CA Senate Approves Resolution Opposing Prop 8

[Mr. Lennon]

http://latimesblogs.latimes.co...3/just-days-befor.html

Sen. Mark Leno (D-San Francisco) said the initiative is a fundamental revision to the document, not an amendment, and therefore required deliberation by the Legislature and a two-thirds vote of both houses to put it on the ballot.

"Do we have a constitutional democracy in California, or do we have mob rule?" Leno asked his colleagues before the 18-14 vote approved the resolution.



Finally our government doing something right. Prop 8 is immoral and illegal and I'm glad some of our politicians are fighting to stop this thing from illegally revising the CA constitution.

Ahh I can't wait to see the faces on some of the gay hating bible bangers I know when this prop gets thrown out the window. It will be thrown out, I guarantee it.

 

[JS80]

Originally posted by: Zeppelin2282
http://latimesblogs.latimes.co...3/just-days-befor.html

Sen. Mark Leno (D-San Francisco) said the initiative is a fundamental revision to the document, not an amendment, and therefore required deliberation by the Legislature and a two-thirds vote of both houses to put it on the ballot.

"Do we have a constitutional democracy in California, or do we have mob rule?" Leno asked his colleagues before the 18-14 vote approved the resolution.



Finally our government doing something right. Prop 8 is immoral and illegal and I'm glad some of our politicians are fighting to stop this thing from illegally revising the CA constitution.

Ahh I can't wait to see the faces on some of the gay hating bible bangers I know when this prop gets thrown out the window. It will be thrown out, I guarantee it.

Yup, those black and hispanic democratic voters are all gay hating bible bangers!

 

[glenn1]

While I don't support Prop 8 either and would just as soon see gays marry (or better yet, the state only issue "civil unions" to all, gay and straight alike and get out of the marriage business), doing it this way is likely to cause a political firestorm and ultimately delay the day when gay marriage is accepted by the majority of the population as well as by law.

 

[Mr. Lennon]

Originally posted by: JS80

Originally posted by: Zeppelin2282
http://latimesblogs.latimes.co...3/just-days-befor.html

Sen. Mark Leno (D-San Francisco) said the initiative is a fundamental revision to the document, not an amendment, and therefore required deliberation by the Legislature and a two-thirds vote of both houses to put it on the ballot.

"Do we have a constitutional democracy in California, or do we have mob rule?" Leno asked his colleagues before the 18-14 vote approved the resolution.



Finally our government doing something right. Prop 8 is immoral and illegal and I'm glad some of our politicians are fighting to stop this thing from illegally revising the CA constitution.

Ahh I can't wait to see the faces on some of the gay hating bible bangers I know when this prop gets thrown out the window. It will be thrown out, I guarantee it.

Yup, those black and hispanic democratic voters are all gay hating bible bangers!

That is very true. Blacks and Hispanics are easily the biggest homophobes around.I feel bad for any black/hispanic homosexual trying to come out of the closet. Most of them are shunned and beaten by their families/friends.

 

[Double Trouble]

Heheheh... typical. Democracy only as long as we like the outcome of the vote. If we don't, then hell, there must have been something wrong and it must be repealed immediately!

 

[bozack]

just another example of govt stepping in and overturning the will of the people....say what you want about right or wrong but the fact is the people voted and now their will is being ignored, then again MA did it how many times so all I can say is no big surprise.

 

[bozack]

Originally posted by: Double Trouble
Heheheh... typical. Democracy only as long as we like the outcome of the vote. If we don't, then hell, there must have been something wrong and it must be repealed immediately!

Yup.

 

[Phokus]

Originally posted by: JS80

Originally posted by: Zeppelin2282
http://latimesblogs.latimes.co...3/just-days-befor.html

Sen. Mark Leno (D-San Francisco) said the initiative is a fundamental revision to the document, not an amendment, and therefore required deliberation by the Legislature and a two-thirds vote of both houses to put it on the ballot.

"Do we have a constitutional democracy in California, or do we have mob rule?" Leno asked his colleagues before the 18-14 vote approved the resolution.



Finally our government doing something right. Prop 8 is immoral and illegal and I'm glad some of our politicians are fighting to stop this thing from illegally revising the CA constitution.

Ahh I can't wait to see the faces on some of the gay hating bible bangers I know when this prop gets thrown out the window. It will be thrown out, I guarantee it.

Yup, those black and hispanic democratic voters are all gay hating bible bangers!

fivethirtyeight already addressed this... the black/hispanic vote on prop 8 wasn't as big as they made it out to be

 

[Viper GTS]

I'm torn on this one. Prop 8 was a disgrace, but if people really cared they would have been out voting. Or maybe they were, & it truly is the will of the people.

