Bush's response is not adequate

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Starbuck1975

Lifer
Jan 6, 2005
14,698
1,909
126
Hurricane relief efforts went well last year. I guess that's the difference between a real leader like Jeb and Mayor Nagin who can't evacuate his own city.

This is largely because local and state officials already requested and staged much of the relief effort necessary to provide support once the hurricanes passed over...the situation in Florida was also much easier to handle because the destruction was a bit more contained, and relief shelters did not become isolated in largely flooded areas...had the levees not broken in New Orleans, the picture would be a lot different.

Thousands of stranded civilians, no designated shelters (lacking the necessary stockpiles of supplies to support people there), a total breakdown of communication, armed bandits roaming the streets and widespread flooding...in isolation, these risks are possibly more manageable...throw them all together at once, and a total lack of planning for such a contingency, and it is no surprise that things have gone to hell in a hand basket.

I would not blame Mayor Nagin for this catastrophe, because like many others, I dont think he comprehended how quickly things would get out of hand if the city flooded...no one planned for this contingency...that includes local, state and federal officials.

Think about the city you might live in...what if catastrophe struck...would you know where to go for relief if you had no means of getting out of the city...would you know what to do...do you have stockpiles of food and water to sustain yourself if relief is slow in coming.

We all understand the potential for catastrophe in the face of crisis...but its almost a case of denial, as no one ever thinks it will happen to them.
 

Engineer

Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
39,234
701
126
Originally posted by: zendari
Originally posted by: BBond
Originally posted by: zendari
Why didn't the city build levees?

Why don't YOU build highways? You ignorant child.

Hurricane relief efforts went well last year. I guess that's the difference between a real leader like Jeb and Mayor Nagin who can't evacuate his own city.

I guess Bush and Jeb handing ice out for a photo-op for the 04 elections helped too. No elections for Bush = no photo op = .......

IIRC, the hurricanes in Florida were no where near the severity of this one, which is the most expensive one in history. Apples != oranges.
 

BBond

Diamond Member
Oct 3, 2004
8,363
0
0
Members of the Congressional Black Causus are making a statement right now. Rep. Carolyn Kilpatrick D-Michigan, just announced that, working with Detroit's Mayor Kwame Kilpatrick, they are offering an air lift, in conjuction with commercial airlines, and homes for 500 famlies, FOOD, WATER, SHELTER, CLOTHING, NOW.

Rep. Kilpatrick also asks that people, particularly the news media, stop referring to the American citizens left behind in New Orleans as "refugees". They are American citizens.

Jesse Jackson Jr. asked everyone what would you do if you were left without food and water in a catastrophe for four days? He said that when he was in Israel and there was great pride there that they had airlifted 40,000 people from Africa in only 72 hours. Where are the airlines that the U.S. government bailed out with our tax dollars after September 11?

Too many questions because there are just too many failures. If this is the best we can do we are not in any way the nation we tell the world we are.

Where is the aid? Where are the buses? Where is the president?

Shame on America.

 

TRUMPHENT

Golden Member
Jan 20, 2001
1,414
0
0
Originally posted by: zendari
Originally posted by: BBond
Originally posted by: zendari
Why didn't the city build levees?

Why don't YOU build highways? You ignorant child.

Hurricane relief efforts went well last year. I guess that's the difference between a real leader like Jeb and Mayor Nagin who can't evacuate his own city.


You have conveniently omitted the comparisons between what the mayor of New Orleans is facing and what Jeb, the governor of Florida has faced. When something like this hits a city, the city ceases to function. It takes massive aid from outside the destruction zone to begin to recover.

In the wake of Hurricane Andrew, Homestead Fl had US Army Special Forces guarding the main post office. Yeah, the Green Berets were acting as guardians of the mail.

Nothing that governor Bush has experienced has any remote comparison to the scale and scope of Hurricane Katrina.

One seldom encounters an attitude with more ignorance and arrogance combined into one person than yourself.
 

