Bush's response is not adequate

[conjur]

Uhhh...

 

[raildogg]

lovely.

i was actually on the side of these people who are now blaming Bush for everything from oil to this hurricane. no more of that.

yes, Bush's response is not adequate.

the fact that you dont hold the mayor, the governor accountable simply because they are democrats shows you are a partisan animal. they are as much responsible for the failure as Bush is, probably much more responsible. but its ok, only republicans can do faulty things, democrats never make mistakes.

gotcha

 

[conjur]

Oh, look at raildogg whining. Give it up. *YOU* are the one politicizing it. Others are pointing the blame where it belongs. Or, have you not read the MANY stories of FEMA turning back assistance? Or the news that the WH didn't authorize Gen. Honore to move until Thur.?


It's not a Rep/Dem issue...it's a lazy-ass Fed issue.

 

[raildogg]

whining?

i think that putting all the blame on Bush is showing you are a moron and a party animal. Bush and the feds should be held accountable, but so should the mayor and governor and all of the other NO leaders.

i think the response was late but now it has caught up. as for FEMA, lets wait for the investigations to begin.

everyone was throwing around blame right after 9/11, much of that was proven otherwise. before making a final judgement, wait for the investigation, which will happen eventually.

yes, okay, i got a bit carried away when i said many Democrats are acting like morons . but really, try not to make the whole party look bad.

what most of us dont realize is that the hurricane season just began recently and we still have a while to go before it ends. and a even bigger hurricane will hit America sooner or later, especially with these warmer waters, some waters are 2C warner than usual. i think 9/11 woke us up to terrorism, this disaster will wake us up to natural disasters.

orrrr ... it may not, since this is America after all. people have really short memories

 

[conjur]

Originally posted by: raildogg
whining?

i think that putting all the blame on Bush is showing you are a moron and a party animal. Bush and the feds should be held accountable, but so should the mayor and governor and all of the other NO leaders.

Sorry, my party days ended after I got married and had a kid. And, the blame does belong with this administration. No doubts about that at all. None.

i think the response was late but now it has caught up. as for FEMA, lets wait for the investigations to begin.

Of course it's caught up, everyone is out of the Superdome and Conv. Ctr. now. Only took 6 days of people DYING to finish the task.

everyone was throwing around blame right after 9/11, much of that was proven otherwise. before making a final judgement, wait for the investigation, which will happen eventually.

Ayup. Newt was blaming Clinton about an hour after the attacks.

yes, okay, i got a bit carried away when i said many Democrats are acting like morons . but really, try not to make the whole party look bad.

Why would I care about the Democratic Party? I'm not a member of it. I'm not a member of *any* party. My last political donation was in 2002 and that was $500 to the RNC.

what most of us dont realize is that the hurricane season just began recently and we still have a while to go before it ends. and a even bigger hurricane will hit America sooner or later, especially with these warmer waters, some waters are 2C warner than usual. i think 9/11 woke us up to terrorism, this disaster will wake us up to natural disasters.

orrrr ... it may not, since this is America after all. people have really short memories

Ayup...the Gulf isn't out of the woods yet.

 

[raildogg]

Originally posted by: conjur
Sorry, my party days ended after I got married and had a kid. And, the blame does belong with this administration. No doubts about that at all. None.

the blame belongs with all the agencies involved. the local, state and federal agencies.

Of course it's caught up, everyone is out of the Superdome and Conv. Ctr. now. Only took 6 days of people DYING to finish the task.

its not that easy to evacuate hundreds of thousands of people from a flooded city. the response and aid were late. the evacuation was delayed, but they got the people out. i think as the days went on, the relief agencies got better and better.

Ayup. Newt was blaming Clinton about an hour after the attacks.

interesting ...

Why would I care about the Democratic Party? I'm not a member of it. I'm not a member of *any* party. My last political donation was in 2002 and that was $500 to the RNC.

i was referring to others who seem to let one party off the hook all the time, democrat or republican. why do people even belong in a party these days? they are so worthless

Ayup...the Gulf isn't out of the woods yet.

yeeh, the waters may get even warner in the next few years as climate change gets worse and worse. that and other factors could combine and form another category 5 storm.

 

[BBond]

Well, guess where all of this White House bullsh!t that these clones here are repeating is coming from.

Report: Karl Rove Orchestrating PR Campaign Over Relief Effort

In Washington, the Bush White House has responded to the mounting criticism by trying to shift the blame to local and state officials in Louisiana. According to the New York Times, this is part of a coordinated public relations campaign led by President Bush?s chief advisor Karl Rove. The Times reports that in many ways, the unfolding PR campaign reflects the style Rove has brought to the political campaigns he has run for Bush. Meanwhile the Washington Post has been forced to print a retraction after it published as fact a claim sourced to a "senior Bush official" that the relief effort was delayed in part because Louisiana?s Democratic Governor -- Kathleen Blanco never declared a state of emergency. In fact Blanco did just that ? four days before the hurricane hit.