Then again the will of the people might have been segregated schools back in 1954. I don't think many people today would say the SC made the wrong decision on that one, so maybe this is the right move.

My gut says let the population realize they fucked up and fix it themselves, but maybe government intervention is the right choice. Either way I don't live in California so I can't do anything about it. It will certainly be interesting to watch this play out.

Viper GTS

 

[RabidMongoose]

I think that I'm going to watch the arguments. It'll be interesting.

 

[Mr. Lennon]

Originally posted by: bozack
just another example of govt stepping in and overturning the will of the people....say what you want about right or wrong but the fact is the people voted and now their will is being ignored, then again MA did it how many times so all I can say is no big surprise.

Your are dumb and ignorant. People voted on an a ILLEGAL PROPOSITION that shouldn't of even been put on the ballot in the first place.

It is up to the government to decide on minority group rights. Take slavery for example...guess who would might be slaves still if the government didn't step in?

 

[bozack]

Originally posted by: Zeppelin2282

Your are dumb and ignorant. People voted on an a ILLEGAL PROPOSITION that shouldn't of even been put on the ballot in the first place.

It is up to the government to decide on minority group rights. Take slavery for example...guess who would might be slaves still if the government didn't step in?

Ahh yes, so because we disagree I am dumb and ignorant...

Care to point out how the prop was "illegal" and if so why isn't action being taken against the govt for placing it on the ballot in the first place? Seems that this is a pretty grey issue with even the web pundits arguing over whether or not it truly was "illegal" as you claim it to be....but the fact is it went to the people and they voted in favor...

Yet again we have a situation where the govt steps through the legislature and imposes its will over that of the voters. Having seen this happen twice in MA I am not surprised (well three times if one considers casino gambling...but MA twice shot down the will of the ppl to vote on gay marriage)

And nice trying to tie this to slavery...lol

 

[glenn1]

Originally posted by: Zeppelin2282

Originally posted by: bozack
just another example of govt stepping in and overturning the will of the people....say what you want about right or wrong but the fact is the people voted and now their will is being ignored, then again MA did it how many times so all I can say is no big surprise.

Your are dumb and ignorant. People voted on an a ILLEGAL PROPOSITION that shouldn't of even been put on the ballot in the first place.

It is up to the government to decide on minority group rights. Take slavery for example...guess who would might be slaves still if the government didn't step in?

You might want to think about what you're saying before you go calling others dumb. The government doesn't "decide" to do anything - it's an inanimate, incapable of thought or action. The government is of, by, and for the people, a stand-in for the people whose votes you deride and whose opinions you seem to despise.

 

[Eeezee]

Originally posted by: bozack

Originally posted by: Zeppelin2282

Your are dumb and ignorant. People voted on an a ILLEGAL PROPOSITION that shouldn't of even been put on the ballot in the first place.

It is up to the government to decide on minority group rights. Take slavery for example...guess who would might be slaves still if the government didn't step in?

Ahh yes, so because we disagree I am dumb and ignorant...

Care to point out how the prop was "illegal" and if so why isn't action being taken against the govt for placing it on the ballot in the first place?

Like I said, the ballot measure passed because the people voted for it...yet again we have a situation where the govt steps in and imposes its will over that of the voters. Having seen this happen twice in MA I am not surprised (well three times if one considers casino gambling...but MA twice shot down the will of the ppl to vote on gay marriage)

And nice trying to tie this to slavery...lol

If you had bothered to read the OP, you'd already know what the prop was illegal; because it is a fundamental change to the constitution, it required deliberation and a two-thirds vote in both houses before it could legally be put on the ballot.

The prop was not approved by the legislature. It should have never been on the ballot in the first place. That is why you are dumb and ignorant. A proposition simply making it to the ballot does not make it a legal proposition; if everyone voted on nuking your domicile, would you still be pissed off if the government "stepped in" and said "Guys, sorry, this is an illegal proposition. It doesn't count no matter how much you all hate bozack"

 

[bozack]

Originally posted by: Eeezee
If you had bothered to read the OP, you'd already know what the prop was illegal; because it is a fundamental change to the constitution, it required deliberation and a two-thirds vote in both houses before it could legally be put on the ballot.

The prop was not approved by the legislature. It should have never been on the ballot in the first place. That is why you are dumb and ignorant. A proposition simply making it to the ballot does not make it a legal proposition; if everyone voted on nuking your domicile, would you still be pissed off if the government "stepped in" and said "Guys, sorry, this is an illegal proposition. It doesn't count no matter how much you all hate bozack"

Ahh yes, Eeezee, another fairweather liberal comming in to support the cause...