Ferocious

Diamond Member
Feb 16, 2000
4,584
2
71
Conservative guy on the radio said that the response would have been swifter had most of the victims not been Democrats.

Wow.
 

Starbuck1975

Lifer
Jan 6, 2005
14,698
1,909
126
Jesse Jackson Jr. asked everyone what would you do if you were left without food and water in a catastrophe for four days? He said that when he was in Israel and there was great pride there that they had airlifted 40,000 people from Africa in only 72 hours. Where are the airlines that the U.S. government bailed out with our tax dollars after September 11?
Airlifting people is not the issue...getting people to the airlift assets is the challenge.

Even if the airlines were to stage 1000 planes at New Orleans Airport, you still have to get people from the city to the planes...it is not a question of relief supplies not being available...it is the very difficult task of transporting 1000s of people from structures never designed to serve as shelters, that are isolated due to the flooding in the city.


 

zendari

Banned
May 27, 2005
6,558
0
0
The President was waiting for the Democrats in congress to nicely take their own sweet time getting to washington to pass his hurricane relief bill.
 

BBond

Diamond Member
Oct 3, 2004
8,363
0
0
Two airlift assets are already in place in New Orleans. News crews (who keep bringing up all the snipers but haven't seen any as yet), the few troops who are there, and the few buses evacuating Americans from the Superdome, are all making it in. If Bush had acted airlifts would have been easily feasible.

People have been told there are buses coming to evacuate them FOR DAYS. Where are those buses? A woman was on this morning telling a news crew how buses are passing them by.

WTF is going on here in America. You people better WTFU and soon.
 

1EZduzit

Lifer
Feb 4, 2002
11,834
1
0
Originally posted by: zendari
The President was waiting for the Democrats in congress to nicely take their own sweet time getting to washington to pass his hurricane relief bill.

You mean the GOP has lost control???? I thought they were the majority?

When the chips are down do the manly thing, blame the oppostion.
 
Sep 12, 2004
16,852
59
86
Originally posted by: BBond
Two airlift assets are already in place in New Orleans. News crews (who keep bringing up all the snipers but haven't seen any as yet), the few troops who are there, and the few buses evacuating Americans from the Superdome, are all making it in. If Bush had acted airlifts would have been easily feasible.

People have been told there are buses coming to evacuate them FOR DAYS. Where are those buses? A woman was on this morning telling a news crew how buses are passing them by.

WTF is going on here in America. You people better WTFU and soon.
Gee, we can all read the news just like you can BBond, and arguably better since much of your alarmist claims are behind the curve.

So when are you going to figure out that we don't need you as the shrill clarion of ATP&N?

 

BBond

Diamond Member
Oct 3, 2004
8,363
0
0
By midnight last night, according to General Steven Blum, Chief U.S. National Guard, they had managed to get 2,000 NG troops from all over the U.S. into Louisiana.

Bush is walking across the runway in right now in Louisiana with his shirt sleeves rolled acting like he's giving orders. What a farce. What an embarassment.
 

BBond

Diamond Member
Oct 3, 2004
8,363
0
0
OMG, KKKarl Rove is there with him. Why the hell did Bush bring HIM? New Orleans really doesn't need any more evil right now.
 

imported_Pedro69

Senior member
Jan 18, 2005
259
0
0
Louisiana officials step up criticism of relief effort
NEW ORLEANS, United States (AFP) - Local officials stepped up their criticism of Washington's response to the killer Hurricane Katrina, branding its failure to speed troops and relief a "national disgrace."

New Orleans Mayor Ray Nagin said he "talked to everybody under the sun," including
President George W. Bush, but had little success accelerating the dispatch of troops and buses to his flooded city terrorized by armed gangs.

"They think small. This is a major, major, major deal," he told CNN television. He earlier told a local radio station, "every day we delay, people are dying and they're dying in the hundreds, I'm willing to bet you."

Nagin said he told Bush, who was to visit the disaster zone on Friday, that "his flying over in Air Force One does not do it justice."