Just click on the Democracy Now! link in my sig and read the Headlines for September 5, 2005 for verification.

 

[1EZduzit]

They got all the people out? They don't even know how many are dead yet? I guess they don't qualify as people anymore, huh?

We're all at fault, the whole damn system. No doubt about it. We've know this was a possibility for 30 years. No one got too excited about it though.

Then it happens. There is no question FEMA mucked it up. They claimed they didn't even know the people in the dome were without food and water. DUHHH!! If they didn't know that, then by god that idiot and whoever appointed that idiot should be canned.

Gee, that would be Bush.

There I go again politicizing the issue.

Bush supporters are like a dog chasing it's tail. :roll:

 

[conjur]

Originally posted by: raildogg

Originally posted by: conjur
Sorry, my party days ended after I got married and had a kid. And, the blame does belong with this administration. No doubts about that at all. None.

the blame belongs with all the agencies involved. the local, state and federal agencies.

You're right. However, considering the immense size and power of the storm, the Feds were alerted a few days beforehand, by Gov. Blanco herself, that the local resources would be "overwhelmed" and that Federal assistance immediately after the storm was going to be a requirement.

Of course it's caught up, everyone is out of the Superdome and Conv. Ctr. now. Only took 6 days of people DYING to finish the task.

its not that easy to evacuate hundreds of thousands of people from a flooded city. the response and aid were late. the evacuation was delayed, but they got the people out. i think as the days went on, the relief agencies got better and better.

Again, you're missing the point! It's NOT about the evacuation. You and I both know that forceably evacuating 100,000 people would take several days (and, remember, no one knew the storm was heading toward LA. until Fri. night and it hit 48 hrs later.)

No, the point is that those trapped in the city needed food and water to keep from DYING. THAT'S the point! And, what was done to bring in food and water? Well, WalMart was set to bring in some, the 1st Army and other National Guard units were staged and ready, the Red Cross was all set and ready to go into the city.

But, guess what? The Feds said "NO!". Stay the fvck out. And, it's because of THAT that people died by the hundreds, if not the thousands, needlessly.

Ayup. Newt was blaming Clinton about an hour after the attacks.

interesting ...

Why would I care about the Democratic Party? I'm not a member of it. I'm not a member of *any* party. My last political donation was in 2002 and that was $500 to the RNC.

i was referring to others who seem to let one party off the hook all the time, democrat or republican. why do people even belong in a party these days? they are so worthless

Because it's the way it's been done since the beginning of our country. IMO, we need about 5 parties and should go to a parliamentary-style gov't.

Ayup...the Gulf isn't out of the woods yet.

yeeh, the waters may get even warner in the next few years as climate change gets worse and worse. that and other factors could combine and form another category 5 storm.

And, who knows, maybe a Category 6 will one day need to be defined. :Q

 

[1EZduzit]

Originally posted by: BBond
Well, guess where all of this White House bullsh!t that these clones here are repeating is coming from.

Report: Karl Rove Orchestrating PR Campaign Over Relief Effort

In Washington, the Bush White House has responded to the mounting criticism by trying to shift the blame to local and state officials in Louisiana. According to the New York Times, this is part of a coordinated public relations campaign led by President Bush?s chief advisor Karl Rove. The Times reports that in many ways, the unfolding PR campaign reflects the style Rove has brought to the political campaigns he has run for Bush. Meanwhile the Washington Post has been forced to print a retraction after it published as fact a claim sourced to a "senior Bush official" that the relief effort was delayed in part because Louisiana?s Democratic Governor -- Kathleen Blanco never declared a state of emergency. In fact Blanco did just that ? four days before the hurricane hit.

Just click on the Democracy Now! link in my sig and read the Headlines for September 5, 2005 for verification.

GET ROVE!! Hang 'em, hang 'em high.

 

[BBond]

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit

Originally posted by: BBond
Well, guess where all of this White House bullsh!t that these clones here are repeating is coming from.