Really, so it took them this long to "figure out" that the prop was "illegal"...or did they just decide that this was the best way to shoot it down and seem somewhat on the level.

Like I said, the Legislature is yet again over-riding the will of the people.

It isn't like this ballot measure was a massive surprise so why didn't they bar it from making it on there in the first place like Massachusetts did TWICE??

Seems like they had hoped the people would vote it down, but after they saw the results they had a serious oh shit moment and now are forced to come in with the power of "the law" to again strike down the voting consituency.

And this has nothing to do with hate, honestly why would I care as I don't live in CA...it is about the will of the people being ignored yet again by an overbearing govt.

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: bozack

Originally posted by: Eeezee
If you had bothered to read the OP, you'd already know what the prop was illegal; because it is a fundamental change to the constitution, it required deliberation and a two-thirds vote in both houses before it could legally be put on the ballot.

The prop was not approved by the legislature. It should have never been on the ballot in the first place. That is why you are dumb and ignorant. A proposition simply making it to the ballot does not make it a legal proposition; if everyone voted on nuking your domicile, would you still be pissed off if the government "stepped in" and said "Guys, sorry, this is an illegal proposition. It doesn't count no matter how much you all hate bozack"

Ahh yes, Eeezee, another fairweather liberal comming in to support the cause...

Really, so it took them this long to "figure out" that the prop was "illegal"...or did they just decide that this was the best way to shoot it down and seem somewhat on the level.

Like I said, the Legislature is yet again over-riding the will of the people.

It isn't like this ballot measure was a massive surprise so why didn't they bar it from making it on there in the first place like Massachusetts did TWICE??

Seems like they had hoped the people would vote it down, but after they saw the results they had a serious oh shit moment and now are forced to come in with the power of "the law" to again strike down the voting consituency.

And this has nothing to do with hate, honestly why would I care as I don't live in CA...it is about the will of the people being ignored yet again by an overbearing govt.

The will of the people would have kept schools segregated, people of color riding in the back of the bus and unable to eat in a lot of restaurants

 

[Harvey]

:thumbsup:

 

[bozack]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn
The will of the people would have kept schools segregated, people of color riding in the back of the bus and unable to eat in a lot of restaurants

So then I am to assume Red that you are all for the govt stomping on the will of the people with careless disregard?

Sorry but the legislature had their chance to step in before the measure even hit the ballot and they took a gamble, one they thought was a sure thing only to find out after the fact that they seriously miscalculated their voting demographic....if that were vegas and it was your life savings then you'd be fucked...but since it is CA and the legislature are a bunch of ninnys, well they can bend the rules to their will it seems....

Even though I disagree with how MA handled it as I still think it should have gone to the people for a vote, it was a lot more "honest" and on the level than how CA is approaching the issue.

 

[Eeezee]

Originally posted by: bozack

Originally posted by: Eeezee
If you had bothered to read the OP, you'd already know what the prop was illegal; because it is a fundamental change to the constitution, it required deliberation and a two-thirds vote in both houses before it could legally be put on the ballot.

The prop was not approved by the legislature. It should have never been on the ballot in the first place. That is why you are dumb and ignorant. A proposition simply making it to the ballot does not make it a legal proposition; if everyone voted on nuking your domicile, would you still be pissed off if the government "stepped in" and said "Guys, sorry, this is an illegal proposition. It doesn't count no matter how much you all hate bozack"

Ahh yes, Eeezee, another fairweather liberal comming in to support the cause...

Really, so it took them this long to "figure out" that the prop was "illegal"...or did they just decide that this was the best way to shoot it down and seem somewhat on the level.

Like I said, the Legislature is yet again over-riding the will of the people.

It isn't like this ballot measure was a massive surprise so why didn't they bar it from making it on there in the first place like Massachusetts did TWICE??

Seems like they had hoped the people would vote it down, but after they saw the results they had a serious oh shit moment and now are forced to come in with the power of "the law" to again strike down the voting consituency.

And this has nothing to do with hate, honestly why would I care as I don't live in CA...it is about the will of the people being ignored yet again by an overbearing govt.

Yes, I'm a fairweather liberal who supports smaller government and a balanced budget. I'm only opposed to you because Republicans are fucking evil megalomaniacs. You represent homophobia and excessive greed, nothing more.

Let me explain this one more time, since it didn't get through your thick skull the first 5 times. The proposition was illegal. If this is really the will of the people, then the people who made this proposition shouldn't have a problem with putting it on the ballot through legal means.