"I have been all over this city and I am very frustrated because we are not able to marshall resources and we are outmanned in just about every respect. ... I am pissed."

Administration officials say they are doing their utmost to rush manpower and supplies to help survivors of Katrina, which lashed the US Gulf Coast on Monday, leaving thousands feared dead.

But they said they were hampered by the fetid waters inundating 80 percent of the city which have left tens of thousands of people stranded in squalid, sweltering and increasingly dangerous conditions.

Terry Ebbert, the head of New Orleans' emergency operations, was unimpressed by the explanations offered by the
Federal Emergency Management Agency (FEMA) and other departments.

"This is a national disgrace," he said. "FEMA has been here three days, yet there is no command and control. We can send massive amounts of aid to (Asian) tsunami victims, but we can't bail out the city of New Orleans."

With more than 4,000 National Guardsmen already in New Orleans, US authorities said they expected to have 22,000 on the ground in affected areas of the state of Louisiana by Friday.

But Louisiana Governor Kathleen Blanco insisted she told Bush earlier in the week that she needed 40,000 federal troops.

"We just did not have enough resources in a timely fashion," the Democrat told CNN. "The ramp-up was not as rapid as we needed."

Amid reports of survivors falling dead in shelters, rotting corpses piling up and gunfights and fistfights erupting, Blanco said situation was ripe for further disaster.

"When your whole network of civilization falls apart, when you have no communications capacity, when you don't have power, you don't have water ... anything can happen. And it has happened," she said.

Bush has been accused of being slow to break off his month-long holiday at his Texas ranch to crank up the federal response to one of the country's worst national disasters.

A poll published Thursday found that 59 percent of Americans felt the federal government was not doing enough to help hurricane victims. Leading US newspapers Friday also blasted the tardy response.

"How could the government have been so unready for a crisis that was so widely predicted," asked The Washington Post.

"The sluggish, initial response ... has embittered and inflamed tens of thousands of people awaiting relief, most of them poor and black and many of them old and sick," the Post said in an editorial.

It is so sad that there are still people left defending this administration.
 

BBond

Diamond Member
Oct 3, 2004
8,363
0
0
Originally posted by: Pedro69
Louisiana officials step up criticism of relief effort
NEW ORLEANS, United States (AFP) - Local officials stepped up their criticism of Washington's response to the killer Hurricane Katrina, branding its failure to speed troops and relief a "national disgrace."

New Orleans Mayor Ray Nagin said he "talked to everybody under the sun," including
President George W. Bush, but had little success accelerating the dispatch of troops and buses to his flooded city terrorized by armed gangs.

"They think small. This is a major, major, major deal," he told CNN television. He earlier told a local radio station, "every day we delay, people are dying and they're dying in the hundreds, I'm willing to bet you."

Nagin said he told Bush, who was to visit the disaster zone on Friday, that "his flying over in Air Force One does not do it justice."

"I have been all over this city and I am very frustrated because we are not able to marshall resources and we are outmanned in just about every respect. ... I am pissed."

Administration officials say they are doing their utmost to rush manpower and supplies to help survivors of Katrina, which lashed the US Gulf Coast on Monday, leaving thousands feared dead.

But they said they were hampered by the fetid waters inundating 80 percent of the city which have left tens of thousands of people stranded in squalid, sweltering and increasingly dangerous conditions.

Terry Ebbert, the head of New Orleans' emergency operations, was unimpressed by the explanations offered by the
Federal Emergency Management Agency (FEMA) and other departments.

"This is a national disgrace," he said. "FEMA has been here three days, yet there is no command and control. We can send massive amounts of aid to (Asian) tsunami victims, but we can't bail out the city of New Orleans."

With more than 4,000 National Guardsmen already in New Orleans, US authorities said they expected to have 22,000 on the ground in affected areas of the state of Louisiana by Friday.

But Louisiana Governor Kathleen Blanco insisted she told Bush earlier in the week that she needed 40,000 federal troops.

