iraq Abu Gharib shelling of the Mosque in Najif (My Iraqi and Palestine friends on the corner were actually for the invasion of Iraq and getting rid of Saddam but after the bit in Najif they are hopping mad and lost Bush's vote from some of Americas newest citizens who love this country -They moved here of their own free will now they are torn and will be voting otherwise. One of them wants to go home now he is so worried about his family in Iraq. You watch a grown man cry seeing bombs dropped from the sky on the land where his family lives while he fears for their lives and tell me who are we betraying?
I for one very p1ssed too see explosions on that TV set and hearing them play a sad song on their insturments (they have a band together and practice often) while they watched for pictures of their famlies safe. how do you think he feels about Abu-Gharib when he has a little brother in Iraq still?
Could YOU feel safe here in a country that invades your former home under dodgy circumstances and shoves broomsticks up the young mens azz?
How can you explain to someone that not all Americans support this and only a few misguided ones are behind this becasue they are fooled into thinking it is for Americas best interests.
WE ALL owe him an apology for the (hopefully he finds out they are somewhere hiding or with realatives) murder of his family and friends cuz those Americans that come in every day and say "We are sorry you have to go through this we are doing our best to make sure we get America back to the values it was founded upon."
He just nods sadly with a defeated look on his face while the talking head of W drones on more half-truths on their old TV set on top of the beer cooler.
He came here to make a new life as a American as we all did. And look how the country turned.
Someone shot at the window to his shop the other day. (only cracked it luckily it would have been robbed in a heartbeat in the city!)
What can we say to him as he watches his former home go up in flames?
He is angry at the administration not the people. And rightly so as a LOT of us are too.
here is :beer::beer::beer::beer::beer::beer::beer::beer::beer::beer::beer::beer: for Hussein (That is his name it is a common name in Iraq from what he says) and our fellow human beings in Iraq -our brothers and sisters dying at Americas hand right now. May this all work out in the end and may they be able to carry on with peaceful lives not occupied by western forces with their own agenda.
And may this black mark on America's history be forgotten soon and the administration who caused it.