Report: Karl Rove Orchestrating PR Campaign Over Relief Effort

In Washington, the Bush White House has responded to the mounting criticism by trying to shift the blame to local and state officials in Louisiana. According to the New York Times, this is part of a coordinated public relations campaign led by President Bush?s chief advisor Karl Rove. The Times reports that in many ways, the unfolding PR campaign reflects the style Rove has brought to the political campaigns he has run for Bush. Meanwhile the Washington Post has been forced to print a retraction after it published as fact a claim sourced to a "senior Bush official" that the relief effort was delayed in part because Louisiana?s Democratic Governor -- Kathleen Blanco never declared a state of emergency. In fact Blanco did just that ? four days before the hurricane hit.

Just click on the Democracy Now! link in my sig and read the Headlines for September 5, 2005 for verification.

GET ROVE!! Hang 'em, hang 'em high.

Just drop his freaky a$$ at Abu Ghraib. He'll enjoy it. Especially the photos.

 

[BBond]

I'm wondering how these right wingers here who are now, incredibly, excusing Bush's outright FAILURE to provide aid to 100,000 Americans during a national emergency, SCREAMED about the failure of the French to provide aid during the heat wave of 2003!

What a bunch of hypocrites.

 

[arsbanned]

Originally posted by: raildogg
lovely.

i was actually on the side of these people who are now blaming Bush for everything from oil to this hurricane. no more of that.

yes, Bush's response is not adequate.

the fact that you dont hold the mayor, the governor accountable simply because they are democrats shows you are a partisan animal. they are as much responsible for the failure as Bush is, probably much more responsible. but its ok, only republicans can do faulty things, democrats never make mistakes.

gotcha

I wondered when you would recant.

Originally posted by: BBond
I'm wondering how these right wingers here who are now, incredibly, excusing Bush's outright FAILURE to provide aid to 100,000 Americans during a national emergency, SCREAMED about the failure of the French to provide aid during the heat wave of 2003!

What a bunch of hypocrites.

Easy there, you'll blow a gasket! But yeah, that'd be interesting. Can you dig it up?

 

[Dadofamunky]

Originally posted by: raildogg
yes, okay, i got a bit carried away when i said many Democrats are acting like morons . but really, try not to make the whole party look bad.

What, you mean you actually think there's a GOOD Rethuglican out there?

Originally posted by: raildogg

orrrr ... it may not, since this is America after all. people have really short memories

Naturally, this is exactly what BushCo thrives upon. - people with short memories.

 

[imported_Condor]

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit

Originally posted by: Pabster

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
How many people have died? Brown is "too busy" saving lives to give an estimate? They're going to have to release some estimates, so what are they waiting for. Nagin said 10,000 people and maybe more. That the ones who died, not the ones who survived and needed care. That's massive to say the least.

And how does good old Mayor Nagin explain his city's failure to review (and update) the Hurricane plans for over 5 years? Or the fact that he had over 500 buses at his disposal which could have been used to get people out of NO. Now they're sitting under 10 feet or so of water.

Pray tell me exactly what he should have done?

He could have tried earning his pay as Mayor and city manager!

 

[imported_Condor]

Originally posted by: conjur

Originally posted by: Pabster

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
How many people have died? Brown is "too busy" saving lives to give an estimate? They're going to have to release some estimates, so what are they waiting for. Nagin said 10,000 people and maybe more. That the ones who died, not the ones who survived and needed care. That's massive to say the least.

And how does good old Mayor Nagin explain his city's failure to review (and update) the Hurricane plans for over 5 years? Or the fact that he had over 500 buses at his disposal which could have been used to get people out of NO. Now they're sitting under 10 feet or so of water.

Ah...the ol' magical bus story again.


:roll:

Nothing magic about 500 drowning busses. The least he could have done was to have people drive them out of the city to Baton Rouge to save the busses if he really didn't care to save the people. Do you know how much those things cost?

 

[imported_Condor]

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit

Originally posted by: Pabster

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
Pray tell me exactly what he should have done?

What any sensible person sitting on over 500 buses would have done with a CATEGORY 5 HURRICANE bearing down on his city. Load the people up and move out!

Suppose they were filled and ready to go, suppose you could find enough drivers. Suppose you could even get people that didn't want to leave their homes in the buses.

Where we heading? Who's paying for their motel rooms, food, medical, etc?

New Orleans should have elected the fifteen year old black kid as Mayor. He knew what to do! He commandeered a bus and saved 80 people. That was ONE BUS!

 

[imported_Condor]

Originally posted by: CaptnKirk
The Administration had a Disaster plan, and like all their other plans it worked . . . we've got a Disaster.

My guess is that Conjur will produce a letter from the Governor to FEMA requesting that they send someone to New Orleans to drive the busses out that predates the storm so you libs can whine about how late they were and how all the drowned busses are Bushes fault? Waiting!

 

[imported_Condor]

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit

Originally posted by: Pabster

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
What's a matter? Questions too hard for you?