"We just did not have enough resources in a timely fashion," the Democrat told CNN. "The ramp-up was not as rapid as we needed."

Amid reports of survivors falling dead in shelters, rotting corpses piling up and gunfights and fistfights erupting, Blanco said situation was ripe for further disaster.

"When your whole network of civilization falls apart, when you have no communications capacity, when you don't have power, you don't have water ... anything can happen. And it has happened," she said.

Bush has been accused of being slow to break off his month-long holiday at his Texas ranch to crank up the federal response to one of the country's worst national disasters.

A poll published Thursday found that 59 percent of Americans felt the federal government was not doing enough to help hurricane victims. Leading US newspapers Friday also blasted the tardy response.

"How could the government have been so unready for a crisis that was so widely predicted," asked The Washington Post.

"The sluggish, initial response ... has embittered and inflamed tens of thousands of people awaiting relief, most of them poor and black and many of them old and sick," the Post said in an editorial.

It is so sad that there are still people left defending this administration.

They all work for the White House. That's the ONLY possible explanation.

No one can be THAT stupid.
 

rchiu

Diamond Member
Jun 8, 2002
3,846
0
0
Originally posted by: zendari
Originally posted by: BBond
Originally posted by: zendari
Why didn't the city build levees?

Why don't YOU build highways? You ignorant child.

Hurricane relief efforts went well last year. I guess that's the difference between a real leader like Jeb and Mayor Nagin who can't evacuate his own city.

Or the difference is Jeb had a brother in the Whitehouse who gave everything he asked for and Mayor Nagin got nothing, no bus, no National troop nor food, water and medical supply.
 

Starbuck1975

Lifer
Jan 6, 2005
14,698
1,909
126
It is so sad that there are still people left defending this administration
It is even more sad that people are exploiting this disaster for political purposes.

Rather then bitch and whine, I challenge everyone throwing criticisms at the relief effort to present their plan for how they would have handled this situation had they been in charge.

Or the difference is Jeb had a brother in the Whitehouse who gave everything he asked for and Mayor Nagin got nothing, no bus, no National troop nor food, water and medical supply.
Please document what requests for aid mayor Nagin made for the staging of relief efforts in the days prior to Katrina. Quite easy to point fingers, lay blame, and complain about the slow flow of relief to your city after the fact...but the only way to avoid disaster is through adequate planning prior to handle as many contingencies as feasibly possible.





 

1EZduzit

Lifer
Feb 4, 2002
11,834
1
0
Originally posted by: Pedro69
Louisiana officials step up criticism of relief effort
NEW ORLEANS, United States (AFP) - Local officials stepped up their criticism of Washington's response to the killer Hurricane Katrina, branding its failure to speed troops and relief a "national disgrace."

New Orleans Mayor Ray Nagin said he "talked to everybody under the sun," including
President George W. Bush, but had little success accelerating the dispatch of troops and buses to his flooded city terrorized by armed gangs.

"They think small. This is a major, major, major deal," he told CNN television. He earlier told a local radio station, "every day we delay, people are dying and they're dying in the hundreds, I'm willing to bet you."

Nagin said he told Bush, who was to visit the disaster zone on Friday, that "his flying over in Air Force One does not do it justice."

"I have been all over this city and I am very frustrated because we are not able to marshall resources and we are outmanned in just about every respect. ... I am pissed."

Administration officials say they are doing their utmost to rush manpower and supplies to help survivors of Katrina, which lashed the US Gulf Coast on Monday, leaving thousands feared dead.

But they said they were hampered by the fetid waters inundating 80 percent of the city which have left tens of thousands of people stranded in squalid, sweltering and increasingly dangerous conditions.

Terry Ebbert, the head of New Orleans' emergency operations, was unimpressed by the explanations offered by the
Federal Emergency Management Agency (FEMA) and other departments.

"This is a national disgrace," he said. "FEMA has been here three days, yet there is no command and control. We can send massive amounts of aid to (Asian) tsunami victims, but we can't bail out the city of New Orleans."