Again, simply putting a proposition on a ballot does not mean that the proposition is legal. If I get a proposition that forces bozack to marry a man, it's an illega proposition, but what if 90% of people vote in favor? Does that make it the will of the people, or does it make it a tyrannical mob?

I suggest you read the Federalist Papers some day. Then maybe you'll realize that this country was based on fair rule, not mob rule.

 

[jpeyton]

Glad to hear it.

I can't imagine this decision will be popular with Mormons, homophobes or bigots.

 

[Eeezee]

Originally posted by: bozack

Originally posted by: Red Dawn
The will of the people would have kept schools segregated, people of color riding in the back of the bus and unable to eat in a lot of restaurants

So then I am to assume Red that you are all for the govt stomping on the will of the people with careless disregard?

If he's a good American, a true patriot, then he would support it in this case. It is not the right of the majority to remove the rights of the minority. That is part of what makes our nation great; that the minority can still have the same rights as the majority even when the majority wants to take them away.

 

[Eeezee]

Originally posted by: jpeyton
Glad to hear it.

I can't imagine this decision will be popular with Mormons, homophobes or bigots.

Considering the California Mormons largely bankrolled the prop and get it on the ballot in the first place, I imagine they're very pissed off right now

 

[bozack]

Originally posted by: Eeezee

Yes, I'm a fairweather liberal who supports smaller government and a balanced budget. I'm only opposed to you because Republicans are fucking evil megalomaniacs. You represent homophobia and excessive greed, nothing more.

Let me explain this one more time, since it didn't get through your thick skull the first 5 times. The proposition was illegal. If this is really the will of the people, then the people who made this proposition shouldn't have a problem with putting it on the ballot through legal means.

Again, simply putting a proposition on a ballot does not mean that the proposition is legal. If I get a proposition that forces bozack to marry a man, it's an illega proposition, but what if 90% of people vote in favor? Does that make it the will of the people, or does it make it a tyrannical mob?

I suggest you read the Federalist Papers some day. Then maybe you'll realize that this country was based on fair rule, not mob rule.

LOL, this is a hoot...

Like I said, if the prop was illegal it wouldn't have made it onto the ballot, the state took a chance and decided to roll the dice and hoped that the people would vote the way they wanted them to...and oops they lost....

MA had the same dilemma and at least the legislature stepped in and said no effing way is that going on the ballot...too bad the meatballs in CA didn't have the same common sense especially if they knew they would balk at the outcome should it not go their way.

And I am all for mob rule if it means going to a polling place and filling in a bubble on a sheet as was in this case...funny how the loonbag liberals always love to throw things around like that to sensationalize the event....the fact is the CA legislature fucked up, and only now, months after the measure was voted on did they come up with a convenient excuse as to why it shouldn't be enforced.

 

[Eeezee]

Originally posted by: bozack

Originally posted by: Red Dawn
The will of the people would have kept schools segregated, people of color riding in the back of the bus and unable to eat in a lot of restaurants

Sorry but the legislature had their chance to step in before the measure even hit the ballot

No, they didn't. It was placed on the ballot using fly-by-night political tactics without approval of a majority of the legislature.

ie it was illegal

Even though I disagree with how MA handled it as I still think it should have gone to the people for a vote, it was a lot more "honest" and on the level than how CA is approaching the issue.

Why is that, because CA is choosing to follow its own laws?

 

[Eeezee]

Originally posted by: bozack

Originally posted by: Eeezee

Yes, I'm a fairweather liberal who supports smaller government and a balanced budget. I'm only opposed to you because Republicans are fucking evil megalomaniacs. You represent homophobia and excessive greed, nothing more.

Let me explain this one more time, since it didn't get through your thick skull the first 5 times. The proposition was illegal. If this is really the will of the people, then the people who made this proposition shouldn't have a problem with putting it on the ballot through legal means.

Again, simply putting a proposition on a ballot does not mean that the proposition is legal. If I get a proposition that forces bozack to marry a man, it's an illega proposition, but what if 90% of people vote in favor? Does that make it the will of the people, or does it make it a tyrannical mob?

I suggest you read the Federalist Papers some day. Then maybe you'll realize that this country was based on fair rule, not mob rule.

LOL, this is a hoot...

Like I said, if the prop was illegal it wouldn't have made it onto the ballot, the state took a chance and decided to roll the dice and hoped that the people would vote the way they wanted them to...and oops they lost....

You clearly have NO idea what you're talking about. Do you even live in CA? Do you have any idea how a proposition gets placed on a ballot? Do you know anything at all, or are you just completely talking out of our ass?

That's a rhetorical question, it's obvious you don't know because you have this delusion that the two thirds of the legislature approved it. If that were the case, we wouldn't be having this discussion.