Quite the opposite. You've yet to answer my questions...

You haven't asked a question except why Nagin didn't bus the people out. I've asked you some questions to determine just how he could have done that, but you seem to have no idea.

Go figure.

You should ask the fifteen year old kid that. Apparantly he knew the answer!

 

[imported_Condor]

Originally posted by: Dadofamunky

Originally posted by: raildogg
yes, okay, i got a bit carried away when i said many Democrats are acting like morons . but really, try not to make the whole party look bad.

What, you mean you actually think there's a GOOD Rethuglican out there?

Originally posted by: raildogg

orrrr ... it may not, since this is America after all. people have really short memories

Naturally, this is exactly what BushCo thrives upon. - people with short memories.

No! What we thrive on is the liberal leaders once getting drunk with power and stumbling off the intellectual high ground. Nasty down here in the mud, isn't it?

 

[trenchfoot]

i'm thinking of writing a novel based on this synopsis....

a president who is propped up by big business gets elected by the supreme court and his brother jethro, then, as a pretense, he gets us to invade aginnistan to pre-position and pre-condition us, and... oh yeah, to "get the terrorist named osimbi". then, the pres. conveniently puts osimbi on the back burner so that he can perpetrate the real reason for getting his feet in the door- invade a neighbor nation of iroque to grab the oil away from those damn colluding europeans and give the oil to his buddy chinny and friends. then he gets re-elected only because you don't change presidents during a war- (a war that is started knowing that very well), and all the while surrounds himself with loyal yes-men and weeds out those that aren't.

then, a hurricane comes calling, the yes-man who knows only how to be a yes-man looks to his pres., pres. looks to his boss chinny and yes-person condomina, they shrug their sholders at each other and yawn, pres. shrugs his sholders to his yes-man, his yes-man shrugs at himself in a mirror. then slowly, the yes-man realizes that he's been tagged as a scapegoat and hits the panic button. he then scratches his head and starts aimlessly delegating. the unfolding horror caused by the yes-man catches pres. and friends by surprize and.........

presto-chango-shazamm-voila!, a hurricane recovery disaster ensues.

*i would write this proposed novel-best-seller in the hopes that all proceeds would go directly to all of those victims who suffered from hurricane katrina*

*edited for political correctness*

 

[Skyclad1uhm1]

Bush is to blame for delaying help, just as much as local, regional and national government is to blame for delaying works on defending that area against such an event. National Geographic had a documentary one year ago saying it wasn't a matter of 'if' a disaster would happen, but 'when'.

 

[CaptnKirk]

Originally posted by: Condor

Originally posted by: CaptnKirk
The Administration had a Disaster plan, and like all their other plans it worked . . . we've got a Disaster.

My guess is that Conjur will produce a letter from the Governor to FEMA requesting that they send someone to New Orleans to drive the busses out that predates the storm so you libs can whine about how late they were and how all the drowned busses are Bushes fault? Waiting!

Hindsight always has a 20 : 20 perspective. The immediate concentration in the few hours preceding the strike was to get personel to 'Shelters of Last Resort' so as not to have them perish in the storm's initial strike. Materials and supplies were grossly andinadequately staged there, as the response was higher than anticipated.
The bulk of the people had made the concious decision to stay put in their dwellings, a fatal error for too many - they didn't even go to the designated shelters.

Do you honestly beleive that the Mayor, Governor, President, or any other official knew for a fact where each and every peice of equipment was located, and what condidtion it was in before . . and during the unfolding hours of this event ? It's really easy to look over satellite reconisance pictures and say 'Look what was left here and there, but that does not make them avalible before the situation, just because we know locations after the fact.

There was no guarantee anywhere in the town that anything would survive the storm, period.

The political focus has been on New Orleans, where a 'Blame the Victim' crusade is underway, but why wasn't the same emphisis placed on getting people out of the 'Other' hundred miles of the strike zone, from Slidell to Mobile Bay. They have had large sectors of the population stay in place as well, and their cities and towns are just plain gone.

We've got too much cleaning up to do to waste time pointing fingers at what might have been, people continue to perish.

 

[Red Dawn]

It doesn't seem like anybody or any organizations response was adequate. Do you think it may have something to do with this catastrophe being unprecedented in the history of our country? (I do)

 

[BBond]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn
It doesn't seem like anybody or any organizations response was adequate. Do you think it may have something to do with this catastrophe being unprecedented in the history of our country? (I do)

It doesn't take five days to get the first bottle of water to people who are dying of thirst, the first MRE to people dying from hunger.

There is simply NO excuse for the complete lack of aid FIVE DAYS after Hurricane Katrina.