With more than 4,000 National Guardsmen already in New Orleans, US authorities said they expected to have 22,000 on the ground in affected areas of the state of Louisiana by Friday.

But Louisiana Governor Kathleen Blanco insisted she told Bush earlier in the week that she needed 40,000 federal troops.

"We just did not have enough resources in a timely fashion," the Democrat told CNN. "The ramp-up was not as rapid as we needed."

Amid reports of survivors falling dead in shelters, rotting corpses piling up and gunfights and fistfights erupting, Blanco said situation was ripe for further disaster.

"When your whole network of civilization falls apart, when you have no communications capacity, when you don't have power, you don't have water ... anything can happen. And it has happened," she said.

Bush has been accused of being slow to break off his month-long holiday at his Texas ranch to crank up the federal response to one of the country's worst national disasters.

A poll published Thursday found that 59 percent of Americans felt the federal government was not doing enough to help hurricane victims. Leading US newspapers Friday also blasted the tardy response.

"How could the government have been so unready for a crisis that was so widely predicted," asked The Washington Post.

"The sluggish, initial response ... has embittered and inflamed tens of thousands of people awaiting relief, most of them poor and black and many of them old and sick," the Post said in an editorial.

It is so sad that there are still people left defending this administration.

It's the new Repug's way of doing businesss. The vast majority of these people weren't going to vote GOP anyway so who cares?

What's that you say? Do the RIGHT THING?? LMAO, why would they do that? It's all about dollars, not sense to them.
 

BBond

Diamond Member
Oct 3, 2004
8,363
0
0
Slight difference between being a mayor and a governor, especially a governor with a brother in the White House in an election year.
 

Starbuck1975

Lifer
Jan 6, 2005
14,698
1,909
126
Slight difference between being a mayor and a governor, especially a governor with a brother in the White House in an election year.

Mayors can go to their respective governors to request aid, and governors in turn are in a position to request federal aid.

Gulianni apparently had no problem requesting aid as a "mere" mayor in response to 9/11.
 

conjur

No Lifer
Jun 7, 2001
58,686
3
0
Originally posted by: BBond
Slight difference between being a mayor and a governor, especially a governor with a brother in the White House in an election year.
Yeah. I mean, what can the mayor do when his city and its resources are underwater?

Listen to this

He is P I S S E D ! ! !
 

BBond

Diamond Member
Oct 3, 2004
8,363
0
0
Originally posted by: Starbuck1975
Slight difference between being a mayor and a governor, especially a governor with a brother in the White House in an election year.

Mayors can go to their respective governors to request aid, and governors in turn are in a position to request federal aid.

Gulianni apparently had no problem requesting aid as a "mere" mayor in response to 9/11.

Don't be ridiculous. 9/11 was an attack on the economic and military centers of America. It was recognized immediately as a national emergency. The problem is, Bush doesn't consider 100,000 people stranded, starving, dying of thirst and medical conditions, a national emergency until the public outcry became too loud for his comfort.

THE MAN DIDN'T EVEN END HIS VACATION UNTIL TWO DAYS AFTER THE FACT. HE WAS DOING PHOTO OPS PLAYING GUITAR. HIS SECRETARY OF STATE WAS SHOPPING AND HAVING A GREAT TIME AT BROADWAY SHOWS UNTIL THURSDAY NIGHT.

 

BBond

Diamond Member
Oct 3, 2004
8,363
0
0
Bush is doing the only thing he knows how to do. A photo op at the airport. Why don't they drop him off at the Superdome for five days or so? Let him know what his response is like instead of this nonsense on the screen now. Sharing war stories from rescue workers that ALL of the news media will carry tomorrow instead of the news of the failure of America to provide even the basics of food and water to people after a national emergency.

 

BBond

Diamond Member
Oct 3, 2004
8,363
0
0
He's speaking now about how the federal government is going to do what they have to do. Five days late.

He actually congratulated Congress on working so fast.

OMG, I think I am going to throw up.
 
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